Messianic Christology

[Intojoy]

7 Awake, O sword, against my shepherd, and against the man that is my fellow, saith Jehovah of hosts: smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered; and I will turn my hand upon the little ones.

Zachariah 13:7

This verse teaches

Messiah will be a God - Man.

Messiah's death would be violent.

Messiah's death would cause the dispersion of Israel.

 

[Intojoy]

1 Behold, I send my messenger, and he shall prepare the way before me: and the Lord, whom ye seek, will suddenly come to his temple; and the messenger of the covenant, whom ye desire, behold, he cometh, saith Jehovah of hosts.

Malachi 3:1

This verse teaches that Messiah will have a forerunner.

 

[Intojoy]

THE WRITINGS

10 and as from the day that I commanded judges to be over my people Israel; and I will subdue all thine enemies. Moreover I tell thee that Jehovah will build thee a house. 11 And it shall come to pass, when thy days are fulfilled that thou must go to be with thy fathers, that I will set up thy seed after thee, who shall be of thy sons; and I will establish his kingdom. 12 He shall build me a house, and I will establish his throne for ever. 13 I will be his father, and he shall be my son: and I will not take my lovingkindness away from him, as I took it from him that was before thee; 14 but I will settle him in my house and in my kingdom for ever; and his throne shall be established for ever.

II Chronicles 17:10b - 14

This passage teaches that

Messiah will be a son of David descended from a different line than Jechoniah.

Since all tribal and genealogical records were destroyed with temple in 70 AD, Messiah had to come before that time.

Messiah would live eternally.

Messiah would be a king.

 

[Intojoy]

7 I will tell of the decree:
Jehovah said unto me, Thou art my son;
This day have I begotten thee.
8 Ask of me, and I will give thee the nations for thine inheritance,
And the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession.
9 Thou shalt break them with a rod of iron;
Thou shalt dash them in pieces like a potter’s vessel.
10 Now therefore be wise, O ye kings:
Be instructed, ye judges of the earth.
11 Serve Jehovah with fear,
And rejoice with trembling.
12 Kiss the son, lest he be angry, and ye perish in the way,
For his wrath will soon be kindled.
Blessed are all they that take refuge in him.

Psalm 2:7-12

This passage teaches that

Messiah would be the Son of God.

Messiah will be a king in Jerusalem.

Messiah will also rule over the Gentiles.

 

[Intojoy]

1 Preserve me, O God; for in thee do I take refuge.
2 O my soul, thou hast said unto Jehovah, Thou art my Lord:
I have no good beyond thee.
3 As for the saints that are in the earth,
They are the excellent in whom is all my delight.
4 Their sorrows shall be multiplied that give gifts for another god:
Their drink-offerings of blood will I not offer,
Nor take their names upon my lips.
5 Jehovah is the portion of mine inheritance and of my cup:
Thou maintainest my lot.
6 The lines are fallen unto me in pleasant places;
Yea, I have a goodly heritage.
7 I will bless Jehovah, who hath given me counsel;
Yea, my heart instructeth me in the night seasons.
8 I have set Jehovah always before me:
Because he is at my right hand, I shall not be moved.
9 Therefore my heart is glad, and my glory rejoiceth:
My flesh also shall dwell in safety.
10 For thou wilt not leave my soul to Sheol;
Neither wilt thou suffer thy holy one to see corruption.
11 Thou wilt show me the path of life:
In thy presence is fulness of joy;
In thy right hand there are pleasures for evermore.

Psalm16

This passage teaches that

Messiah would enjoy a unique relationship with God the Father. This aspect of Messiah's life is particularly brought out by the Gospel of John.

Messiah would die.

Messiah would be raised back to life.

 

[Intojoy]

For the Chief Musician; set to Aijaleth hash-Shahar. A Psalm of David.

