Is The Left Of Politics Fractured?

[Lyndon]

That's my definition, too. What defines someone who is "Far Right"?

That would be you, prime example!! But then I would call anyone that reveres Trump to be far right. He's not left, he's not just right, he's far right.

 

[Salty Booger]

That would be you, prime example!!

Ooh, well, I was a Democrat until several years ago. Does changing my political party make me Far Right?

 

[Salty Booger]

This has created a severely warped mindset on what 'the left' means in the US. And allowed for a lot more extreme right to be seen as the norm.

When you have ANTIFA in the streets as your representatives, more people are going to fall towards, I guess, far right.

 

[Lyndon]

Ooh, well, I was a Democrat until several years ago. Does changing my political party make me Far Right?

That would seem to be where you're coming from, you don't come across as a moderate.

 

[Lyndon]

When you have ANTIFA in the streets as your representatives, more people are going to fall towards, I guess, far right.

Well Trump has the proud boys and the boogaloo bois on his side, if you were to ask the FBI who is the bigger threat, they've already made it quite clear right wing extremists are the bigger threat for terrorism today.

 

[Salty Booger]

That would seem to be where you're coming from, you don't come across as a moderate.

I lost my faith in the Democrat Party when they propped up Hillary as their nomination for president. Now they are foisting Biden. I don't see how I could possibly be considered far right--unless simply disagreeing with the politics of others makes me one.

 

[Lyndon]

Because Hillary and Biden, and Harris are centre right, Trump is far right. Sanders and Warren might be left. but they're not running

 

[Salty Booger]

right wing extremists are the bigger threat for terrorism

Okay. Have the Proud Boys been labeled as such. If so, why are they still on the loose. Enrique Tarrio, the leader of the Proud Boys, strange name for a right wing extremist. Something is adding up here. I have to tell you, they visited my home town and were very peaceful, even cleaned up after themselves before leaving. I much prefer their company over left wing extremists. All they do is beat innocent people, spray paint hate on the city walls, and break store windows (with the occasional theft and looting). Whatcha think.

 

[Stevicus]

Do you think it will show in this coming election?

Possibly not, only because they seem pretty unified in their opposition to Trump. But if and when Trump is defeated, Biden's role may be more that of a "damage control officer." Even if the Democrats wind up controlling the White House and both Houses of Congress, there will still be rivalries, infighting, and disagreement.

 

[Salty Booger]

Possibly not, only because they seem pretty unified in their opposition to Trump. But if and when Trump is defeated, Biden's role may be more that of a "damage control officer." Even if the Democrats wind up controlling the White House and both Houses of Congress, there will still be rivalries, infighting, and disagreement.

Yes, the Republican Congress was of little use to Trump when they were in power. I suppose it depends on what you want from them.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

One major problem is viewing the Left and Right as their own monolithic groups. We're not. They include Liberals, Conservatives and much more. Both sides have their groups and ideologies closer to center, and ideologies that are Far. And when we look at the Far Left into Marxism, we have a very good example of how an ideology itself can be split and fractured into many sub-ideologies.
To say the Left (or Right) is fractured, however, assumes they were fully united to begin with. But, as someone in the Marxist-Libertarian area, I tend to clash with Liberals on social areas to the point they call me Conservatives (Conservatives just call me blasphemous and indecent), and I vehemently disagree with many other forms of Marxism. Communists and Socialists and LW anarchist have also been prone to various levels and sorts of conflict. But we widely don't really like Democrats that much and at odd with Liberal ideology in many areas.
And as for Antifa, they really are more a RW boogeyman than anything.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Possibly not, only because they seem pretty unified in their opposition to Trump. But if and when Trump is defeated, Biden's role may be more that of a "damage control officer." Even if the Democrats wind up controlling the White House and both Houses of Congress, there will still be rivalries, infighting, and disagreement.

As long they aren't insulting each other like juveniles, degrading those with disabilities, recklessly saber rattling, and bragging about sexually assaulting women I do not care. Let them fight - just as long as they don't tweet about it like a little kid.
Then maybe we can actually on being productive instead of testing a century's worth of litmus tests of Constitutional power checks to reduce a president's power. And though I never worried Trump is a dictator or take authoritarian control, I do fear he has set in motion precedence that will make it significantly easier for an autocrat who actually does have ambition and drive (rather than just talk about it).

