What is your suggested date and the date suggested by skeptics that are given for the bible?
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Looking for a debate with creationists (I am an atheist)
- Thread starter Sean1843
- Start date
BilliardsBall
Veteran Member
For an example, Moses wrote the Penteteuch circa 1400 BCE, some scholars have the Torah written barely two centuries before Christ, which can be shown to be nonsense.
I've never heard of those scholars who dates the Torah to be only 2 centuries before Christ, nor did I hear of archeological finds supporting Moses writing it circa 1400 bce.
ecco
Veteran Member
Nor have I heard anything supporting an actual Moses.
BilliardsBall
Veteran Member
I didn't say 2 centuries, the Dead Sea Scrolls predate that time, and they are COPIES of the documents.
There are certainly archaeological studies verifying older, conservative dates for the books of the OT.
Jesuslightoftheworld
The world has nothing to offer us!
Skip Pssaris- What you aren’t being told about astronomy (Our created universe)
Was this meant to link to something?
Jesuslightoftheworld
The world has nothing to offer us!
Evolutionists claim then that the universe was created by the Big Bang theory. Even child knows you can’t make something out of nothing.
Astrophile
Active Member
His name is actually Spike Psarris. I've looked at one of his videos; it was enough to convince me that he is a charlatan.
Creation from a fundamentalist Christian position is based on a literal interpretation of the biblical Genesis. Sound and successful attempts have been made refuting a literal interpretation of events outlined in that book citing the two different oral traditions that comprise the contradictory accounts of Genesis, chapters 1 as 2, and other misplaced elements like plants existing before the sun, Further the existence of a fossil record is compelling evidence that clearly eliminates the idea of living things suddenly appearing fully formed as they exist today, without a record of any precursors. Utilizing physical principles and established rates of change in a number of elements and applying that to geologic strata has provided a solid chronology for events as they are revealed in those strata. Utilizing these techniques and observations of fosils, geologists and paleontologists have determined the age of the Earth and the point in the record where they is no evidence of life followed by more recent strata where the evidence of life exists. This fossil evidence reveals a clear progression over time starting with relatively simple forms like bacteria and progressing to more complex forms over time as more and more recent strata are examined.
Well, I could go on outlining all the established techniques, the millions of observations, the accumulating mass of reason and evidence that no one person with a lifetime of study can know with completeness, but why bother.
The prevailing creationist philosophy is that no amount of evidence will ever convince them. That what they, like any person, can identify with their senses, should be ignored and reliance on dogma should prevail.
How can you really refute that?
Evolution and cosmology are 2 distinct subjects
There are many hypothesis of how the BB occured, each is either mathematically or physically possible.
I know 28 of them, only a couple say the universe was made from nothing. Here is one
Spontaneous creation of the universe from nothing
So it seems adults know different
But feel free to deceive yourself on the meaning of evolution
ratiocinator
Lightly seared on the reality grill.
Firstly, evolutionists don't make any claims about the origin of the universe, at least not any that have anything to do with being evolutionists. It is a dishonest misrepresentation of creationists in order to pretend that they are only disagreeing with one aspect of science called "evolution". The people who study the origin and development of the universe are cosmologists.
Secondly, a theory didn't create anything, and the big bang theory is about how the universe developed from a hot dense state about 13 billion years ago. Beyond that, we only have hypotheses.
Thirdly, not knowing how the universe originated or why it exists does not make a creator god any more believable - at best it's a guess made with no evidence, and it doesn't answer that basic question of why things exist anyway. A god that just happens to exist for no known reason, who creates a universe, is no less unexplained and mysterious than just a universe that just happens to exist for no known reason.
Wandering Monk
Well-Known Member
Oh, but God can make something from nothing then? How do you know that?
Jesuslightoftheworld
The world has nothing to offer us!
Because He’s God; omniscient , omnipotent, and omnipresent. He is the Creator. Evolution makes no sense at all. Especially if the basis is the Big Bang theory. I encourage you to watch on YouTube Spike Pssaris: debunking the Big Bang first then What you aren’t being told about astronomy. It’s compelling evidence that evolution cannot work and evolutionist consistently contradict themselves. He is definitely not a charlatan; he’s knowledgeable and convincing, and provides proof on a scientific level.
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
Just because you do not understand science does not mean that it "makes no sense". And evolution is not based on the Big Bang Theory. It appears that you have no knowledge at all of the facts that you do not like. You can link the YouTube videos, but one thing that you should be aware of. Any creationist video of note has been debunked. Most creationist videos admit on their own that they are wrong. They tend to block comments where their errors would be explained to them. They tend to block ratings because of all of the downvotes their ignorance and idiocy causes.
Science is evidence based and there is no scientific evidence for creationism. But then most creationists do not understand either the concept of evidence nor the scientific method.
Audie
Veteran Member
Any child ought to know a theory cannot create anything.
Tnx for not being an "evolutionist", such ignorance
and silliness disgraces anything it touches.
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Wandering Monk
Well-Known Member
How do you know that?
Audie
Veteran Member
ratiocinator
Lightly seared on the reality grill.
Anybody with the slightest knowledge of science knows that the big bang theory is not the basis of evolution. Your claim that "evolution makes no sense at all" can therefore be dismissed on the basis that you clearly haven't the first clue what you are talking about.
Audie
Veteran Member
He did say he wants to know when he is wrong.....