Did God ever command to slavery per Quran?

[Link]

I don't trust humans or books that cannot provide evidence,the Bible and Quran are books of faith not facts imo.

That's fine, but you should give God a chance to prove things through his words.

 

[England my lionheart]

That's fine, but you should give God a chance to prove things through his words.

God hasn't spoken to me.

 

[Muffled]

This is true, but I believe in the case of the Bible, it has many contradictions, and Quran shows the foundations of the Bible to be true, but shows where it goes wrong as well.

I believe you quite misguided. The Bible does not have contradictions and the Qur'an does not show the Bible as being wrong.

 

[Muffled]

God hasn't spoken to me.

I believe God speaks through me so you can listen to me and you will be hearing God speak to you.

 

[firedragon]

I believe you quite misguided. The Bible does not have contradictions and the Qur'an does not show the Bible as being wrong.

Qur'an does not speak of the Bible

 

[Link]

Whatever the case maybe, can we stick to this topic?

 

[firedragon]

Translations. Bernard Lewis translates ma malakat aymanukum as "those whom you own." Abdullah Yusuf Ali translates it as "those whom your right hands possess", as does M. H. Shakir. N. J. Dawood translates the phrase more idiomatically as "those whom you own as slaves."

What your right hand posses seem pretty straightforward to mean slave.

The old testament includes how to treat your slaves,everybody had slaves back then,slavery was still ok till relatively recently.

Let’s say you wish to marry a slave

1. why would you marry a slave?

2. Why would you as for parents permission? Slaves parents.

think and respond brother.

 

[England my lionheart]

Let’s say you wish to marry a slave

1. why would you marry a slave?

2. Why would you as for parents permission? Slaves parents.

think and respond brother.

Easy answer,I wouldn't have a slave in the first place.

 

[England my lionheart]

I believe God speaks through me so you can listen to me and you will be hearing God speak to you.

That's interesting but if I answer directly it would be off topic and I don't wish to derail the thread.

 

[firedragon]

Easy answer,I wouldn't have a slave in the first place.

No. That’s an relevant answer.

let me ask this question again and see if you have the character of honoring a question.

Given a hypothetical situation

1. Why would you wish to marry a slave?
2. Why Would you ask for the slaves parents blessings?

this is asked because you insist ma malakuth aymanukum means slaves.

 

[England my lionheart]

No. That’s an relevant answer.

let me ask this question again and see if you have the character of honoring a question.

Given a hypothetical situation

1. Why would you wish to marry a slave?
2. Why Would you ask for the slaves parents blessings?

this is asked because you insist ma malakuth aymanukum means slaves.

I wouldn't marry a slave but if I had wanted to i would have to ask the slaves owner for their blessing,slaves after all have owners.

 

[firedragon]

I wouldn't marry a slave but if I had wanted to i would have to ask the slaves owner for their blessing,slaves after all have owners.

Right. So you would not marry a slave.

second, I didn’t ask about owners. I asked specifically about parents. I can see why you would answer the way you did which shows you are not honoring the question.

so there is actually no point in pursuing a discussion.

thanks for engaging brother. Peace.

 

[England my lionheart]

Right. So you would not marry a slave.

second, I didn’t ask about owners. I asked specifically about parents. I can see why you would answer the way you did which shows you are not honoring the question.

so there is actually no point in pursuing a discussion.

thanks for engaging brother. Peace.

Parents of a slave don't have ownership rights do they?.

slave
/sleɪv/

noun

1. (especially in the past) a person who is the legal property of another and is forced to obey them.
   "they kidnapped entire towns and turned them into slaves.

This is how slavery worked,still does in some places,back then it was widespread and common.

Now you could quote Quran passages that promote manumission with great reward,or marrying a slave but at the end of the day they are still a slave.

For a book that is supposedly a very clear message.

Sahih International: We have already sent Our messengers with clear evidences and sent down with them the Scripture and the balance that the people may maintain [their affairs] in justice.

Slavery still exists,not just in some Islamic countries,to many peoples disgust in Europe too,the argument that slavery would be gradually phased out instead of just saying "slavery is forbidden" makes little sense,now there is a grey area to be exploited by some followers of Islam throughout history because it's not clear at all imo.

 

[firedragon]

Parents of a slave don't have ownership rights do they?.

slave
/sleɪv/

noun

1. (especially in the past) a person who is the legal property of another and is forced to obey them.
   "they kidnapped entire towns and turned them into slaves.

This is how slavery worked,still does in some places,back then it was widespread and common.

