Fulfillment of Prophecy in the New Testament

[Harel13]

Sinbad?? Now you're pulling my

Did you watch it?

Look at my maps again: Earth-encircling sea in both of them. The only serious difference between them and Homer & Hesiod's version is that Homer and Hesiod didn't know about the Antartic circle, which is necessary to keep the water from flowing off the earth's surface.

Well, that's the problem, ain't it? Homer didn't know about the arctic, but he wrote part of Greek Mythology. In his version of the world, Tartarus was part of the underworld which was a disk that, get this, was situated under the earth...so if one traveled to the edge of the sea, and fell at the right angle, one might've fallen into the underworld.

 

[Harel13]

@Terry Sampson

 

[Faithofchristian]

The calculation in Daniel has been discussed here... I recall @rosends detailing it.

I searched and found this:

Daniel 9:24-27

But would you care to explain what about
Prophet Daniel 9:24-27

I know what Prophet Daniel is saying..
But what are you saying.

 

[Rival]

I know what Prophet Daniel is saying..

No, you have an interpretation. One most likely based on an after-the-fact reading of the Christian Scriptures.

 

[dybmh]

But would you care to explain what about
Prophet Daniel 9:24-27

I know what Prophet Daniel is saying..
But what are you saying.

My opinion on the entire book of Daniel is that he was not a prophet, he was a seer, dream interpreter, he untied knots... If I recall, all the other Prophets in the Torah are sited explicitly as prophets, or that the word of G-d came to them. That doesn't happen in Daniel. He dreams and sees visions. This distinction is why I think that attempting to calculate a specific date from anything in the Book of Daniel to be non-authoritative.

 

[Faithofchristian]

No, you have an interpretation. One most likely based on an after-the-fact reading of the Christian Scriptures.

Seeing that you don't understand about the scriptures
I do not have my interpretation nor is there any private interpretation of the
scriptures.

 

[Rival]

Seeing that you don't understand about the scriptures

You don't know my mind better than I do.

I do not have my interpretation nor is there any private interpretation of the
scriptures.

You have a Christian interpretation and as long as you don't speak Hebrew and Aramaic, anything you believe about Daniel is an interpretation.

 

[Faithofchristian]

My opinion on the entire book of Daniel is that he was not a prophet, he was a seer, dream interpreter, he untied knots... If I recall, all the other Prophets in the Torah are sited explicitly as prophets, or that the word of G-d came to them. That doesn't happen in Daniel. He dreams and sees visions. This distinction is why I think that attempting to calculate a specific date from anything in the Book of Daniel to be non-authoritative.

So I don't know where your getting your source of information from.
But you do know the Lord Jesus Christ referred to Daniel as a Prophet in the book of
Matthew 24:15--"When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand

Whoever told that Daniel is not a Prophet
Stands to be corrected.

 

[rosends]

So I don't know where your getting your source of information from.
But you do know the Lord Jesus Christ referred to Daniel as a Prophet in the book of
Matthew 24:15--"When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand

Whoever told that Daniel is not a Prophet
Stands to be corrected.

As does whoever told you Jesus was the Lord.

See how this works?

 

[Rival]

Whoever told that Daniel is not a Prophet
Stands to be corrected.

If you pick up a Jewish Tanakh, Daniel is with the Ketuvim not the Neviim. This is standard.

 

[Faithofchristian]

You don't know my mind better than I do.


You have a Christian interpretation and as long as you don't speak Hebrew and Aramaic, anything you believe about Daniel is an interpretation.

Well neither do you know my mind better than me.
Not when you have the proof of the scriptures showing that Daniel is a Prophet.
So therefore there is no private interpretation of the scriptures.
When the Scriptures speaks for themselves.

 

[Rival]

Well neither do you know my mind better than me.
Not when you have the proof of the scriptures showing that Daniel is a Prophet.
So therefore there is no private interpretation of the scriptures.
When the Scriptures speaks for themselves.

There are differences in levels of prophecy that you don't seem to take into account here. Daniel was not a prophet in the sense Hoshea or Jeremiah were prophets. Neither were Hoshea and Jeremiah prophets in the sense Moses was a prophet.

 

[rosends]

Judaism 101: Prophets and Prophecy

 

[dybmh]

So I don't know where your getting your source of information from.
But you do know the Lord Jesus Christ referred to Daniel as a Prophet in the book of
Matthew 24:15--"When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand

Whoever told that Daniel is not a Prophet
Stands to be corrected.

In order for this to be convincing, you would need to provide strong evidence that the Book of Matthew is authoritative.

 

[Faithofchristian]

In order for this to be convincing, you would need to provide strong evidence that the Book of Matthew is authoritative.

As a Christian the book of Matthew is authoritative.
You might disagree..but then that's you and not me as a Christian.

