• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Is the biblical story of Noah’s Flood a true account?

James the Persian

Dreptcredincios Crestin
Katzpur said:
I think it was true from the perspective of those who experienced it. I'm sure it seemed to them as if the whole earth were covered by water. As far as whether Noah collected two of every kind of animal in the world, that too is probably relative. I'd say it was entirely possible that Noah did take animals aboard the ark, but that it's pretty unlikely he actually rounded up two of every species in existence at that time. Maybe he collected two of all of the animals he was familiar with. I don't know, and it doesn't really matter a whole lot to me. To me it's a story about obedience and trust.

I pretty much agree with Kat (though might I point out that it's not just two of every kind, it's only two for unclean animals, seven of each clean). Whether it's literally true or allegorical would make no difference to my faith at all - there's tons of the Bible that shouldn't be taken literally, and that's not just my position but one you can trace back to the early Church Fathers without dificulty. In my opinion, the storyu as we receive it in the OT is the result of oral transmission of the tale for centuries before it was written down and the typical accretions and exaggerations that tends to create. That doesn't mean that the kernel of the story is not true and nor does it alter its message. The 'dilemma' of the OP (if one bit is not literally true how do we know what's true and false?) only exists for a sola scripturalist in any case. For the 100s of millions of us whose churches actually pre-date the Reformation, and some who don't, this is not an issue at all.

James
 
Katzpur said:
I think it was true from the perspective of those who experienced it. II'm sure it seemed to them as if the whole earth were covered by water.
"Those who experienced it" all died according to the tale, except eight on an ark.

As far as whether Noah collected two of every kind of animal in the world, that too is probably relative.
I agree that biblical statements are "relative" -- so "relative" that they have little meaning, cannot be trusted to be true, and must be "interpreted" by humans.

To me it's a story about obedience and trust.
I agree that the biblical account of the flood is just a made-up story that attempts to convey a "moral" -- not an accounting of actual happenings.
 

MaddLlama

Obstructor of justice
wwlb08 said:
Firstly you have to remember that God - the great creator with whom nothing is impossible - carried out this flood. Do you not think it possible that God could have helped gather the animals to the ark?

Another point that you got wrong is that actually of the clean animals (Gen 2:2) they went in 'by sevens, the male and his female' - meaning that 7 female of one kind and 7 male of the same kind went into the ark. Also of the unclean animals they went in 'by two, the male and his female'. So 2 male and 2 female of the same kind. So that solves the question of survival don't you think?

About the lack of rain before the flood - in Gen 2:5-6 it says '...for the LORD God had not caused it rain upon the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground. But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground.' So it is possible that this mist continued until the flood to water the ground. This would also explain why so many people just ignored Noah when he told them that God said he was going to flood the earth. If they had never even had rain before imagine how they would view the idea of enough rain falling to flood the earth!

The ark that they made was huge. It was huge for a reason...to fit thousands/millions of animals into it! God knew how many animals were to go into the ark, that is why he could give Noah the specific directions how he should build it so they would fit!

I know it can seem something difficult to comprehend but I still believe that with the most powerful being behind the flood, how can we doubt that it is possible?

How did Noah manage to gather and redistribute animals in their proper places? There are some animals that only exist on island continents far far from the Middle East. How did he get the marsupials back to Austraila? How did he get the Kiwi back to New Zeland? How did he get those animals on the boat in the first place?
 

sandy whitelinger

Veteran Member
Like the energizer bunny it keeps going and going and going.... when someone changes their mind one way or the other on this issue please let us know.
 

may

Well-Known Member
For just as the days of Noah were, so the presence of the Son of man will be. 38 For as they were in those days before the flood, eating and drinking, men marrying and women being given in marriage, until the day that Noah entered into the ark; 39 and they took no note until the flood came and swept them all away, so the presence of the Son of man will be. matthew 24;37-39...................Jesus believed in the flood and he always told the truth.

How​
Did Other Bible Writers View the Flood?

In addition to the Genesis account, there are many references to Noah or the Deluge in the Bible. For example:
(1) The researcher Ezra included Noah and his sons (Shem, Ham, and Japheth) in the genealogy of the nation of Israel.—1 Chronicles 1:4-17.
(2) The physician and Gospel writer Luke includes Noah when listing the ancestors of Jesus Christ.—Luke 3:36.
(3) The apostle Peter draws heavily on the Flood account in writing to fellow Christians.—2 Peter 2:5; 3:5, 6.
(4) The apostle Paul speaks of the great faith that Noah displayed in constructing the ark for the survival of his household.—Hebrews 11:7.​
Can there be any doubt that these inspired Bible writers accepted the Genesis account of the Flood? They unquestionably considered it to be a true event.
 

MdmSzdWhtGuy

Well-Known Member
There are several threads on this topic in the science vs. religion section. The Earth is not 6,000 years old with a worldwide flood 4,000 years ago, no matter what any ancient book tells you. I can, and have, written for page after page on why this is so, and the talkorigins quote on the first page of this thread addresses many of those reasons.

However, if you choose to ignore all scientific knowledge in favor of a fairy tale known and shown to be demonstrably false, knock yourself out.

B.
 
There are 1.8 million known species of living things and untold numbers of unknown species. According to the legend, eight people without modern transportation collected them all in a week -- 300,000 per day -- from all over the globe.

