Curriculum Body in India Decided To Drop Evolution and Periodic Table From School Science

[ajay0]

Can you explain why the periodic table is not appropriate for grade 10 students?
Over here (in Australia) they already learn it in 6th through to 8th grades.

Same for evolution i believe.

Educators in India have emphasized more importance on vocational training for students and lesser importance for other subject material which is more memorised for grades than anything else.

I had memorised the periodic table elements and its symbols when I studied it in eighth, but I did not make much use of it for the rest of my life other than boasting to friends of my memorizing ability.

Also what use is the periodic table or evolution to be of people who are interested in commerce or humanities or other non-stem subjects !

I actually wish I learned some accounting lessons in those grades that would have been useful to me than the periodic table.

But what proportion of hindus do Vivekananda and Aurobindo represent the scientific beliefs of? I understand Hinduism to be diverse rather than homogeneous, so is it reasonable to expect different hindus will have different beliefs about evolution? My wife is Hindu and she seems to believe God "made" everything.

India being an ancient civilization has an ancient tradition of science and mathematics .

Indian mathematics - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The numeral system and basic mathematics such as zero, arithmetic, decimal system, negative numbers, trigonometry originated in India and learnt by the Arabs who taught it to the europeans later on.

The Indian numeral system and arithmetic was found to be superior to the roman numeral system in terms of accounting and indepth calculations, and after initial resistance in Europe for a few centuries due to its foreign origin, was finally accepted by western scholars as a valid and superior mathematical system for calculation purposes.

In the early part of sixth century A.D., Indian physicist Aryabhata calculated the sidereal rotation (the rotation of the earth referencing the fixed stars) as 23 hours, 56 minutes, and 4.1 seconds; the modern value is 23:56:4.091. Similarly, his value for the length of the sidereal year at 365 days, 6 hours, 12 minutes, and 30 seconds (365.25858 days)is an error of 3 minutes and 20 seconds over the length of a year (365.25636 days).

Indian mathematics reached Europe six centuries later after Aryabhata. So you can see from here Indian math and science set the benchmark in those times.

This wide acceptance of Indian mathematics for calculation purposes led to significant advances in world science, technology and accounting.

But what proportion of hindus do Vivekananda and Aurobindo represent the scientific beliefs of?

See, Hindu philosophy is divided into jnana yoga (yoga of the intellect) and bhakti yoga (yoga of emotion).

As Plato said, intellectuals are always in a minority and the emotionalists are mostly in the majority. Most fanatic ideas and fanaticism comes from emotion-based religions incapable of objective thought.

Vivekananda and Aurobindo are Jnana yogis, and so their proportion is bound to be not large. However the intellectual class and leadership adhere to their ideas and consequently they are spreading at a fast pace.

 

[danieldemol]

Educators in India have emphasized more importance on vocational training for students and lesser importance for other subject material which is more memorised for grades than anything else.

I had memorised the periodic table elements and its symbols when I studied it in eighth, but I did not make much use of it for the rest of my life other than boasting to friends of my memorizing ability.

Also what use is the periodic table or evolution to be of people who are interested in commerce or humanities or other non-stem subjects !

Well according to my understanding in Australia commerce and humanities are taught in grades 7 to 10 as well, so I'm not sure its an either or situation.

I actually wish I learned some accounting lessons in those grades that would have been useful to me than the periodic table.

Perhaps this is the case, I guess they prioritise the periodic table over advanced accounting skills is because few turn out to be accountants, but due to the changing nature of the workforce many will need basic scientific literacy. But I'm no expert so I don't know for sure, that's just what I gleaned from the rationale given for stem subjects from a quick googling at the following link;

https://www.education.gov.au/australian-curriculum/national-stem-education-resources-toolkit/introductory-material-what-stem/why-stem-important

India being an ancient civilization has an ancient tradition of science and mathematics .

Indian mathematics - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The numeral system and basic mathematics such as zero, arithmetic, decimal system, negative numbers, trigonometry originated in India and learnt by the Arabs who taught it to the europeans later on.

The Indian numeral system and arithmetic was found to be superior to the roman numeral system in terms of accounting and indepth calculations, and after initial resistance in Europe for a few centuries due to its foreign origin, was finally accepted by western scholars as a valid and superior mathematical system for calculation purposes.