Now you could quote Quran passages that promote manumission with great reward,or marrying a slave but at the end of the day they are still a slave.

For a book that is supposedly a very clear message.

Sahih International: We have already sent Our messengers with clear evidences and sent down with them the Scripture and the balance that the people may maintain [their affairs] in justice.

Slavery still exists,not just in some Islamic countries,to many peoples disgust in Europe too,the argument that slavery would be gradually phased out instead of just saying "slavery is forbidden" makes little sense,now there is a grey area to be exploited by some followers of Islam throughout history because it's not clear at all imo.

I truly cant understand why you would evade answering a question about the slaves parents. Strange. I didnt speak of owners or masters. I said "Parents".

You statement is not an answer. But fine, lets take it. So yes, of course a slaves parents dont have ownership. So why would you ask for their permission to marry a slave since they dont have ownership?

*By the way, if you wish to discuss modern day slavery etc you can open a new thread. It is also a good subject.

 

[Link]

I found this treasure recently:

Imam Ali (a) said:

"Adam never beget a slave man nor slave woman and all people are free"

You can see the scan of the hadith here:
Slavery, hadiths, Quran and how to study Islam. | Religious Forums

 

[loverofhumanity]

@Link You've certainly done your homework and bring some interesting points. I have read the Quran, but am by no means an expert on it. I am much more familiar with the Christian Bible having been brought up in a Christian family in the USA. Regarding slavery; IMHO, I don't think God approved of slavery so much as it was just tolerated in the times that the Bible and Quran were written. I see many places in scriptures that talk about slavery, but I don't see anywhere that God calls it good.

Slavery existed well before the Abrahamic religions and had become ingrained in many cultures. God never introduced it but gradually tried to wean humanity away from it by firstly regulating it then raise the issue of equality in the Quran but slavery was not abolished by any religion until Baha’u’llah formerly abolished it in His Book of Laws.

It is forbidden you to trade in slaves, be they men or women. It is not for him who is himself a servant to buy another of God’s servants, and this hath been prohibited in His Holy Tablet. Thus, by His mercy, hath the commandment been recorded by the Pen of justice. Let no man exalt himself above another. (Baha’u’llah)

This is the first Holy Scripture in the history of mankind to my knowledge to formally abolish slavery. From around this time slavery began to be abolished throughout the world during the 19th century.

In 1839, after Baha’u’llah’s father passed away He began freeing all the slaves in His household and penned this very touching prayer to God.


Sanctified art Thou, O my God! At this moment, one slave (mamlūk) is standing before another slave and seeks, from him, his freedom.

Yet his owner, himself, is naught but a slave of Thee, a servant in Thy Threshold, and absolute nothingness before the manifestations of Thy Lordship.

Standing before Thee, I bear witness, at this very moment, to that which Thou hast testified by Thyself for Thyself, that verily Thou art God and there is none other God but Thee …

All mighty kings are mere slaves before the gate of Thy grace, and all the wealthy are the essence of poverty in the shore of Thy holy dominion, and all the exalted are abject lowliness within the glorified court of Thy bounty.

Notwithstanding this, how then can this slave claim for himself ownership of any other human being? Nay, his existence is a mere crime, graver than any sin in Thy kingdom …

And now, O my God, since that servant hath asked from this servant his freedom, therefore, I call Thee to witness, at this moment, that I am setting him free in Thy path, liberating him in Thy name, and emancipating his neck from the chain of servitude, so that he may serve Thee in the daytime and in the night season, longing that my neck would never be relieved from the cord of Thy servitude.

This verily is my most cherished desire and my supreme end. – Baha’u’llah, unpublished Tablet (A08212). Provisional translation by Nader Saiedi, Ph.D.

 

[Link]

Regulating would be condoning it!

 

[loverofhumanity]

Regulating would be condoning it!

Maybe it was the wrong word but in the Bible it sets forth things like how slaves are to be treated. But in some verses it accepts slavery as the norm. I don’t take that to mean God agrees with it but would abolishing it then have made any difference as opposed to the 19th century?

Here are a lot of Biblical verses regarding slavery. What do you think?

Bible Verses About Slavery

 

[Link]

I believe it was never allowed by God.

 

[Muffled]

This is true, but I believe in the case of the Bible, it has many contradictions, and Quran shows the foundations of the Bible to be true, but shows where it goes wrong as well.

I believe you are incorrect o both counts: contradictions and corrections. I believe this comes from misinterpreting the Qu'ran.