Gun Debate

[Prometheus85]

Mass shootings in America seem like a never-ending nightmare.

Why does this keep happening? Are guns the problem? Do we need stricter gun laws or do we need guns in the hands of law abiding citizens.

 

[Uncommon Sense]

While many humans are stupid and guns used to do stupid, as well as wouldn’t be surprising that they orchestrated these mass shootings themselves ~ most have already given most of their minds and bodies over to governing authorities. Have to be even more stupid to give them or cave to anything else.

 

[Uncommon Sense]

While many humans are stupid and guns used to do stupid, as well as wouldn’t be surprising that they orchestrated these mass shootings themselves ~ most have already given most of their minds and bodies over to governing authorities. Have to be even more stupid to give them or cave to anything else.

People are already stupid enough to trust and confide in any politician, lawmaker, authority no matter how sweet, caring, and smiley they seem on the outside.

 

[Nimos]

Mass shootings in America seem like a never-ending nightmare.

Why does this keep happening? Are guns the problem? Do we need stricter gun laws or do we need guns in the hands of law abiding citizens.

Having guns floating around in ones society is probably not a good idea in general. So yes much stricter gun laws and then you need to figure out why mass shootings seems to be rather common in the US. Something in the way you do things (talking society) is not working very well when it comes to this.
Since its rather easy in the US, compared to most other countries to obtain a gun, it could partly explain why the number is so much higher than in the rest of the world.

 

[leov]

Mass shootings in America seem like a never-ending nightmare.

Why does this keep happening? Are guns the problem? Do we need stricter gun laws or do we need guns in the hands of law abiding citizens.

It happens when a very toxic story needed to be obscured....

 

[LiveBetterLife]

Guns are not the problem.

 

[LiveBetterLife]

The problem is that there needs to be a new cultural revolution.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Having guns floating around in ones society is probably not a good idea in general. So yes much stricter gun laws and then you need to figure out why mass shootings seems to be rather common in the US. Something in the way you do things (talking society) is not working very well when it comes to this.
Since its rather easy in the US, compared to most other countries to obtain a gun, it could partly explain why the number is so much higher than in the rest of the world.

Have you noticed this is just a recent phenomena? We've had guns throughout the entirety of US history.

I'd more address as to why primarily young people are becoming so mentally psychopathic in recent years as the vast majority of mass shooters are young millennial males.

 

[Nimos]

Have you noticed this is just a recent phenomena? We've had guns throughout the entirety of US history.

I don't really have any valid ideas to why it seems to happen a lot in the US, except that it much easier to get a gun there than other countries. Obviously if all people living their are mentally functional guns in themselves are not an issue. That is why I think the answer have to found somewhere in your society. I have a feeling (Guess ) that a lot of this comes down to the inequality, not only from the perspective of difference between wealth, but what the effect of it have on all sorts of things, like maybe the parents have to little time with their children because they have to work to much etc. So I think one would have to really explore this topic to figure out how it is all connected together. However since guns are very easy to get, it could also indicate that if a person decide to go on a mass shooting, getting hold of one is so easy and that could escalate it. So rather than a person being extremely angry or whatever drives them and expressing this through less violent means, they might decide to get a gun and express it that way because its so easy. And again want to stress that, I really don't know the answer. But in general to me, it seems like a bad idea to have guns almost freely available in ones country.

 

[Twilight Hue]

I don't really have any valid ideas to why it seems to happen a lot in the US, except that it much easier to get a gun there than other countries. Obviously if all people living their are mentally functional guns in themselves are not an issue. That is why I think the answer have to found somewhere in your society. I have a feeling (Guess ) that a lot of this comes down to the inequality, not only from the perspective of difference between wealth, but what the effect of it have on all sorts of things, like maybe the parents have to little time with their children because they have to work to much etc. So I think one would have to really explore this topic to figure out how it is all connected together. However since guns are very easy to get, it could also indicate that if a person decide to go on a mass shooting, getting hold of one is so easy and that could escalate it. So rather than a person being extremely angry or whatever drives them and expressing this through less violent means, they might decide to get a gun and express it that way because its so easy. And again want to stress that, I really don't know the answer. But in general to me, it seems like a bad idea to have guns almost freely available in ones country.

My personal view is primarily media overload , coupled with people's sociopathic and narcissistic view of themselves and of the world as evidenced by the many streamers and content creators throughout the web. Easily self-explanatory by watching these people and how they promote themselves .