In the early part of sixth century A.D., Indian physicist Aryabhata calculated the sidereal rotation (the rotation of the earth referencing the fixed stars) as 23 hours, 56 minutes, and 4.1 seconds; the modern value is 23:56:4.091. Similarly, his value for the length of the sidereal year at 365 days, 6 hours, 12 minutes, and 30 seconds (365.25858 days)is an error of 3 minutes and 20 seconds over the length of a year (365.25636 days).

Indian mathematics reached Europe six centuries later after Aryabhata. So you can see from here Indian math and science set the benchmark in those times.

This wide acceptance of Indian mathematics for calculation purposes led to significant advances in world science, technology and accounting.




See, Hindu philosophy is divided into jnana yoga (yoga of the intellect) and bhakti yoga (yoga of emotion).

As Plato said, intellectuals are always in a minority and the emotionalists are mostly in the majority. Most fanatic ideas and fanaticism comes from emotion-based religions incapable of objective thought.

Vivekananda and Aurobindo are Jnana yogis, and so their proportion is bound to be not large. However the intellectual class and leadership adhere to their ideas and consequently they are spreading at a fast pace.

Well that's good I guess, but I think stem subjects which give kids basic scientific literacy and critical thinking skills make them less manipuateable by emotionalists. I would think that's a good aid for the leadership to spread their ideas if its emotionalists they are opposing.

 

[ajay0]

Well according to my understanding in Australia commerce and humanities are taught in grades 7 to 10 as well, so I'm not sure its an either or situation.

Perhaps this is the case, I guess they prioritise the periodic table over advanced accounting skills is because few turn out to be accountants, but due to the changing nature of the workforce many will need basic scientific literacy. But I'm no expert so I don't know for sure, that's just what I gleaned from the rationale given for stem subjects from a quick googling at the following link;

https://www.education.gov.au/australian-curriculum/national-stem-education-resources-toolkit/introductory-material-what-stem/why-stem-important

In the lower grades till tenth, there is too much emphasis on scientific literacy and virtually nothing on accounting and financial literacy., which is meant for higher grades. I think this is highly unbalanced because everyone needs financial literacy in life, including scientists and engineers, especially when they take to business and entrepreneurship.

Well that's good I guess, but I think stem subjects which give kids basic scientific literacy and critical thinking skills make them less manipuateable by emotionalists. I would think that's a good aid for the leadership to spread their ideas if its emotionalists they are opposing.

India has the largest pool of scientists, doctors and engineer graduates in the world at the moment due to heavy emphasis on these subjects by the government. However this has caused a deficiency of trained personnel in the humanities.

Science does not have a moral dimension. It is like a knife. If you give it to a surgeon or a murderer, each will use it differently. — Wernher von Braun.

There has been a heavy emphasis on science and technology in the west but you can see that both world wars emerged in europe killing over a hundred million people, which was a significant percentage of the world population at those times. Germany, which had the best scientists and engineers in the world then, started both wars including the holocausts.

Advancements in science and technology has created weapons which has become far superior killing machines than anything in the past, and this is a dynamic process now with many advanced weaponry becoming obsolete.

A third world war with nuclear weapons, a very probable event, can end western civilization permanently any moment.

So you can see that scientific literacy is not synonymous with wisdom and progress, unless it is aligned with morality and ethics.

 

[ronki23]

It was only dropped for education up to 16. You can still learn it for 16-18 education.


[There is something wrong with RF because everything from yesterday/ day before keeps getting deleted]

 

[Revoltingest]

That's indoctrination. Facts should be taught.

Both sides want to "indoctrinate". Each side
likes to apply the label only to the other, but
never to themselves. Such people can never
see themselves as outsiders do, eh.
It's unavoidable anyway, so the issues are...
- Which agendas?
- To what extent?

 

[Revoltingest]

No, they really, actually aren't that big into education, especially the Evangelical Christians among them. That group especially is distrustful of education (and have been for a long time), places very little value of skills trade or college, and is prone to believing the only things worth knowing come from the Bible (and even then, American Church History has examples of pastors who couldn't read and never read the Bible).

Oh, you true believers....just can't see
any merit in the other side. They're
just pure evil. They say the same of
you liberals.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Oh, you true believers....just can't see
any merit in the other side. They're
just pure evil. They say the same of
you liberals.