1 My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?
Why art thou so far from helping me, and from the words of my groaning?
2 O my God, I cry in the daytime, but thou answerest not;
And in the night season, and am not silent.
3 But thou art holy,
O thou that inhabitest the praises of Israel.
4 Our fathers trusted in thee:
They trusted, and thou didst deliver them.
5 They cried unto thee, and were delivered:
They trusted in thee, and were not put to shame.
6 But I am a worm, and no man;
A reproach of men, and despised of the people.
7 All they that see me laugh me to scorn:
They shoot out the lip, they shake the head, saying,
8 Commit thyself unto Jehovah;
Let him deliver him:
Let him rescue him, seeing he delighteth in him.
9 But thou art he that took me out of the womb;
Thou didst make me trust when I was upon my mother’s breasts.
10 I was cast upon thee from the womb;
Thou art my God since my mother bare me.
11 Be not far from me; for trouble is near;
For there is none to help.
12 Many bulls have compassed me;
Strong bulls of Bashan have beset me round.
13 They gape upon me with their mouth,
As a ravening and a roaring lion.
14 I am poured out like water,
And all my bones are out of joint:
My heart is like wax;
It is melted within me.
15 My strength is dried up like a potsherd;
And my tongue cleaveth to my jaws;
And thou hast brought me into the dust of death.
16 For dogs have compassed me:
A company of evil-doers have inclosed me;
They pierced my hands and my feet.
17 I may count all my bones.
They look and stare upon me;
18 They part my garments among them,
And upon my vesture do they cast lots.
19 But be not thou far off, O Jehovah:
O thou my succor, haste thee to help me.
20 Deliver my soul from the sword,
My darling from the power of the dog.
21 Save me from the lion’s mouth;
Yea, from the horns of the wild-oxen thou hast answered me.
22 I will declare thy name unto my brethren:
In the midst of the assembly will I praise thee.
23 Ye that fear Jehovah, praise him;
All ye the seed of Jacob, glorify him;
And stand in awe of him, all ye the seed of Israel.
24 For he hath not despised nor abhorred the affliction of the afflicted;
Neither hath he hid his face from him;
But when he cried unto him, he heard.
25 Of thee cometh my praise in the great assembly:
I will pay my vows before them that fear him.
26 The meek shall eat and be satisfied;
They shall praise Jehovah that seek after him:
Let your heart live for ever.
27 All the ends of the earth shall remember and turn unto Jehovah;
And all the kindreds of the nations shall worship before thee.
28 For the kingdom is Jehovah’s;
And he is the ruler over the nations.
29 All the fat ones of the earth shall eat and worship:
All they that go down to the dust shall bow before him,
Even he that cannot keep his soul alive.
30 A seed shall serve him;
It shall be told of the Lord unto the next generation.
31 They shall come and shall declare his righteousness
Unto a people that shall be born, that he hath done it.

Psalm 22

This passage teaches that

In extreme agony Messiah would cry out for God's help.

Messiah would be a despised and rejected individual.

The Messiah's bones would all be pulled out of joint.

The Messiah's heart would rupture.

Messiah would suffer an extreme degree of thirst.

Messiah's hands and feet would be pierced.

Messiah's clothing would be divided by casting of lots.

At the point of death Messiah's trust would be in God the Father.

Messiah would be resurrected.

 

[Intojoy]

17 Let thy hand be upon the man of thy right hand,
Upon the son of man whom thou madest strong for thyself.

Psalm 80:17

This verse teaches

Messiah would be seated at the right hand of God the Father.

Messiah must be equal to the Father to sit at God the Father's right hand therefore Messiah must be both God and man.

 

[Intojoy]

A Psalm of David.
1 Jehovah saith unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand,
Until I make thine enemies thy footstool.
2 Jehovah will send forth the rod of thy strength out of Zion:
Rule thou in the midst of thine enemies.
3 Thy people offer themselves willingly
In the day of thy power, in holy array:
Out of the womb of the morning
Thou hast the dew of thy youth.
4 Jehovah hath sworn, and will not repent:
Thou art a priest for ever
After the order of Melchizedek.
5 The Lord at thy right hand
Will strike through kings in the day of his wrath.
6 He will judge among the nations,
He will fill the places with dead bodies;
He will strike through the head in many countries.
7 He will drink of the brook in the way:
Therefore will he lift up the head.

Psalm 110

This psalm teaches

Messiah would be both king and priest, after the order of Melchizadek.

Messiah would have to be both God and man. To be priest He would have to be man but to sit at the right hand of God He would have to be equal with God.

Messiah's first coming would be rejected.

After Messiah was rejected, He would ascend into heaven.

After His ascension Messiah would sit down at God's right hand.

Messiah will return when Israel accepts Him.

Messiah will rule over Israel in the Messianic Kingdom.

