Does having a religion make you a better person?

[TLK Valentine]

I don’t disagree with you… “ that far too many people who claim the title of “Christian” are more beholden to the institution, while paying only token lip service to the man, and almost none to his instructions”.
As Jesus said…
“Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.”
Matthew 7:13-14

And yet as Paul said...
"Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved."
Romans 10-13

Who then to believe? The One who had the idea, or the one who made it into an Institution?

 

[TLK Valentine]

That is exactly while Paul goes into great detail that the Gospel message is not about keeping the law, rather about Grace and responding to God in love, not law-keeping which leads to self-righteousness.

So what happens when Christians seek power, and choose to use Christianity to write the laws that they expect the rest of us to keep?
I've noticed that such Christians tend to invoke Paul a lot more than Jesus for their justification...

 

[InChrist]

And yet as Paul said...
"Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved."
Romans 10-13

Who then to believe? The One who had the idea, or the one who made it into an Institution?

I don’t think you can take one verse out of context from the entirety of Paul’s words or the NT, which also state that there are those who do use and abuse the Lord’s name for their own benefit, personal gain or power.

 

[ppp]

Even with a basic understanding of the Bible one would realize that Nazi Germany was not following the scriptures, certainly not Jesus Christ who was born a Jew. It’s the epitome of antichrist behavior to treat and kill the Jewish people/ God’s chosen people (as well as others) the way Hitler and the Nazis did. Hitler was heavily involved in the occult, so was led by satan and filled with an antichrist spirit.
On the other hand, there were those like Corrie ten Boom and Dietrich Bonhoeffer who were true Christians in resistance to the Nazis.

The practice of ghettoizing, demonizing, persecuting, scapegoating, enslaving, and killing Jews did not start with the Nazis or end with them. These were all practiced throughout Christendom from at least the 600s when France, Spain and the Church colluded to implement a policy of forced baptisms. Conditions bettered or worsened based on the rulers (Church and Country) at any given time. The only thing the Nazis added to the common cycle of those Christian practices was industrialization.

 

[InChrist]

So what happens when Christians seek power, and choose to use Christianity to write the laws that they expect the rest of us to keep?
I've noticed that such Christians tend to invoke Paul a lot more than Jesus for their justification...

Can you give an example?

 

[InChrist]

The practice of ghettoizing, demonizing, persecuting, scapegoating, enslaving, and killing Jews did not start with the Nazis or end with them. These were all practiced throughout Christendom from at least the 600s when France, Spain and the Church colluded to implement a policy of forced baptisms. Conditions bettered or worsened based on the rulers (Church and Country) at any given time. The only thing the Nazis added to the common cycle of those Christian practices was industrialization.

That’s right, it didn’t start with the Nazis. What you are referring to when you say “the Church” was the Roman Catholic Church and the ruling popes which have a historical record of unbiblical/unChristisn antisemitism.

You may like to read the book below which goes over the RCC history:

A Woman Rides the Beast: The Roman Catholic Church and the Last Days: Hunt, Dave: 8601400717974: Amazon.com: Books

A Woman Rides the Beast: The Roman Catholic Church and the Last Days [Hunt, Dave] on Amazon.com. *FREE* shipping on qualifying offers. A Woman Rides the Beast: The Roman Catholic Church and the Last Days

www.amazon.com

 

[ADigitalArtist]

No. I think religion can be a helpful way for people to get structure and habits, which can be useful. Ditto if said religion helps you find ways to be introspective and practice mindfulness, or practice empathy and compassion. But you don't need religion to have those things, and you certainly don't need religion to have good or bad behavior.

I think religion can be a vehicle for constructive or destructive behavior, with the latter often owing itself to outsourcing moral judgement to a third party, where virtue ethics replaces consequentialism.
But of course irreligious people can do the same thing, just with less 'my motivation for treating x minority poorly comes from divine command.'

 

[Link]

And yet as Paul said...
"Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved."
Romans 10-13

Who then to believe? The One who had the idea, or the one who made it into an Institution?

Paul (a) the blessed saint is talking about the name which is the word God has chosen to represent himself, which is his chosen, which Jesus (a) was an instance of. This about Ismal Atham concept in Shiism in my view.

I think if you read his sword of God and holy spirit concept, you have to keep in mind. From Moses (a) to Jesus (a)- there were representatives of God chosen as that. There were his word brought to life to that point.

Now, with Jesus (a) gone, it get's complicated. Simon (a) is a good person, pious, a saint chosen by God and Jesus (a) not chosen in the same was as Moses (a) and Jesus (a) as he is not God's sword nor an instance of the holy spirit.

So how to transition the community till the praised/comforter would come and return of those who are the instances of God's word brought to life? There had to be reliance on the holy spirit of God and recognizing his name when hidden.

The sword of God on earth was now Elijah (a) for Jesus (a) said he was the light of the world so long as he was in the world. Through Elijah (a) people can connect to heavenly sky and even access Jesus (a) who was risen to there, and has not died.

