Federal Appeals Court Upholds Blocking Vaccine and Testing Mandate

[The Hammer]

so why choose one sentence to tell us that we must get vaccinated if the whole article on the Israeli study proved that Natural immunity is much better than the vaccine.

I evaluate all scientific claims by politicians and government officials by the followin litmus test.

If they dont mention anything about NATURAL IMMUNITY, they are giving half the truth, and sellected truths is a complete lie!
I had covid, and I dont want the vax, not because I am an anti vaxxer, but because people speaking like you are Brain vaxxers.

If that's what you want to believe, that 1 study said you don't have to be vaccinated, that's on you.

Considering the dozens that say it's more effective.

I listen to my doctor, not the internet. Have a good day.

Edit: Arguing that one is better then the other is politics, not medicine. I'll stick with medicine.

 

[Jainarayan]

I'll keep participating in this thread as long as I feel like it.

And there are a lot worse words I could use than "jerkish" to describe someone needlessly putting others at risk of a deadly disease by not bothering to do small, basic things like get vaccinated.


If you don't like my morality, then let's use yours: what would you think of someone who, out of ignorance or apathy, was maximizing the chance that they'd give you a deadly disease?


Truth. You've told us, effectively, that you don't understand the thing you're objecting to.

Any conclusion that you make based on that misunderstanding is not going to be sound.



I don't, actually.


I'm assuming your posts were relevant to the thread. This might be a bad assumption on my part, I admit.

This thread is about vaccine mandates. These mandates only apply in settings where there's a significant risk of transmitting COVID. Vaccine mandates are irrelevant to a hermit who never sees anyone else and never goes into town, because he's never going to be in a situation where the vaccine mandates would apply.

If you're unvaccinated and, say, going into stores or offices, you are putting others at needless risk.

Prove I’m a danger. It’s a simple request.

 

[Jainarayan]

No understanding of history?

You're the one quoting poems from history without being aware of their connections to Nazis and their actions during WWII.

You still haven’t told me why it an impossibility.

 

[Jainarayan]

I agree and have said the same thing myself. I think the comparison is an insult against the millions who lost their lives to the Nazis.

Show where a comparison was made to the Nazis or the millions they killed.

I’m still waiting.

 

[Kooky]

Are you going to tell me the possibility doesn’t exist? Are you going to tell me this never happened? Stick your head in the sand if you wish. I don’t know how old you are, but you have little to no memory or understanding of history.

As I have already outlined, I have actually studied the subject for several years, and was planning to literally make it my job.

You may feel no particular compunction about using Nazi references and Holocaust comparisons for cheap shock value, but I assure you that my attachment to the subject is rather more serious.

 

[Jainarayan]

As I have already outlined, I have actually studied the subject for several years, and was planning to literally make it my job. You may have no connection to the ugly past of the Nazi regime and therefore feel all-too-cavalier with the Nazi comparisons, but I assure you that my attachment to the subject is rather more serious than a desire for cheap shock value by framing literally every convenience as the next iteration of the g-damn Holocaust.

You’re still not showing where a comparison or connection was made to the Nazis or the Holocaust. Are you sure you’re in the right thread? I’m going to ask once more, where is the comparison or mention of the Nazis? Can you do that?

 

[Debater Slayer]

If they get vaccinated they have nothing to fear.

Many vaccinated people are still at relatively high risk of severe illness or death if they're elderly, immunocompromised, or undergoing a treatment like chemotherapy, to name a few examples.

There are reasons for a lot of people to worry even after getting vaccinated, which is where others' role comes in to ensure they aren't putting those people at unnecessarily elevated risk.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Prove I’m a danger. It’s a simple request.

I have no way to confirm that any detail you share about yourself is actually true, so this is something you'll have to reflect on for yourself.

Here's a tool to help you:

https://www.microcovid.org/

If you want to put actual numbers on the risk you pose to others, plug in the info for scenarios where you're close to other people. Get your unvaccinated baseline, then see what the risk would have been if you were fully vaccinated. The difference between those two numbers is the unnecessary risk you've chosen to inflict on that person.

Repeat as necessary for other situations you find yourself in on a regular basis.

 

[Kooky]

You’re still not showing where a comparison or connection was made to the Nazis or the Holocaust. Are you sure you’re in the right thread? I’m going to ask once more, where is the comparison or mention of the Nazis? Can you do that?

From the article I linked to and asked you to read:

"First they came …" is the poetic form of a 1946 post-war confessional prose by the German Lutheran pastor Martin Niemöller (1892–1984). It is about the cowardice of German intellectuals and certain clergy—including, by his own admission, Niemöller himself—following the Nazis' rise to power and subsequent incremental purging of their chosen targets, group after group.

Martin Niemöller was a German Lutheran pastor and theologian born in Lippstadt, Germany, in 1892. Niemöller was an anti-Communist and supported Adolf Hitler's rise to power. But when, after he came to power, Hitler insisted on the supremacy of the state over religion, Niemöller became disillusioned. He became the leader of a group of German clergymen opposed to Hitler. In 1937 he was arrested and eventually confined in Sachsenhausen and Dachau. [...]