 

[Intojoy]

4 Who hath ascended up into heaven, and descended?
Who hath gathered the wind in his fists?
Who hath bound the waters in his garment?
Who hath established all the ends of the earth?
What is his name, and what is his son’s name, if thou knowest?

Proverbs 30:4

This verse teaches

Messiah would be uniquely the Son of God.

 

[Intojoy]

24 Seventy weeks are decreed upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most holy. 25 Know therefore and discern, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the anointed one, the prince, shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: it shall be built again, with street and moat, even in troublous times. 26 And after the threescore and two weeks shall the anointed one be cut off, and shall have nothing: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and even unto the end shall be war; desolations are determined. 27 And he shall make a firm covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease; and upon the wing of abominations shall come one that maketh desolate; and even unto the full end, and that determined, shall wrath be poured out upon the desolate.

Daniel 9:24-27

This passage teaches that

Messiah would be present 483 after the decree to rebuild Jerusalem.

Media would be legally executed.

Messiahs death would result in the destruction of the Temple and Jerusalem.

Messiah's birth and death therefore had to have taken place before AD 70.

 

[Intojoy]

Selah

 

[Timothy Bryce]

After skimming over this thread, I think I've come to a conclusion.

We're all our own messiahs. Looking for a messiah anywhere outside of ourselves is a waste of time and a rejection of personal responsibility.

 

[Intojoy]

After skimming over this thread, I think I've come to a conclusion.

We're all our own messiahs. Looking for a messiah anywhere outside of ourselves is a waste of time and a rejection of personal responsibility.

Merry Christmas

 

[Tumah]

All of the prophecies concerning the Messianic Person will be listed for the purpose of showing that Yeshua's (Jesus) claim to be the Anointed One are provable.

Reading the following posts, its hard to imagine you understand what the word "provable" means.

THE LAW

and I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed: he shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

Gen 3:15

This passage teaches that the Messiah will come thru humanity.

As you will notice in the entire Genesis chapter 3, the word 'Messiah' is not mentioned even once. The only way to read a Messiah into this verse is by squeezing it in yourself.
This passage doesn't prove anything about the Messiah.

18 and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice. Gen 22:18

This verse teaches that

the Seed of the Woman will be limited as a descendant of Abraham, Messiah will be a Jew.

This verse makes no mention about the seed of woman. Nor about constraining her seed to Abraham. Which makes sense since all people are the first woman's seed. That's not the type of thing you can change.
This verse doesn't prove anything about the Messiah.

10 The sceptre shall not depart from Judah,
Nor the ruler’s staff from between his feet,
Until Shiloh come;
And unto him shall the obedience of the peoples be.
Gen 49:10

This passage teaches

the Seed of the Woman and the Seed of Abraham is now limited to being of the specific tribe of Judah.

Messiah will be a king.

Messiah had to come before AD 70.

This verse makes no mention about any seed altogether. Do what you're saying is ridiculous. All its saying is that the tribe of Judah will be kings.
The only thing this verse proves is that if the Messiah is meant to be a king, he will come from the tribe of Judah.

17 I see him, but not now;
I behold him, but not nigh:
There shall come forth a star out of Jacob,
And a sceptre shall rise out of Israel,
And shall smite through the corners of Moab,
And break down all the sons of tumult.
Numbers 24:17

This passage teaches

that the Messiah is to be a king.

No. This passage teaches that a certain king will smite Moab. The king being David. See 2 Sam. 8:2
This verse proves nothing about the Messiah.

 

[Tumah]

15 Jehovah thy God will raise up unto thee a prophet from the midst of thee, of thy brethren, like unto me; unto him ye shall hearken; 16 according to all that thou desiredst of Jehovah thy God in Horeb in the day of the assembly, saying, Let me not hear again the voice of Jehovah my God, neither let me see this great fire any more, that I die not. 17 And Jehovah said unto me, They have well said that which they have spoken. 18 I will raise them up a prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee; and I will put my words in his mouth, and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him. 19 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him.
Deut 18:15-19

This passages teaches

that the Messiah will be a prophet.

Not having mentioned anything about the Messiah, the only thing this verse proves is that G-d will raise up a prophet. And He did multiple times. We call them the "Prophets". What with Joshua being a prophet who spoke G-d's words (which is what prophets do), he was the first to fulfill this verse.

This verse proves nothing about the Messiah.