Also Paul (a) vindicates Lot (a) for a reason. This is because all God's chosen are righteous and remain so, per the true creed. And he explained from Adam (a) to now, there been guidance from God in form of his chosen leaders.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

And yet as Paul said...
"Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved."
Romans 10-13

Who then to believe? The One who had the idea, or the one who made it into an Institution?

According to Romans 10:8–13, whoever declares with their mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believes in their heart that God raised him from the dead will be saved. Not only that, but they are justified by the belief in their heart and the profession of their faith in Jesus, and they will not be put to shame. In fact, verse 13 clearly states, "Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved." And Ephesians 2:8–9 states, "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast." However, there is an apparent loophole in this seemingly hopeful promise, such as the implication that a person could still be stripped of their salvation and be eternally damned if they don't follow God's will.

I'm referring to Matthew 7:21, which states, "Not everyone who says to me, "Lord, Lord," will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven," and the parable of the sheep and goats (Matthew 25:31–46). The "sheep" in the parable were rewarded with eternal life for their good works of feeding the hungry, giving water to people who are thirsty, inviting in a stranger, clothing the needy, and visiting the sick or people in prison. Jesus, however, lambasted the "goats" in this parable for failing to feed the hungry, quench the thirst of the thirsty, welcome strangers, clothe the needy, or pay visits to the ill or those in prison. Jesus cursed them and sent them to eternal damnation. The "goats" lacked the good works to be rewarded with eternal life, in spite of the fact that they were Christians who accepted Jesus as their lord and savior. Herein lies another inconsistent message in the Bible, in my opinion, as Romans 10:8–13 states that a person will be saved if they declare with their mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in their heart that God raised Jesus from the dead. Ephesians 2:8–9 states, "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast." The "God is love!" theme is the whole crux of Christianity and the essential message of Christian evangelism.

It is an integral part of the evangelical strategy Christians typically use to persuade non-Christians into converting to Christianity. Of course, they are more likely to attract potential converts with feel-good messages like "God is love!" or "God loves you!" than with a message like this: "The Bible says that God is love, but it also says that God hates and is a jealous God, and there are repeated threats in the Bible about his wrath and sending the people who didn't ask for his forgiveness to hell for their sins against him. Oh, and that's not to mention the verses about God ordering the execution of witches, ordering the Israelites to kill every man, woman, child, and infant from another nation, and killing every living person on earth, with the exception of one family, in a global flood. But just ignore all of that and focus solely on our 'God is love' message." I'm sure that a gospel message like that one would undoubtedly put a significant damper on their evangelism efforts. I was an evangelical Christian for 30 years, as well as a street preacher and the leader of an evangelism team, so I understand that Christians prefer to depict God and Christianity in the best possible light. I know that Christians who evangelize want the non-Christians they've targeted to focus on the positive scriptures about God's alleged loving and merciful behavior toward humanity and not pay any attention to all the negative scriptures depicting him with sadistic and psychopathic behavior, as well as demonstrating barbaric and genocidal behavior by killing humans with impunity. When I was an evangelism team leader, I was advised to mention scriptures that negatively depicted God. I was instructed to cite only positive verses about God.

"For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life." - John 3:16

God so loves the world, huh? What about the wicked people that Proverbs 16:4 states he creates for his own purpose? Does he love them too?

"The LORD has made everything for his own purposes, even the wicked for a day of disaster." - Proverbs 16:4 (NLT)

For the record, Bible Hub provides several versions of this verse: Proverbs 16:4.

 

[ppp]

That’s right, it didn’t start with the Nazis. What you are referring to when you say “the Church” was the Roman Catholic Church and the ruling popes which have a historical record of unbiblical/unChristisn antisemitism.

No, my reference was to was one of the first large scale events. The problem did not get any better with the Protestants. It simply metastasized.

It does not matter whether or not you think the attitude is Biblical. It's there, through out your history.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

See you're blaming something you don't think even exists for things it cannot have done. ***STAFF EDIT***

I'm not the one stretching things to attack your character, that's how.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Even with a basic understanding of the Bible one would realize that Nazi Germany was not following the scriptures, certainly not Jesus Christ who was born a Jew. It’s the epitome of antichrist behavior to treat and kill the Jewish people/ God’s chosen people (as well as others) the way Hitler and the Nazis did. Hitler was heavily involved in the occult, so was led by satan and filled with an antichrist spirit.
On the other hand, there were those like Corrie ten Boom and Dietrich Bonhoeffer who were true Christians in resistance to the Nazis.

Thanks for proving my point. So many Christians simple do nothing more than point the finger, play the no true Scots card and them expect everyone else to own up to their bad apples.

 

[InChrist]

Thanks for proving my point. So many Christians simple do nothing more than point the finger, play the no true Scots card and them expect everyone else to own up to their bad apples.

So then what you are saying is that there can be no fake Christians, even though the NT contains numerous warnings about wolves in sheep’s clothing and false teachers.
If your rationale is correct then it should also apply across the board to other professions or callings in life, such as; all those who claim to be doctors are good- no bad quacks, all lawyers are honest-no dishonest ones, all teachers are good-never a bad one, etc.