Sure, that sounds logical. They were pretty fast on their feet in those days. They also lived hundreds of years. They were pretty quick reproducers too, repopulated the entire Earth in a few thousand years -- starting with eight people -- one couple per continent (and an extra for Asia because it is large).

That makes as much sense as "three days in the belly of a fish (or whale, or whatever)". And, if you believe that you'll love the story about three steel skyscrapers falling into their own footprint almost simultaneously. One outlandish belief can lead to another.
 

may

Well-Known Member
MdmSzdWhtGuy said:
There are several threads on this topic in the science vs. religion section. The Earth is not 6,000 years old with a worldwide flood 4,000 years ago, no matter what any ancient book tells you. I can, and have, written for page after page on why this is so, and the talkorigins quote on the first page of this thread addresses many of those reasons.

However, if you choose to ignore all scientific knowledge in favor of a fairy tale known and shown to be demonstrably false, knock yourself out.

B.
yes i agree the earth is not 6,000 years old , we dont know how old it is . but the flood did happen .
The Bible provides chronological information that allows for a careful count back to the beginning of human history. At Genesis 5:1-29, we find the genealogical line from the creation of the first man, Adam, to the birth of Noah. The Deluge began "in the six hundredth year of Noah’s life."—Genesis 7:11.
 

Halcyon

Lord of the Badgers
I think what disturbs me the most is that some people not only believe the entire human race is descended from an inbred family of one man, one woman and three sons, but that they also believe in a second wave of inbreeding within a single family of eight palestinians a short while later.

You have to wonder what humans originally looked like if this is the case, because with that much inbreeding going on the congenital deformity rate would have been through the roof (presumably the roof of the ark).
 
Nordicßearskin said:
Define 'true'.
Definition of True: being in accordance with the actual state of affairs: conformable to an essential reality: fully realized or fulfilled: being that which is the case rather than what is manifest or assumed.

Definition of Untrue: not according with a standard of correctness: not according with the facts: FALSE.

Examples of untrue, assumed, fictional or doubtful stories:
Santa Claus
Easter Bunny
Leprechauns
Fairies
Nursery Rhymes
Bible Stories
Political Statements
 

gnostic

The Lost One
The problem with the Genesis account of the Flood and that of evidences found is that the timeline of the Bible don't correlate with any of the dates.

From what can be calculated, Noah's Flood happened around 2104 BC, to precise, which a little over 4000 years ago, if we are to believe years are to be correct.

As to the Black Sea's Deluge. The timings are wrong; Noah's flood happened too late to coincide with the Black Sea flooding. The Black Sea Deluge happened around 7600 years ago, which would make it 5500 BC. This is roughly about 3500 years before Noah's Flood.

And the Black Sea was a more regional disaster than a global catastrophe. If the sea level was really lower than the time of Noah, then 40 days of heavy rain could not have possibly flooded the entire earth, no matter how stormy the weathers were.

There were no evidences of any major floodings around the Black Sea or in the Mesopotamia around Noah's time. Noah's Flood coincided with the 3rd Dynasty of Ur (c. 2112–c. 2004 BC), the last major Sumerian city-state of importance. So earlier rulers of 3rd Dynasty were contemporary of Noah and his Flood, but there is no evidence of any major flood in Mesopotamia at any time during the 3rd Dynasty.

What I find strange is that Ur, and other Sumerian cities, like Nippur, have poems written about Ziusudra, the Sumerian flood hero, and mentioned in Sumerian version of the Gilgamesh's tale. These are the older than Noah's Flood itself. The poems indicated the Flood having happened hundreds of years before the reign of Gilagamesh (flourished 2700-2650 BC), therefore the Sumerian flood happened pre-2700 BC.

The Sumerian myth of Ziusudra also build the boat for wife and some animals too. It was the Sumerian god Enlil who initiated the Flood, but it was Enki who instructed Ziusudra how to save him.

Myths of both Ziusudra and Gilagamesh came from oral tradition, where the extant poems were derived from. Thus their myth is even older than the 3rd Dynasty of Ur.

Evidences of both Ziusudra and Gilagmesh can be found as far back as 2450 BC, where their names inscribed in tablets, but make no mention of Gilagmesh's adventures or Ziusudra's Flood, it does however indicate how popular Gilagmesh and Ziusudra were, during the 1st Dynasty of Lagash, when Sumerians began writing religious hymns and literature of their past, using oral tradition. The dynasty fell to the Semitic people, the conqueror of Sumer, whose first ruler is named Sargon of Agade; he founded the Semitic dynasty, the period of Sargon and his successors were known as the Akkadian Dynasty (c. 2334–c. 2154 BC).
 

gnostic

The Lost One
LeMaverick said:
Examples of untrue, assumed, fictional or doubtful stories:
Santa Claus
Easter Bunny
Leprechauns
Fairies
Nursery Rhymes
Bible Stories
Political Statements
Surely, the Teletubbies are real. :confused:
 

Bubber

Member
I would have to say that I have not seen any evidence put forth yet on this forum supporting the flood. However the argument contained in the link posted by PaWs is extensive and contains many links to supporting evidence for it's arguments. I should also add that gnostic put forth a beautifully well reasoned argument that would be perfect with the inclusion of reference material. Frubals to both!
I haven't seen anything approaching this kind of argument supporting the flood however. I think that we can all agree that biblical legends hardly count as evidence. Come on bible dudes, I know you can do it!!!

So far by my count: FLOOD - 0 | NO-FLOOD - 2
 
Top