THE PROPHETS

14 Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.
Isaiah 7:14

This verse teaches that

Messiah would be born of a girl who is still a virgin the explanation of Gen 3:15

Messiah will be the God Man

Messiah will be a king

Messiah will have to come before AD 70

The correct translation is "behold a young woman shall conceive". Obviously a prophecy about the Messiah would not be relevant to Ahaz. Nor would a prophecy about a messiah who wouldn't be born in his own time be a very effective sign for Ahaz. So this verse is obviously not about the Messiah. Nor does it mention anything about a God Man or king or best-if-used-by date.

This verse proves nothing about the Messiah.

Make an uproar, O ye peoples, and be broken in pieces; and give ear, all ye of far countries: gird yourselves, and be broken in pieces; gird yourselves, and be broken in pieces. 10 Take counsel together, and it shall be brought to nought; speak the word, and it shall not stand: for God is with us.
Isaiah 8:9-10

Verse 10 literally reads: and it shall not stand because of Immanuel.The real impact of what's being said here gets lost because of the translation of the meaning of the name God with us rather than Immanuel. What this is saying is that God will preserve the house of David because of the Covenant God made with David of an eternal dynasty. Because of the AD 70 destruction of the Jewish temple all of the genealogical records have been lost so it would be impossible to trace the Davidic line after AD 70.

This passage teaches that Messiah must come before the 70 AD destruction of the temple.

In order to read it that way, you'd be making the last two words into a sentence fragment. The word "כי (because)" is not the proper word to make it say what you want it to say, it would need to use the word "מפני (because of)" or perhaps, "בעבור (because of)". So the only way to read it, is "because G-d is with us". Its a play on the name "Emanu El". Get it?
So what its actually saying is that G-d is with us.

6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given; and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace. 7 Of the increase of his government and of peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to establish it, and to uphold it with justice and with righteousness from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of Jehovah of hosts will perform this.
Isaiah 9:6-7

This passage teaches that

Messiah will be king

Messiah will be God and Man

Messiah must come before AD 70 to fulfill the Davidic Covenant and because of the destruction of the Temple.

Since the verse makes no mention that it is a prophecy about a Messiah, and since this is a prophecy that would need to hold some meaning as a sign for Ahaz, we can safely determine that this verse is not about a Messiah, but about someone who lived around the time of Ahaz's reign.

This verse does not prove anything about the Messiah.

The voice of one that crieth, Prepare ye (ye: third person, plural, command ie. you guys should prepare..) in the wilderness the way of Jehovah; make level (make level: third person, plural, command ie. you guys should make level...) in the desert a highway for our God. 4 Every valley shall be exalted, and every mountain and hill shall be made low; and the uneven shall be made level, and the rough places a plain: 5 and the glory of Jehovah shall be revealed, and all flesh shall see it together; for the mouth of Jehovah hath spoken it.
Isaiah 40:3-5

This passage teaches that Messiah

Will have a forerunner.

This verse makes no mention of a forerunner. In fact its someone (presumably the prophet) speaking to multiple people. I've added the grammatical constructs meaning to your post. It seems this passage is telling people to prepare themselves for the arrival of G-d. Nothing about the Messiah.

This passage proves nothing about the Messiah.

 

[Tumah]

1 Behold, my servant, whom I uphold; my chosen, in whom my soul delighteth: I have put my Spirit upon him; he will bring forth justice to the Gentiles. 2 He will not cry, nor lift up his voice, nor cause it to be heard in the street. 3 A bruised reed will he not break, and a dimly burning wick will he not quench: he will bring forth justice in truth. 4 He will not fail nor be discouraged, till he have set justice in the earth; and the isles shall wait for his law. 5 Thus saith God Jehovah, he that created the heavens, and stretched them forth; he that spread abroad the earth and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein: 6 I, Jehovah, have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thy hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;
Isaiah 42:1-6

This passage teaches

Messiah would be anointed by the Holy Spirit

Messiah would conduct Himself in meekness and gentleness

Although Messiahs mission would appear to end in failure it would in fact be a complete success. The success of His ministry actually required His death.

Messiah's mission includes Gentile salvation.

Considering Isaiah 41:8 already explicitly states that the reference "My servant" refers to Israel, we can safely conclude that this passage isn't about the Messiah, but about Israel.
This passage proves nothing about the Messiah.