 

[dybmh]

As a Christian the book of Matthew is authoritative.
You might disagree..but then that's you and not me as a Christian.

So, knowing that I'm Jewish, why bring that specific source?

But beyond that, there is a logical flaw. The Book of Matthew is quoting Jesus claiming that the book of Daniel is speaking about himself? Am I misunderstanding that?

If so, that's a classic conflict of interest. Therefore an objective reader is naturally going to be skeptical about Jesus' claims to his own divine status.

 

[rational experiences]

22 Then the angel showed me the river of the water of life, as clear as crystal, flowing from the throne of God and of the Lamb 2 down the middle of the great street of the city. On each side of the river stood the tree of life, bearing twelve crops of fruit, yielding its fruit every month. And the leaves of the tree are for the healing of the nations. 3 No longer will there be any curse. The throne of God and of the Lamb will be in the city, and his servants will serve him. 4 They will see his face, and his name will be on their foreheads. 5 There will be no more night. They will not need the light of a lamp or the light of the sun, for the Lord God will give them light. And they will reign for ever and ever.

18 I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this scroll: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to that person the plagues described in this scroll. 19 And if anyone takes words away from this scroll of prophecy, God will take away from that person any share in the tree of life and in the Holy City, which are described in this scroll.

20 He who testifies to these things says, “Yes, I am coming soon.”

Science studies science and on behalf of humanity tell science that it is wrong...for what it did to human life and our Nature.

No human can lie about the review of science versus science.

Humans live with night time sky........its existence as night sky is why light remains in its conditions of supporting our life in day sky....as gases are burning.

Therefore if any human owned common sense......reading the article says that night sky will be removed as if it is a curse.

So then you would make a statement to science. You do realize don't you that God the stone mass is stated to be the entombed spirit, meaning it had died.

And for a spirit/gas to have died, means it no longer owned natural gas light....for we equate information in human sciences as a comparison to our self.

If a quote says you will no longer need the light of the Sun....I would be really worried...but seemingly science isn't worried, science knows everything they claim...why they do experiments so that they can learn if they are right or wrong...yet they know everything.

 

[Faithofchristian]

So, knowing that I'm Jewish, why bring that specific source?

But beyond that, there is a logical flaw. The Book of Matthew is quoting Jesus claiming that the book of Daniel is speaking about himself? Am I misunderstanding that?

If so, that's a classic conflict of interest. Therefore an objective reader is naturally going to be skeptical about Jesus' claims to his own divine status.

I don't know where your getting all of that at..
I said Jesus Christ referred to Daniel as a Prophet in
Matthew 24:15--"When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand

Therefore Jesus Christ referred to Daniel as a Prophet.

 

[Trailblazer]

The calculation in Daniel has been discussed here... I recall @rosends detailing it.

I searched and found this:

Daniel 9:24-27

Daniel accurately predicted the first coming of Christ, and I believe he also accurately predicted the second Coming of Christ, who was the Messiah the Jews have long awaited. Here are some excerpts from a chapter entitled:
10: TRADITIONAL PROOFS EXEMPLIFIED FROM THE BOOK OF DANIEL

The proofs are explained in this chapter, following the two paragraphs below.

“All the peoples of the world are awaiting two Manifestations, Who must be contemporaneous; all wait for the fulfillment of this promise. In the Bible the Jews have the promise of the Lord of Hosts and the Messiah; in the Gospel the return of Christ and Elijah is promised.

In the religion of Muḥammad there is the promise of the Mihdí and the Messiah, and it is the same with the Zoroastrian and the other religions, but if we relate these matters in detail, it would take too long. The essential fact is that all are promised two Manifestations, Who will come, one following on the other. It has been prophesied that in the time of these two Manifestations the earth will be transformed, the world of existence will be renewed, and beings will be clothed in new garments. Justice and truth will encompass the world; enmity and hatred will disappear; all causes of division among peoples, races and nations will vanish; and the cause of union, harmony and concord will appear. The negligent will awake, the blind will see, the deaf will hear, the dumb will speak, the sick will be cured, the dead will arise. War will give place to peace, enmity will be conquered by love, the causes of dispute and wrangling will be entirely removed, and true felicity will be attained. The world will become the mirror of the Heavenly Kingdom; humanity will be the Throne of Divinity. All nations will become one; all religions will be unified; all individual men will become of one family and of one kindred. All the regions of the earth will become one; the superstitions caused by races, countries, individuals, languages and politics will disappear; and all men will attain to life eternal, under the shadow of the Lord of Hosts.

Now we must prove from the Holy Books that these two Manifestations have come, and we must divine the meaning of the words of the Prophets, for we wish for proofs drawn from the Holy Books.”

Some Answered Questions, pp. 39-40

 

[1213]

...
Would you guys say that the NT writers definitely take certain quotes out of context from the OT?

I don’t think so. Do you have some clear example?