Is it possible to investigate Bahaullah's claim?

[Trailblazer]

because it's possible that he got his education outside of school.

Anything is possible, but what would that prove? How would that prove His claim to have knowledge from God is false?

His claim that God taught Him the knowledge of all that has been cannot be proven true or false so it is just a matter of belief.

 

[night912]

Anything is possible, but what would that prove? How would that prove His claim to have knowledge from God is false?

His claim that God taught Him the knowledge of all that has been cannot be proven true or false so it is just a matter of belief.

And what does any of this have to do with what I said?

 

[Trailblazer]

And what does any of this have to do with what I said?

It is related to what you said...

You said: He never claimed anything about his education. His claim about never attending school is a possibility and CAN be taken as being true, because it's possible that he got his education outside of school.

I said: Anything is possible, but what would that prove? How would that prove His claim to have knowledge from God is false?
His claim that God taught Him the knowledge of all that has been cannot be proven true or false so it is just a matter of belief.

So, am I not allowed to have questions and further reflections related to what you said? This is a discussion forum.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Did his siblings see him eat? Did his close relatives or friends see that? Not every thing from a person's life is documented.

Yes, there are many written details about life of Bahaullah, by His companions and people who encountered Him, such as He drinking tea, He dyed His hair with Hanna, He had long hair, He had an unusually long hat,.. to other things such as How fast He was authoring Books. Also, His marriage certificate, passport, and personal belongings are available today. Many people wrote their memories of meeting Bahaullah. But nobody has seen Him reading books, or possessing books. Bahaullah said He did not have books neither read the books people possess.
Among His personal belonging no books found.

But if you want proof, you already provided the proofs and acknowledged that he was educated in it. And "education" doesn't mean that one has to go to a school. Bahá’u’lláh got his education from him studying what is in bold from your post below.

That is a conjecture. Where did you read He was educated?
We no He was very knowledgeable, but the question is not if He is knowledgeable or not. The question is, where and when and how He got His knowledge from?

So there you have it. Historical proof of his education regarding religion and his ability to understand and write in Arabic.

Here's a quote attributed to Samuel Clemmons.

"I have never let schooling interfere with my education."

How Persian classic poetry has anything to do with knowing religious traditions in details? That is like, if when you were a child, they taught you, some classic Shakespeare. Does that make you able to write Bible in Hebrew or Greek, and being able to interpret or know details of other religions?

 

[oldbadger]

That is what they said about Muhammad. Thus there is valid replies to all those accusations, as Baha'u'llah met the challenge to produce works like the Quran.

Regards Tony

I don't think so.
Have a good day, Tony.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

I don't think so.
Have a good day, Tony.

That is quite OK OB, you do not have to think so.

Bedtime from me, day is done, hope you have a great day. Regards Tony

 

[oldbadger]

That is quite OK OB, you do not have to think so.

Bedtime from me, day is done, hope you have a great day. Regards Tony

You Ozzie's.
Going to bed in the morning, getting up in the night.
Why can't you be like us Brits?..... sensible folks.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Bahaullah never said he didn't read any books, though.

I quote Bahaullah, to show, He says He did not study, nor had books to read, nore He even like to read people's books, but, He has an inherent knowledge:

"Thou knowest full well that We perused not the books which men possess and We acquired not the learning current amongst them, and yet whenever We desire to quote the sayings of the learned and of the wise, presently there will appear before the face of thy Lord in the form of a tablet all that which hath appeared in the world and is revealed in the Holy Books and Scriptures. Thus do We set down in writing that which the eye perceiveth. Verily His knowledge encompasseth the earth and the heavens."


"The learning current amongst men I studied not; their schools I entered not. Ask of the city wherein I dwelt, that thou mayest be well assured that I am not of them who speak falsely. "


"Tell them of the messenger whom the congregation of the divines of that land had delegated to meet Us, who, when attaining Our presence, questioned Us concerning certain sciences, and whom We answered by virtue of the knowledge We inherently possess."


"We have not entered any school, nor read any of your dissertations."


Baha'i Reference Library: Advanced Search

Gleanings from Bahaullah

 

[InvestigateTruth]

This is completely false. Almost no-one knows when Michaelmas is anymore, but ask anyone prior to the 20th century and they'd likely know. Ask them what it's all about and they'd likely know. Most people prior to the 19th c. were not formally trained beyond extreme basics in religion, as we'd consider it, but just by living it day to day they'd know more than most people do now.


People can and do make good self-study and some can go above and beyond. David Bowie was self-taught in music.

List of autodidacts - Wikipedia

In the 19th century Persia, there was a class of men, known as Ulama, who were specifically trained in the religious matters, by going to special schools. When other people had religious questions they went to the Ulama and asked. People did not know how to practice or understand religious texts in good details. In those days, there were no internet, nor libraries or books available to general population, the way is available today.

Bahaullah wrote about 17000 works. Almost all of His Books or Tablets, He dictated to His secretaries and they just wrote what He said. But, the point i am making is, He did not have any books around Him to use as a reference, while dictating His writings, yet, His writings are full of quotes from Quran, Bible, religious histories, and concept in other religions. When did He memorize all that?

This is the answer He gives to this question:

"Thou knowest full well that We perused not the books which men possess and We acquired not the learning current amongst them, and yet whenever We desire to quote the sayings of the learned and of the wise, presently there will appear before the face of thy Lord in the form of a tablet all that which hath appeared in the world and is revealed in the Holy Books and Scriptures. Thus do We set down in writing that which the eye perceiveth. Verily His knowledge encompasseth the earth and the heavens."


Bahá'í Reference Library - Tablets of Bahá’u’lláh Revealed After the Kitáb-i-Aqdas, Pages 137-152

 

[InvestigateTruth]

Did Bahaullah's knowledge of religion exceed that of people with PhDs in those fields?

Sorry, I am late a bit to reply.

According to history, many of those who were very knowledgeable in religion, and were scholars of the time became followers of Bahaullah.
Example, was a Islam teacher, named Mirza Abulfzal Golpaygani.
Bahaullah wrote 17000 works related to theology, which is free from error. All of it, written from His mind, without having any books around Him to use as reference. Yet, His writings often contains, quotes from Bible, Quran, Hadith and other religions traditions. Bahaullah often dictated to secretaries, then they wrote it. Many times, the secretaries had to try hard to keep up with the speed of His words.

On some occasions Bahaullah challenged the Religious Leaders of His time. He sent a letter to the King of Persia, asking Him to gather the Religious Leaders, and Himself, and He will provide any proofs they ask. But the Religious leaders refrain to confront Him.

 

[InvestigateTruth]

I believe we can take his statement at face value that he believed he heard from God. Many people do believe that but not all have. Unless there is a fulfilled prophecy there is only one other way to tell and that is if what he heard is the same as what I heard and even better what Jesus said. I believe there are writings where the B man has said things contrary to what God says.

These can be good subjects to discuss but, I don't think they are directly related to the OP.

I believe there are writings where the B man has said things contrary to what God says.

You as a Christian may not agree with some of the interpretations Bahaullah wrote on Bible.

However, He often quoted exact verses of Bible, Quran and Hadithes from His memory. He seems to have the quotes of the Bible, Quran and Hadithes extensively in His mind. So, the question in OP, is more about where Bahaullah got His knowledge from?

 

[InvestigateTruth]

I would think a rich official would want a secular education for his son. However the family could have been religious probably Muslim but even possibly Zoroastrian.

It is possible to find out. You know, Bahaullah lived in 19th century. History is clear about His family, and what education they wanted for Him. We don't have to go by guessing. We can go by what is recorded in history.