1 Listen, O isles, unto me; and hearken, ye peoples, from far: Jehovah hath called me from the womb; from the bowels of my mother hath he made mention of my name: 2 and he hath made my mouth like a sharp sword; in the shadow of his hand hath he hid me: and he hath made me a polished shaft; in his quiver hath he kept me close: 3 and he said unto me, Thou art my servant; Israel, in whom I will be glorified.
Isaiah 49:1-3

This passage teaches that

Messiah's first coming would be rejected by Israel .

For a time the message of salvation thru Messiah will go out to the Gentiles.

Eventually Israel will receive Messiah; He will be their new covenant.

Israel's acceptance of Messiah will herald the re-gathering of all Jews to the land of Israel.

I'm not sure if you realized it or not, but the prophecies in Isaiah are spoken by... Isaiah. You see, when someone is speaking and he says, "me" he is referring to himself. The "me" here is Isaiah.
This passage proves nothing about the Messiah.

13 Behold, my servant shall deal wisely, he shall be exalted and lifted up, and shall be very high. 14 Like as many were astonished at thee (his visage was so marred more than any man, and his form more than the sons of men), 15 so shall he sprinkle many nations; kings shall shut their mouths at him: for that which had not been told them shall they see; and that which they had not heard shall they understand.
1 Who hath believed our message? and to whom hath the arm of Jehovah been revealed? 2 For he grew up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him. 3 He was despised, and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and as one from whom men hide their face he was despised; and we esteemed him not. 4 Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows; yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted. 5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities; the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed. 6 All we like sheep have gone astray; we have turned every one to his own way; and Jehovah hath laid on him the iniquity of us all. 7 He was oppressed, yet when he was afflicted he opened not his mouth; as a lamb that is led to the slaughter, and as a sheep that before its shearers is dumb, so he opened not his mouth. 8 By oppression and judgment he was taken away; and as for his generation, who among them considered that he was cut off out of the land of the living for the transgression of my people to whom the stroke was due? 9 And they made his grave with the wicked, and with a rich man in his death; although he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth. 10 Yet it pleased Jehovah to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of Jehovah shall prosper in his hand. 11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by the knowledge of himself shall my righteous servant justify many; and he shall bear their iniquities. 12 Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he poured out his soul unto death, and was numbered with the transgressors: yet he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.
Isaiah 52:13 - 53:13

This passage teaches

Messiah would be born of natural circumstances with no unusual characteristics.

Messiah's first coming would be marked with suffering.

Messiah's first coming would be rejected.

Messiah would undergo a legal trial and be condemned to death.

Messiah would be executed.

Messiah would be buried in a rich man's tomb.

Messiah would be resurrected.

All of the Messiahs suffering and death were to be substitutionary. He died so that we may have life. He died so that our sins could be removed from us. He died so that we may enter into a new relationship with God.

Messiah would bring justification to all who believe in Him.

As before, the phrase "My servant" has already been explained as referring to Israel.

This verse proves nothing about the Messiah.

1 The Spirit of the Lord Jehovah is upon me; because Jehovah hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the broken-hearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound; 2 to proclaim the year of Jehovah’s favor, and the day of vengeance of our God; to comfort all that mourn; 3 to appoint unto them that mourn in Zion, to give unto them a garland for ashes, the oil of joy for mourning, the garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness; that they may be called trees of righteousness, the planting of Jehovah, that he may be glorified.
Isaiah 61:1-3

This passage teaches

Messiah would be anointed by the Spirit for His mission.

Messiah would have a prophetic preaching
ministry.

Its important when reading a book, any book, that we attribute to the speaker, the things the speaker says about himself. We don't have to believe what he says about himself. But we need to be aware when he is speaking about himself. In English we have two words for whom this is their function, they are "I and me"".
"I did that."
"He said to me."
In this case, since Isaiah is the prophet speaking these prophecies, and he says, "The Spirit of Jehovah is upon me", we can conclusively say that Isaiah is saying that the Spirit of Jehovah was upon him. Try this practice and see how it works for you:
1. Find another person
2. Say to him/her "The Spirit of Jehovah is upon me."
3. Ask him/her the following question "who was it I just said the Spirit of Jehovah is on?"
4 Ignore and repeat question. Include the words "No really," at the beginning of the question.