I was one of them. I know how they are. And, yes, education isn't very big on their list, esoecially college, because they are very aware that learning outside their bubble is bad for believing in a literalist interpretation of the Bible.
Bible learning and serving Jehovah is what they promote.

 

[Revoltingest]

I was one of them. I know how they are. And, yes, education isn't very big on their list, esoecially college, because they are very aware that learning outside their bubble is bad for believing in a literalist interpretation of the Bible.
Bible learning and serving Jehovah is what they promote.

Perhaps your view is wrongly colored by
having lived in rural Indiana. I don't see
the same views among Republicans I know,
who value education greatly. And many
are heathens...not Christians.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Perhaps your view is wrongly colored by
having lived in rural Indiana. I don't see
the same views among Republicans I know,
who value education greatly. And many
are heathens...not Christians.

With Bible Literalism being brought up that should help narrow the scope so you know who I'm talking about.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Both sides want to "indoctrinate". Each side
likes to apply the label only to the other, but
never to themselves. Such people can never
see themselves as outsiders do, eh.
It's unavoidable anyway, so the issues are...
- Which agendas?
- To what extent?

Teaching evolution rather than Creationism in a science class isn't indoctrination. Teaching languages developed in groups and originated from a few places isn't indoctrination.

in·doc·tri·na·tion​

/inˌdäktrəˈnāSH(ə)n/

noun
the process of teaching a person or group to accept a set of beliefs uncritically.

 

[Revoltingest]

With Bible Literalism being brought up that should help narrow the scope so you know who I'm talking about.

I've met very few who ever believed Bible literalism.
Methinks you describe a large group by a mere segment.
Prejudice.

 

[Revoltingest]

Teaching evolution rather than Creationism in a science class isn't indoctrination. Teaching languages developed in groups and originated from a few places isn't indoctrination.

in·doc·tri·na·tion​

/inˌdäktrəˈnāSH(ə)n/

noun
the process of teaching a person or group to accept a set of beliefs uncritically.

Of course that's indoctrination.
But that doesn't invalidate my view that both sides try to indoctrinate.
Of course, they vary in topic & extent.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Of course that's indoctrination.
But that doesn't invalidate my view that both sides try to indoctrinate.
Of course, they vary in topic & extent.

You are arguing against a dictionary definition? Science isn't indoctrination as the antithesis is an absolute necessity for science for to work.

 

[Revoltingest]

You are arguing against a dictionary definition?

Not at all.
I'm disagreeing with views that only the right wants to indoctrinate kids.

 

[Karma77]

Its almost like they are dumbing them down.

Curriculum Body in India Decided To Drop Evolution and Periodic Table From School Science

"In April 2023, it was widely reported in India that the topic of evolution would be cut from the curriculum for students aged 15-16. The extent of changes became clearer when the National Council of Educational Research & Training (NCERT) released a textbook for the new academic year that started in May. NCERT is the public organization in the country that developed curriculum and textbooks in Indian schools.......

Closing Important Chapters​

The syllabus for class-10 students composed of 15-16 years olds does not include an entire chapter on the periodic table of elements. Meanwhile, whole chapters about sources of energy and environmental sustainability have also been removed. The changes also include eliminating a small section of Michael Faraday's involvement in studying electricity and magnetism in the 19th century.

For younger students, they will no longer be taught certain topics about pollution and climate while older school students will experience cuts to subjects such as biology, physics, chemistry, mathematics, and geography. Changes in other subjects include the removal of chapters on democracy and diversity and political parties. For older students, a chapter on the industrial revolution has been removed.......

NCERT also wants to promote the country's pride and maintain the richness of its ancient and modern culture and traditions. Some people interpret this as a way to learn more about the precolonial history of science in the country."

Curriculum Body in India Decided To Drop Evolution and Periodic Table From School Science, Sparking Protest From Educators and Researchers

A curriculum organization in India removed foundational topics from school textbooks, leading to protest by science educators and researchers. Find out more about it in this article.

www.sciencetimes.com

Can you explain why the periodic table is not appropriate for grade 10 students?
Over here (in Australia) they already learn it in 6th through to 8th grades.

Same for evolution i believe.