 

[Friend of Mara]

If the Left side of politics is fractured, in your opinion, who do you blame? The most vocal and most active around here has been these characters.

Perhaps you believe it is a whole. From my perspective it is terribly confusing, so much so that their own candidates don't know how to manage their own constituents.

Your thoughts?

As someone with my political leanings I HOPE that the left is fractured. Its the awakening of disillusioned young people realizing Democrats just aren't actually liberal. They are too afraid to latch onto single payer healthcare or major police reform. So this unrest is the molting process. It will pass. The struggle is the moderate centrists in current power attempting to squash the leftist surges and the leftist are attempting to drag the democratic party kicking and screaming just a few feet to the left.

 

[Samael_Khan]

Okay. Have the Proud Boys been labeled as such. If so, why are they still on the loose. Enrique Tarrio, the leader of the Proud Boys, strange name for a right wing extremist. Something is adding up here. I have to tell you, they visited my home town and were very peaceful, even cleaned up after themselves before leaving. I much prefer their company over left wing extremists. All they do is beat innocent people, spray paint hate on the city walls, and break store windows (with the occasional theft and looting). Whatcha think.

Being a non-American, living outside America, it seems to me that the loudest voices on the left (who I do not think represent the majority of the left) are irrational and have a cult mentality, labelling anybody against them as Fascist or right wing extremist without presenting evidence or quote mining and not looking at the broader context of quotes and situations. They have a black and white mentality and lack any understanding of nuance except when it comes to issues that suit their agenda, such as gender identity.

I would be considered a leftist (possibly leaning towards individual anarchism?) but I would reject the left in America and support the right simply because I see the right as open to dialogue whereas the left is not, and shutting down dialogue, such as shouting down people in universities rather than reasoning with them is a slap in the face of critical thinking. So I consider the indoctrinated left dangerous and way too influential when it comes to the popular opinion.

 

[ChristineM]

How so?

I'm not sure about Antifa. My best guess is that in the US, they'd be considered "radical left", while on a global scale, they'd just be considered "left".

Just about all American political parties and sects are right wing when compared to most other countries. Some a little more right than others.

Although there are a very few individual politicians who can be considered slightly left of centre.

When Americans talk of left wing politics the other 95% of the world population interpret it as centre right.


It is really quite amazing to me that when RF does a political compass thread the vast majority american poster's sit nicely in the left wing libertarian quadrant.

RF-Wide Political Compass

 

[Altfish]

If the Left side of politics is fractured, in your opinion, who do you blame? The most vocal and most active around here has been these characters.

Perhaps you believe it is a whole. From my perspective it is terribly confusing, so much so that their own candidates don't know how to manage their own constituents.

Your thoughts?

The right appear to be able to get behind their candidate at crucial times (eg Trump in '16) but the left seem to stick to their factions and either not voting or speaking out against the chosen candidate.

In the UK, the Labour Party is doing much better but still people are moaning about Starmer not being left enough, I just hope they get their act together for the next GE

 

[Heyo]

That's my definition, too. What defines someone who is "Far Right"?

Nationalism, "small" government, "traditional" family roles, "law and order".

As who is where:

 

[Tambourine]

That's my definition, too. What defines someone who is "Far Right"?

It's a relative term, defined by what ideas are at the center/mainstream of acceptable political discourse.

Overton window - Wikipedia

For the last two decades, US political rhetoric (and Western political speech as a whole, let's be honest) has been steadily shifting rightward, so what we now see as the right-wing end of the spectrum is, by comparison, far nuttier and dangerous than what has been the case only a decade ago

 

[amorphous_constellation]

As someone with my political leanings I HOPE that the left is fractured. Its the awakening of disillusioned young people realizing Democrats just aren't actually liberal. They are too afraid to latch onto single payer healthcare or major police reform. So this unrest is the molting process. It will pass. The struggle is the moderate centrists in current power attempting to squash the leftist surges and the leftist are attempting to drag the democratic party kicking and screaming just a few feet to the left.

Better things cannot be built on a foundation of aggravation, and I consider those who use 'unrest' to actually be far to my right. A good, strong idea does not need screaming. Actions of destruction will not inspire faith in a cause for all that long.

 

[tytlyf]

Please explain. Who are these people in the streets?

The people in the streets has nothing to do with a "left" fracturing. But a democracy fracturing.