Couple this with a fostered sense of entitlement and when expectations are not met, people go ballistic and lash out.

It's a phenomena that seems especially prevalent among Generation X and millennials who seems to live life out in a virtual universe and severing ties with the real world and reality, leaving them with a deficit in perspective .

I hate to blame media and I am a very strong proponent of a free press and free expression as much as I am with the Second Amendment.

But I do understand why the first thing dictators do is control the media. It's a testament of the effectiveness of propaganda, fake news, and mental manipulation. It's nothing new really, but what is new is on how widespread communications have become now.

It can be too much for one person to take in all at once if they don't have proper perspective distinguishing between mass information and the actuality by which mass information is expressed and put forth as.

I think a lot of this can be tempered with a little education focusing on an understanding how the brain works and reacts when exposed to mass quantities of information and imagery that may or may not be true .

 

[Wandering Monk]

Having guns floating around in ones society is probably not a good idea in general. So yes much stricter gun laws and then you need to figure out why mass shootings seems to be rather common in the US. Something in the way you do things (talking society) is not working very well when it comes to this.
Since its rather easy in the US, compared to most other countries to obtain a gun, it could partly explain why the number is so much higher than in the rest of the world.

This data shows us that, though the US has more mass shootings, it has lower fatalities per 100,000 people than Norway, Finland, and Switzerland. Why do we get all the bad press?

 

[Nimos]

This data shows us that, though the US has more mass shootings, it has lower fatalities per 100,000 people than Norway, Finland, and Switzerland. Why do we get all the bad press?

I think you misread/misunderstand the graph, you are correct that it shows the fatality rate per 100000 people, but that is not really important. The only reason you have Norway on top and notice that they only have had one mass shooting, is due to the shooting at Utøya (69 killed), where the police were not prepared to handle the situation as it happen on an small island and because you at the same time had explosions in Oslo. This drives the fatality rate up in Norway, but doesn't change the fact that they have only had one shooting in that time period (2011). However I have tried to see if there have been other mass shootings in Norway before that and haven't been able to find any, so at least this is not something that happen there a lot. Also keep in mind that there only live 5.2 million people in Norway, so the moment just a few people is killed the fatality rate will rise very fast.

And you would probably be able to reach the conclusion for all the other countries that you mentions as well. Mass shooting in these countries are not common.

If you look at the US and the 133 mass shooting over the 4 year period. It means that they have approximately a mass shooting every 10.9 days on average, that is pretty crazy if you look at it like that.

 

[Wandering Monk]

I think you misread/misunderstand the graph, you are correct that it shows the fatality rate per 100000 people, but that is not really important. The only reason you have Norway on top and notice that they only have had one mass shooting, is due to the shooting at Utøya (69 killed), where the police were not prepared to handle the situation as it happen on an small island and because you at the same time had explosions in Oslo. This drives the fatality rate up in Norway, but doesn't change the fact that they have only had one shooting in that time period (2011). However I have tried to see if there have been other mass shootings in Norway before that and haven't been able to find any, so at least this is not something that happen there a lot. Also keep in mind that there only live 5.2 million people in Norway, so the moment just a few people is killed the fatality rate will rise very fast.

And you would probably be able to reach the conclusion for all the other countries that you mentions as well. Mass shooting in these countries are not common.

If you look at the US and the 133 mass shooting over the 4 year period. It means that they have approximately a mass shooting every 10.9 days on average, that is pretty crazy if you look at it like that.

So it the number of mass shootings that matter, not the fatalities per 100,000 people?

 

[Shiranui117]

Have you noticed this is just a recent phenomena? We've had guns throughout the entirety of US history.

I'd more address as to why primarily young people are becoming so mentally psychopathic in recent years as the vast majority of mass shooters are young millennial males.

A lack of hope, a lack of motivation, a lack of purpose, poor family situations, the loss of manufacturing jobs causing many parts of middle America to become economically depressed and decayed, a lack of positive male role models, untreated mental illness, a lack of a social support network... All of these I believe culminate in extremely desperate individuals who feel betrayed and let down by their families, society and the world.

 

[metis]

All societies have both mentally-ill people and those whom have had terrible upbringings, but the States still has a homicide rate that's many times higher than what's found in Canada, western Europe, Japan, Australia, New Zealand, etc.

