Difference in wages between men and women's jobs

[Draka]

I've also heard it said by a man, won't say from whom, that all things being entirely equal between two candidates for a job they would always prefer to hire the man because the woman is always more likely to miss work because she'll take time off to take care of children or have babies or whatnot, while a man will just let his wife handle that. So they will get more work out of a man because a man won't run off to take care of his family and will spend more time at work.

 

[Me Myself]

I've also heard it said by a man, won't say from whom, that all things being entirely equal between two candidates for a job they would always prefer to hire the man because the woman is always more likely to miss work because she'll take time off to take care of children or have babies or whatnot, while a man will just let his wife handle that. So they will get more work out of a man because a man won't run off to take care of his family and will spend more time at work.

Tis is a problem and naturally, a generalisation. Then again, in general, women do tend to be more oriented towards that than men. Surely because of the prior roles, in which men were the providers of food and shelter and women the providers of love. I agree with Warren in that I think most still think on these as their primary roles, nature vs nurture aside.

The discrimination you talk about does make sense, I have no doubt that happens, sadly.

On the other side, how frequent are paternity leaves in countries when it comes to law being equal for men and women? I am asking, I just dont know .

 

[Me Myself]

I wonder if she thinks it's ok that women are paid less because they take time off for work, because it's a personal choice and all that. And if she has considered charts that do show the wages of men and women working similar jobs?

According to Warren Faller, all things being equal, men earn slightly less than women.

What he says is that the salary gap happens because:

- men generally prefer better paid jobs rather than more fulfilling jobs and are more likely to take their career choices based on that.

- Men generally work more hours

-When the jobs are the same and ey work the same amonut of hours, the difference in payments also tend to come because the man has a specific specializaiton which makes his work be better priced, as an example a surgeon that is a cardiologist shouldnt be compared to a surgen that is not, given a cardiologist usually earns more

-finally, even if all of those things are equal, the difference tends to come when men are their own bosses , whatever the job they are performing in and women are not but all the rest is the same.

Allegedly, if both got the same career, specialisation, work hours and are their own bosses, they tend to gain the same, and if both have all of those equal but are not their own bosses they tend to gain the same .

He is a well respect professional on his fields, got PhD, has appeared more than once in Opprah (cant debate against Oprah! ) and only started with all of these after workiing for a time with the feminist movement known as NOW (national organisation of women ) and being very supportive of the campaign that talked about how female gain less than male.

You should lo him up. His chats are very interesting

 

[dust1n]

We've moved from Youtube videos from the 2010's to Youtube videos from the 1980's.

 

[oldbadger]

I've also heard it said by a man, won't say from whom, that all things being entirely equal between two candidates for a job they would always prefer to hire the man because the woman is always more likely to miss work because she'll take time off to take care of children or have babies or whatnot, while a man will just let his wife handle that. So they will get more work out of a man because a man won't run off to take care of his family and will spend more time at work.

Fathers get paternity leave over here......... they obviously don't need as much time as the mothers....

We're not sure (me and mrs badger) but we think that it might be legal for parents to switch roles now, thus increasing paternity leave and reducing maternity leave. A mother might need two months leave before the birth, but return to work as soon as she feels able to, and the father continue at home.

My boss does not mind maternity leave at all, because he loses employees to what is known here as 'churn' (employee turn-over), whereas his maternity-leave employees usually return, and they tell their mates that my boss is a really helpful bloke etc...... it helps his recruitment!

He only pays a small amount to paternity and maternity leave, and the jolly old gov adds on to it!

 

[Draka]

Oh, legally, there's paternity and maternity leave here. Men can take time off when their children are born, but it's less time than women and I guess, on average, men rarely take all the time that's offered to them. The point made to me was just simply, women take time away from work to pop out babies and to pick up sick kids from school or stay home with them when their home sick and so on, and men won't in general, leaving taking care of their children to their mothers. Thus, they get more "real work" out of a man than out of a woman.

 

[dust1n]

Maternity/paternity leave is covered under FMLA, under which companies over like.. 50 employees, must respect up to 12 weeks off unpaid (or use any accrued paid leave towards this) for any medical condition, emergency, pregnancy, birth or adoption of a child.

 

[Me Myself]

Oh, legally, there's paternity and maternity leave here. Men can take time off when their children are born, but it's less time than women and I guess, on average, men rarely take all the time that's offered to them. The point made to me was just simply, women take time away from work to pop out babies and to pick up sick kids from school or stay home with them when their home sick and so on, and men won't in general, leaving taking care of their children to their mothers. Thus, they get more "real work" out of a man than out of a woman.

Yeah I got the point. Stadistically, it is true, men dont tend to take as much time off as women, which is one of the reasons they can get more far ahead in the job because being there gives more opportunities.

As I said, it is still sad what you said happens, because they still couldn't know if the woman they interviewed would have taken even less time off an the man.

It would be nice more men took more time off to spend with their kids though.

 

[Me Myself]

We've moved from Youtube videos from the 2010's to Youtube videos from the 1980's.

Te Warren Farrel video is from 1980? But if it is, would you expect discrimination towards women in the workplace to have increased or decreased from thero now? Because as you can hear, the gap doesnt seem discrimination based at all.

I am googling more reent findings, for now I saw this:

Don

It mentions a study of 2005 about the same subject.

 

[Draka]

Yeah I got the point. Stadistically, it is true, men dont tend to take as much time off as women, which is one of the reasons they can get more far ahead in the job because being there gives more opportunities.