 

[InChrist]

No, my reference was to was one of the first large scale events. The problem did not get any better with the Protestants. It simply metastasized.

It does not matter whether or not you think the attitude is Biblical. It's there, through out your history.

So what are you saying? Are you saying that because there have been those who have perpetuated evil in the name of Christ or Christianity, that discredits Christ and/or biblical Christianity?

 

[TLK Valentine]

I don’t think you can take one verse out of context from the entirety of Paul’s words or the NT, which also state that there are those who do use and abuse the Lord’s name for their own benefit, personal gain or power.

Perhaps not - but it's rather hard to look at a Bible and not come to the conclusion that it was designed specifically to take single verses out of context and use them as needed... they're even individually numbered.

But for that, we can thank the Institution, not the man.

 

[TLK Valentine]

Can you give an example?

American politics, really - where does the lion's of the anti-Abortion, anti-LGBT, etc., legislation get its justification from?

Talk to someone who says "They kicked God out of the schools!" and ask them if any god who can get "kicked out" was worthy of worship in the first place.
And if they advocate for public prayer, let them know that Mecca is that-a-way:

...and watch the fun begin.

I don't know how much experience you've had with such types; I've had too much.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

So then what you are saying is that there can be no fake Christians, even though the NT contains numerous warnings about wolves in sheep’s clothing and false teachers.

No. A fake Christian would be someone who is faking. Donald Trump very likely falls in this category. But those who aren't faking it and do believe? They still profess loyalty to Christ and worship his father. That makes them Christian.

If your rationale is correct then it should also apply across the board to other professions or callings in life, such as; all those who claim to be doctors are good- no bad quacks, all lawyers are honest-no dishonest ones, all teachers are good-never a bad one, etc.

Those things don't compare to people faking it and those doing what you don't approve of.

 

[ppp]

So what are you saying? Are you saying that because there have been those who have perpetuated evil in the name of Christ or Christianity, that discredits Christ and/or biblical Christianity?

No. I am saying that:

1. the Bible contains both good and evil standards, commandments and morals
2. most (if not all) of the assorted Christianities adhere to doctrines that are both good and evil
3. That the beliefs of Christianity makes it difficult, if not impossible, for Christians to acknowledge those faults
4. and that the inability to make such an admission is the greatest evil, because it disallows honest remediation of those views.

You care about protecting your rep and the rep of the Bible and Jesus. I care about empathy, equity, reciprocity and cooperation, and the effects of beliefs and actions on my fellow beings.

 

[Quintessence]

Given religion fundamentally deals with reconciling big, existential questions of life and living, yes - actively addressing those questions and finding meaningfulness in one's life makes one a "better" human. But only because humans seem incapable of not asking big existential questions and become miserable when they do not address them adequately in their lives.

 

[InChrist]

No. A fake Christian would be someone who is faking. Donald Trump very likely falls in this category. But those who aren't faking it and do believe? They still profess loyalty to Christ and worship his father. That makes them Christian.

Those things don't compare to people faking it and those doing what you don't approve of.

I disagree, as well I think the scriptures do. Some people think because they are an American, got baptized as an infant, or were raised going to church then they are a Christian.

“Also, some believe their recitation of a prayer or responding to an “altar call” alone may have turned them into a Christian. Many believe their religious traditions, such as being baptized as an infant, secured a spot in heaven for them, or that their plentiful good works alone have put them in good standing with God. And, of course, some believe church attendance alone guarantees salvation. The point is that many who profess to be Christians are not Christians at all. Yet they complacently remain convinced that all is well with their soul. Sadly, many will live their entire lives believing they were Christians only to one day hear these words from Jesus Christ: “I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!” (Matthew 7:23).”

Why are there so many fake Christians? | GotQuestions.org

Why are there so many fake Christians? Why do so many people claim to be Christians, but don’t live like Christians should?

www.gotquestions.org

Now, let’s say there a man who’s been an elder at church for ten years. He leads a Bible study, he takes communion, he prays beautiful prayers, counsels church members, and does all the things a Christian usually does. Everyone thinks he’s such a godly man. Yet, behind closed doors he’s abusive and controlling with his wife and kids. He knows how to hit where bruises won’t be visible to others. He reads and uses the Bible as a weapon against his family to threaten and control them. He has so deceived himself to believe he is a good Christian that is simply leading his family in godliness.
There is no way I would believe someone like this is a born again believer whose life has been submitted to and transformed by Jesus Christ.

“What Christians will not do, however, is engage in repeated or habitual sin (1 John 3:6). One who engages in deliberate and habitual sin is simply proving that he does not know Christ and therefore cannot be abiding in Him even though he may live his life under the vast umbrella of religion and is thought, therefore, by many to be a Christian.”

Why are there so many fake Christians? | GotQuestions.org

Why are there so many fake Christians? Why do so many people claim to be Christians, but don’t live like Christians should?

www.gotquestions.org