So, what's the difference between them and us? How about the fact that we have almost 1 gun per person versus much less with them? How many mass shootings do we have versus them? How many drive-by shootings do we have versus them? Etc.

 

[Nimos]

So it the number of mass shootings that matter, not the fatalities per 100,000 people?

Its not the fatality per 100000 people that matters. It's the amount of insecurity that people feels when lots of these things are happening in ones society. Im pretty sure that if you ask a person from Norway whether they in general are afraid of mass shootings happening, that they will answer no. The other thing that matters is the amount of people that gets killed, not the ratio per 100000 but the total amount. In the mass shooting in Norway it was 69 people. You can't use the ratio for anything as I see it. If Island for instance have a mass shooting and 69 people were killed the ratio would be insanely high as they are only 338000 people. But that doesn't tell us anything, because the mass shooting could have happened at a festival or some other event where a lot of people would gather and also it could be the only mass shooting ever in Island history done by a crazy person. So its the amount of people that gets killed and how often they occur that is interesting.

 

[Trailblazer]

Having guns floating around in ones society is probably not a good idea in general. So yes much stricter gun laws and then you need to figure out why mass shootings seems to be rather common in the US. Something in the way you do things (talking society) is not working very well when it comes to this.
Since its rather easy in the US, compared to most other countries to obtain a gun, it could partly explain why the number is so much higher than in the rest of the world.

Easy access to guns is part of the problem, but the violent American culture is also part of the problem. That we can see by looking at gun deaths in Japan

Japan has almost completely eliminated gun deaths — here's how

• Japan is a country of more than 127 million people, but it rarely sees more than 10 gun deaths a year.
• Culture is one reason for the low rate, but gun control is a major one, too.
• Japan has a long list of tests that applicants must pass before gaining access to a small pool of guns.

Japan has almost completely eliminated gun deaths — here's how

The weapons law of Japan begins by stating "No one shall possess a firearm or firearms or a sword or swords", and very few exceptions are allowed. Citizens are permitted to possess firearms for hunting and sport shooting, but only after submitting to a lengthy licensing procedure.
Overview of gun laws by nation - Wikipedia

“The only guns that Japanese citizens can legally buy and use are shotguns and air rifles, and it’s not easy to do. The process is detailed in David Kopel’s landmark study on Japanese gun control, published in the 1993 Asia Pacific Law Review, still cited as current. (Kopel, no left-wing loony, is a member of the National Rifle Association and once wrote in National Review that looser gun control laws could have stopped Adolf Hitler.)

To get a gun in Japan, first, you have to attend an all-day class and pass a written test, which are held only once per month. You also must take and pass a shooting range class. Then, head over to a hospital for a mental test and drug test (Japan is unusual in that potential gun owners must affirmatively prove their mental fitness), which you’ll file with the police. Finally, pass a rigorous background check for any criminal record or association with criminal or extremist groups, and you will be the proud new owner of your shotgun or air rifle. Just don’t forget to provide police with documentation on the specific location of the gun in your home, as well as the ammo, both of which must be locked and stored separately. And remember to have the police inspect the gun once per year and to re-take the class and exam every three years.

Even the most basic framework of Japan’s approach to gun ownership is almost the polar opposite of America’s. U.S. gun law begins with the second amendment's affirmation of the “right of the people to keep and bear arms” and narrows it down from there. Japanese law, however, starts with the 1958 act stating that “No person shall possess a firearm or firearms or a sword or swords,” later adding a few exceptions. In other words, American law is designed to enshrine access to guns, while Japan starts with the premise of forbidding it.”
A Land Without Guns: How Japan Has Virtually Eliminated Shooting Deaths

This policy is very similar to the Laws of the Baha’i Faith:

173. It hath been forbidden you to carry arms unless essential # 159

Bahá’u’lláh confirms an injunction contained in the Bayán which makes it unlawful to carry arms, unless it is necessary to do so. With regard to circumstances under which the bearing of arms might be “essential” for an individual, ‘Abdu’l-Bahá gives permission to a believer for self-protection in a dangerous environment. Shoghi Effendi in a letter written on his behalf has also indicated that, in an emergency, when there is no legal force at hand to appeal to, a Bahá’í is justified in defending his life. There are a number of other situations in which weapons are needed and can be legitimately used; for instance, in countries where people hunt for their food and clothing, and in such sports as archery, marksmanship, and fencing. The Kitáb-i-Aqdas, pp. 240-241