As I said, it is still sad what you said happens, because they still couldn't know if the woman they interviewed would have taken even less time off an the man.

It would be nice more men took more time off to spend with their kids though.

That, and all things appearing to be equal in the application and interviewing process, it doesn't necessarily mean that once hired that the man would automatically work any harder than the woman either or that he might not slack off or not perform as well as he advertised himself to be. You could hire a man, assuming you would get more work out of him, just assuming that you wouldn't get as much out of the woman, and what you turned away was a very hard-working competent and driven woman who is all about striving for that promotion, and what you ended up with was a lax guy who was just concerned with doing enough to get by and that's all.

 

[Me Myself]

Here is another link on the subject that is from 2011 data and tells us how career choice and choice of workplace is the major factor causing the pay gap between women and men.

The Wage Gap: Why Men Earn More - BusinessWeek

 

[Me Myself]

That, and all things appearing to be equal in the application and interviewing process, it doesn't necessarily mean that once hired that the man would automatically work any harder than the woman either or that he might not slack off or not perform as well as he advertised himself to be. You could hire a man, assuming you would get more work out of him, just assuming that you wouldn't get as much out of the woman, and what you turned away was a very hard-working competent and driven woman who is all about striving for that promotion, and what you ended up with was a lax guy who was just concerned with doing enough to get by and that's all.

Sure it can happen. Thats why I said it is sad it happens, because a woman that can be way more hardworking than the guy is going to be considered as if she is not. Just commented at statistically, men do are the ones who tend to be more hard-working IN THEIR PROFESSIONAL careers. Thats merely a "most" not a "all" of course. For some reason though, I imagine there are a lot more complete sloths in work that are men than the women figure xD, not that I would have any char about it, its merely a thought.

That may or may not be Simpsons inspired

 

[Koldo]

Fathers get paternity leave over here......... they obviously don't need as much time as the mothers....

We're not sure (me and mrs badger) but we think that it might be legal for parents to switch roles now, thus increasing paternity leave and reducing maternity leave. A mother might need two months leave before the birth, but return to work as soon as she feels able to, and the father continue at home.

My boss does not mind maternity leave at all, because he loses employees to what is known here as 'churn' (employee turn-over), whereas his maternity-leave employees usually return, and they tell their mates that my boss is a really helpful bloke etc...... it helps his recruitment!

He only pays a small amount to paternity and maternity leave, and the jolly old gov adds on to it!

In my country, mothers have a maternity leave of 4 months while fathers have only 5 days. Add to that a month of vacation that every employee has the right to per year. Not to mention leaves she may take due to a risky pregnancy, or not being able to work properly at the very last months.

 

[Me Myself]

In my country, mothers have a maternity leave of 4 months while fathers have only 5 days. Add to that a month of vacation that every employee has the right to per year. Not to mention leaves she may take due to a risky pregnancy, or not being able to work properly at the very last months.

I think fathers should have paternal leaves as long as women. True, they dont give to lactate, but they should still use the bonding time!

A good father role in the house is awesome for the kids according to statistics.

 

[dust1n]

Te Warren Farrel video is from 1980? But if it is, would you expect discrimination towards women in the workplace to have increased or decreased from thero now? Because as you can hear, the gap doesnt seem discrimination based at all.

I am googling more reent findings, for now I saw this:

Don

It mentions a study of 2005 about the same subject.

The gender income, wealth gap and gender corralling in the workplace has always gotten better since... feminism came around.

But I'm ducking out of this thread. This whole topic has become tiresome.

 

[Me Myself]

The gender income, wealth gap and gender corralling in the workplace has always gotten better since... feminism came around.

But I'm ducking out of this thread. This whole topic has become tiresome.

Then it must be either equal or detrimental to the man, because by 1970 the gap was because of the factors mentioned and not discrimination.

 

[Reverend Rick]

Sure it can happen. Thats why I said it is sad it happens, because a woman that can be way more hardworking than the guy is going to be considered as if she is not. Just commented at statistically, men do are the ones who tend to be more hard-working IN THEIR PROFESSIONAL careers. Thats merely a "most" not a "all" of course. For some reason though, I imagine there are a lot more complete sloths in work that are men than the women figure xD, not that I would have any char about it, its merely a thought.

That may or may not be Simpsons inspired

High paid people are expected to produce. If they don't, they don't last long. :no:

 

[Draka]

High paid people are expected to produce. If they don't, they don't last long. :no:

Unfortunately, my point was, that there are times where a woman that might have been an excellent producer at a job was completely disregarded as an applicant simply because it was assumed that she would take time off from work more than a man and thus get less work out of her. Employers that use such absurd hiring practices can surely miss out on some great employees.

 

[Me Myself]

High paid people are expected to produce. If they don't, they don't last long. :no:

I was not talking about high paid sloths when I said that if that was what you were thinking. Then again as I said, its just a guess, and a dumb one at that. If you didnt got that forthw simpsons mention

 

[Reverend Rick]

Unfortunately, my point was, that there are times where a woman that might have been an excellent producer at a job was completely disregarded as an applicant simply because it was assumed that she would take time off from work more than a man and thus get less work out of her. Employers that use such absurd hiring practices can surely miss out on some great employees.

I agree. Not every job requires you to be at work 9 to 5 every day. You just have to get things done in a timely manner. An employer that is flexable can get some great employees if they are willing to work with them.