So you see, this passage proves nothing about the Messiah.

 

[Intojoy]

Considering Isaiah 41:8 already explicitly states that the reference "My servant" refers to Israel, we can safely conclude that this passage isn't about the Messiah, but about Israel.
This passage proves nothing about the Messiah.


I'm not sure if you realized it or not, but the prophecies in Isaiah are spoken by... Isaiah. You see, when someone is speaking and he says, "me" he is referring to himself. The "me" here is Isaiah.
This passage proves nothing about the Messiah.


As before, the phrase "My servant" has already been explained as referring to Israel.

This verse proves nothing about the Messiah.


Its important when reading a book, any book, that we attribute to the speaker, the things the speaker says about himself. We don't have to believe what he says about himself. But we need to be aware when he is speaking about himself. In English we have two words for whom this is their function, they are "I and me"".
"I did that."
"He said to me."
In this case, since Isaiah is the prophet speaking these prophecies, and he says, "The Spirit of Jehovah is upon me", we can conclusively say that Isaiah is saying that the Spirit of Jehovah was upon him. Try this practice and see how it works for you:
1. Find another person
2. Say to him/her "The Spirit of Jehovah is upon me."
3. Ask him/her the following question "who was it I just said the Spirit of Jehovah is on?"
4 Ignore and repeat question. Include the words "No really," at the beginning of the question.

So you see, this passage proves nothing about the Messiah.

Isaiah did not preach peace, he preached judgement his commission is found here:

“And he said, Go, and tell this people, Hear ye indeed, but understand not; and see ye indeed, but perceive not. Make the heart of this people fat, and make their ears heavy, and shut their eyes; lest they see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and understand with their heart, and turn again, and be healed. Then said I, Lord, how long? And he answered, Until cities be waste without inhabitant, and houses without man, and the land become utterly waste, and Jehovah have removed men far away, and the forsaken places be many in the midst of the land. And if there be yet a tenth in it, it also shall in turn be eaten up: as a terebinth, and as an oak, whose stock remaineth, when they are felled; so the holy seed is the stock thereof.”
‭‭Isaiah‬ ‭6:9-13‬ ‭ASV‬‬
http://bible.com/12/isa.6.9-13.asv

 

[Intojoy]

Reading the following posts, its hard to imagine you understand what the word "provable" means.


As you will notice in the entire Genesis chapter 3, the word 'Messiah' is not mentioned even once. The only way to read a Messiah into this verse is by squeezing it in yourself.
This passage doesn't prove anything about the Messiah.


This verse makes no mention about the seed of woman. Nor about constraining her seed to Abraham. Which makes sense since all people are the first woman's seed. That's not the type of thing you can change.
This verse doesn't prove anything about the Messiah.


This verse makes no mention about any seed altogether. Do what you're saying is ridiculous. All its saying is that the tribe of Judah will be kings.
The only thing this verse proves is that if the Messiah is meant to be a king, he will come from the tribe of Judah.


No. This passage teaches that a certain king will smite Moab. The king being David. See 2 Sam. 8:2
This verse proves nothing about the Messiah.

Forgive me. But I am told that there is a law in Hebrew grammar, something to do with the "first mention" I only heard this a couple times (not enough to sink in) but it had to do with Isaiah's virgin will conceive passage. Since there is no virgin mentioned in Isaiah in the immediate context of his book, I'm told that the reader goes to the nearest first mentioned virgin or more clearly a woman who's giving birth will be miraculous and will be a sign. I suppose you could argue for Sarah as being a miracle too. But I am pointing at Eve who's seed would crush the evil one.

My evidence is based on the biblical Jewish reckoning after the father and not the mother. Yet Moses records that this son would be reckoned after the woman and not the man. There is no explanation for this until Isaiah gives his prophecies including the Branch of Jehovah, the Servant of Jehovah named Emmanuel.

 

[Intojoy]

I'm told that in Hebrew there is a differentiation of terms for "you" and it is used by Isaiah who switches from the sign to you Ahaz to the sign to "you all" to Israel the nation.

 

[Intojoy]

Also interesting is that I learned that Isaiah is a master of the Hebrew language using words only found in his book and nowhere else in scripture. And that the entire book is written in Hebrew poetic form (parallelism) except for the last three chapters.

No wonder so many Christians miss much of what Isaiah is saying.