But what proportion of hindus do Vivekananda and Aurobindo represent the scientific beliefs of? I understand Hinduism to be diverse rather than homogeneous, so is it reasonable to expect different hindus will have different beliefs about evolution? My wife is Hindu and she seems to believe God "made" everything.

Don't say NCERT wants to do that because I found out that the 2 of main NCERT officers resigned after these changes. These changes are being brought about by the politicians. Thanks to Modi Government. People are unable to recognize that Modi is actually the devil presenting himself as God. Hiinduism is all about accepting people from various backgrounds and beliefs. Modi is teaching exactly the opposite.
In fact, the worst he has done is to mess up with people's interpretation of Dharma. Dharma meant righteousness. Like the Mahabharat war, was not a war of religion. It was a war of righteousness or Dharma after the daughter-in-law, Draupadi was disrobed in a court full of Kings. But Modi is teaching people to fight for Dharma and giving it the meaning as - Religion. Now these instigated people say that they want to fight for Hindu Dharma and they have started killing people of other religions especially Muslims in the name of Sri Ram...my foot! He has messed up with everybody's mind. And they've even forgotten the concept of Karma. That they will have to pay the karma of this hurt and killings that they are bringing upon others.

 

[Lyndon]

Modi is a fascist disease!!

 

[Brickjectivity]

Its almost like they are dumbing them down.

In a way its good, because I really believe that you cannot institutionalize truth. You can teach it for a time. Look how hard it is to read laws and contracts in America. You need genius level education, now. Look at how hard public education strives here, yet it seems to get worse. There is something about ignorance that spurs education and hunger for knowledge though it is also the ignorant who oppose knowledge. What I mean is that a consistent formula always breaks, so maybe its good for school to change things up.

 

[wellwisher]

The problem with teaching evolution is it still uses casino math. Politics and gaming parlors also uses casino math, which can cause real science to become gamed political science. Could evolution be taught without casino math and the games politicians play?

Why doesn't evolution start before the premise of the first replicators, instead of at the first replicators? It would be like starting the story of own history, at an arbitrary time, like 21 years old, and then try to ignore anything before that, as though your childhood and teen years can be ignored in terms of your longer term development. It seems more like the theory is pandering to a sweet spot for the casino math, and not to evolution, itself.

The casino math is not very useful before the replicator premise. It sort of works at replicators. Gambling for science is not something that children need to be taught In schools. Science is not about gambling games, even though so much of science has taken that route. This has made science more political; black box=political science mystery cult.

How does evolution take into account water, since DNA, RNA and protein have all evolved to make important uses of hydrogen bonding, just like water did billons of years before life. Water was here before the replicators, and water is still the majority component of life. Evolution can be made into real science, but it needs to get rid of the casino math approach and its starting sweet spot premise, designed for casino math. May I suggest gamblers anonymous? Once you have got past the addiction, we can talk real science.

India gave gambling science a time out since it can turn children into black box addicts. Evolution has potential as a science, but its current methodology is too hocus pocus to be taught to children. Children may not know there is another more rational approach to science, if we give too much attention and showcase casino science. How will a child process science of odds other than as a type of mystery religion.

Einstein did not believe that God chose to play dice with the universe. This can translated as do not try to explain the universe with casino math. Einstein was about reason and rational efficiency; E=MC2. The children are better off being rational and not addicted to the gaming magic of the black box.

At least religions teaches a God who is higher than humans and therefore can reason, plan and execute in ways that are subject to reason, once we; humans discover the mysteries of life. Black box science did help to settle some things needed for reason, but it also inhibits what is needed to settle the mystery of life, by keeping the spirits of the black box, alive.

 

[metis]

Einstein did not believe that God chose to play dice with the universe. This can translated as do not try to explain the universe with casino math. Einstein was about reason and rational efficiency; E=MC2. The children are better off being rational and not addicted to the gaming magic of the black box.

That was his reference to quantum mechanics, which we now know is very much real. Matter of fact, Google just announced it has built the 1st quantum computer.

 

[Karma77]

Modi is a fascist disease!!

I agree! I pray for all Indians to get Peace in 2024 and awaken to the truth of Modi. They should somehow watch the banned documentary of Modi. Only if somebody could make that documentary reach all the Indians specifically in the Hindi language...