Did you literally just quote a random poem you didn't even know anything about?

 

[Jainarayan]

Many vaccinated people are still at relatively high risk of severe illness or death if they're elderly, immunocompromised, or undergoing a treatment like chemotherapy, to name a few examples.

That can be said for anything.

There are reasons for a lot of people to worry even after getting vaccinated, which is where others' role comes in to ensure they aren't putting those people at unnecessarily elevated risk.

No, I disagree. It is not my responsibility. It behooves the persons at risk to take precautions. Where is the line where my responsibility stops?

 

[Jainarayan]

From the article I linked to and asked you to read:

Where did I make a comparison to the Nazis? That poem has been widely used for a number of situations where people turn a blind eye. If you knew anything of history you’d know the same blind eyes were turned during the Soviet era, the regimes of the South American dictators and China. Drop your Nazi fixation.

 

[Kooky]

Where did I make a comparison to the Nazis?

So you simply refuse to read the quotes in my post and the article I linked to?

If you cannot even do this very basic, effectively ground level of necessary research in order to engage with the subject under discussion, then I frankly don't see the point in continueing to talk to you.

We are done, please do not engage me in discussion ever again.

 

[Jainarayan]

How about you stop with the nonsensical ad hominems and address my argument?

I’ve made no ad hominems. Your comments show a lack of knowledge of history. That’s no ad hominem. And you can also stop your borderline ad hominems and badgering that I’m a danger.

 

[Debater Slayer]

That can be said for anything.

How come? Currently, no communicable diseases that have equal or more potential to kill or make the groups I mentioned severely sick are as widespread as COVID. It's mainly about the odds of infection and major complications; the common cold is widespread but not nearly as contagious or as potentially dangerous as COVID.

No, I disagree. It is not my responsibility. It behooves the persons at risk to take precautions. Where is the line where my responsibility stops?

In my opinion, the line stops where it is feasible for others to take precautions that are sufficient to protect them. If someone doesn't even wear a mask, it isn't my responsibility to completely remove myself from the space they're in just to protect them.

However, if they take all medically advised precautions such as wearing masks and observing social distancing, at that point I should also reasonably accommodate their health issues by making sure to, for example, not get too close to them without wearing a mask. Actually, I should do that anyway, but it's even more pressing when they make it clear via their actions that they can't afford to take any health risks related to the virus.

 

[Kooky]

badgering that I’m a danger.

Show me where I said this.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Then you need to shut the **** up and stop suggesting I’m a danger when you don’t know a thing about me.

... because I don't know if you're being honest? That's the reason I gave.

I can speak to the risk that your online persona, if he's a real person, poses to others... but I can't say for sure if that persona is real.

What did the microcovid calculator say?

 

[Jainarayan]

... because I don't know if you're being honest? That's the reason I gave.

I can speak to the risk that your online persona, if he's a real person, poses to others... but I can't say for sure if that persona is real.

Just come right out and call me a liar and a phony. It will be quicker and cleaner.

 

[Jainarayan]

then I frankly don't see the point in continueing to talk to you.

We are done, please do not engage me in discussion ever again.

Works for me... I’ve gotten nowhere anyway.

 

[SA Huguenot]

How much immunity do you think is enough?

How low do you think a person's risk of infection (reinfection in your case) or transmission should be where we say "okay - that's good enough. We don't need to go any lower"?

Bonus question: why did you decide on that number?

I mean, you're saying that someone who has naturally acquired immunity to COVID shouldn't need to get vaccinated... but we know that:

• The risk of reinfection isn't zero.
• The risk of reinfection gets much lower if the person who's had COVID is vaccinated (one source)

... so we know your standard isn't "as low a risk as possible without putting undue burdens on people"; it's something else. There's a threshold that you've decided is good enough... so where is that threshold and why did you place it there?

therefore you are relaying Fauchj's brainvax that we will forever have to be masked, and every few months or so, have to get an updated vaccine?

When do you think these brainvax superstar scientists will agree that humans will have to get immune by nature, and those who dont survive, would have died anyhow.

They created such hysteria that people forgot that they do not live forever.
It is as if the scientists wants to give assurance that death is a scarce thing that can be stopped.

I say, Covid is a terrible flue, and people dying from it, had underlying diseases.
I made a contract with my wife, that they will never place me on a machine to keep me alive. If I get Covid again, I know I have natural immunity, and my chances to die is very slim.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

therefore you are relaying Fauchj's brainvax that we will forever have to be masked, and every few months or so, have to get an updated vaccine?

When do you think these brainvax superstar scientists will agree that humans will have to get immune by nature, and those who dont survive, would have died anyhow.

They created such hysteria that people forgot that they do not live forever.
It is as if the scientists wants to give assurance that death is a scarce thing that can be stopped.

I say, Covid is a terrible flue, and people dying from it, had underlying diseases.
I made a contract with my wife, that they will never place me on a machine to keep me alive. If I get Covid again, I know I have natural immunity, and my chances to die is very slim.

How about you try again and actually answer the question this time?