Tumah
Veteran Member
You said the last one not the second to last one.
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Creating your own personal God and religion
- Thread starter The Transcended Omniverse
- Start date
interminable
منتظر
Look
Baha'i and the one u mentioned and wahabi all of them are counted as sectarians in Islam
They aren't new religions
Thanks to the US and specially UK these sectarians were extended to destroy genuine Islam and make conflict between Shia and sunny
Robert Vincelette
Member
Perhaps you are dissatisfied with all the compromises the available religions have made in order to be more successful in the marketplace. Religion is an attempt to estimate a model of God and because to be successful religions made by consensus of groups have a high risk of sacrificing how good a model they can estimate. Thus, we may have to do it on our own if we believe in some sort of God. We must be careful to accept that we cannot know, let alone know enough to acquiesce to desires and demands by other to fill in our model with too many details that it is hard to accept we cannot have and we must take care not to embellish it with details that are designed even unconsciously solely to serve our self-interests.
Tumah
Veteran Member
Oh yeah, I forgot about Baha'i. They're even younger.
I don't fink Shia and Sunni need Baha'i and other Islamic sects to encourage them into conflict.
But regardless, your question was whether to believe in the oldest religion or the newest. If by first religion you meant Judaism, than there are two options:
1. What Jews believe Judaism is about.
2. What Muslims believe Judaism should have been about.
If you meant the first one, than you mean to separate each religion on its own merits. In that case, Baha'i and Ahmadiyya should certainly fall into your line of question.
If you meant the second one, then essentially all you were asking was "which religion? Islam or Islam?" Which isn't much of a question at all.
jonathan180iq
Well-Known Member
jonathan180iq
Well-Known Member
I don't understand why you're so determined to believe in a god and an afterlife that, for all intents in purposes, you don't seem to actually believe in...
From previous posts like this one, I understand that you don't like the idea of a punishing god. You don't like the Christian doctrine of original sin and atonement. You don't like the idea of an all-loving god banishing people to Hell for thought crimes. And I can understand that - I mean, they're ridiculous concepts.
But why do you need to invoke a god argument at all? Why do you need to make up an all-loving deity who promises eternal life in the perfect sphere? Why not spend more time focusing on your contentment in the real world?
Why not be more productive by living this life that you want to live instead of getting stuck in this circular argument with yourself about a position that is ultimately untenable?
None of these things are real...
If you recognize that gods and afterlives are just personally invented philosophies about the world, why do you bother holding on to them at all? Let them go, like the archaic relics that they are.
Punishment for disbelief?
If such a thing exists, it is immoral to begin with.
Not a worry.
Of course not. It still surprises me that so many people disagree.
I have all the self-control of my passions that I might conceivably want or need. And I don't believe in an afterlife as such. Therefore, I don't know how to answer your question. It is just not relevant to me.
It seems to me that the goal of religion should be far more of avoiding such situations than promising an afterlife.
Most are dead. Their legacy is ours to care for and hopefully improve upon, if we are wise and skilled enough to do so.
It is both a terrible and marvelous responsibility, a duty and a glorious grace.
For many people that is true. But it does not have to be so. We may accept mortality with serenity, and in my opinion we should.
That does not really apply to many people, myself included. Not everyone has the means or the need to believe in the existence of a deity.
Trusting a distant revelation over the living discernment of well-meaning, dedicated practicioners that learned from the effort of their forebears just doesn't seem wise to me.
Not all people or faiths hold that particular concept of God at all. Why create your own when one or more besides these ones may be what you're looking for? That seems a waste of time. For example, if you can't find a certain food, you can make your own, or maybe, just maybe, you haven't gotten around enough.
How is the sectarianism between Shia and Sunni vs Ahmadiyya (sp?) / Bahai and arguably Wahabi (sp?) significantly different from that between Shia and Sunni, by your view?
I'm not in doubt. None.
God can let me know directly if that's an issue just before he starts torturing me for all eternity, and perhaps he'll give me time to explain that torturing me for disbelief is on him. An all powerful God, and the best he could manage was a series of prophets all contained within a tiny fraction of the earth's surface, and all before the time that accurate histories were recorded. Good job. And I'm supposed to worship this sender of ineffective messages because...what...he's a bully?
Pass.
Liu
Well-Known Member
Yes, that's what we on the Left Hand Path normally do.
For cultural reasons, and since my religion is similar to that of quite some of those who call themselves Satanists, I for now call my religion and god by that as well.
But, why even have a personal heaven and hell? That concept is not that wide-spread.
If you make a personal religion suited to yourself, it wouldn't make much sense to expect everyone else to have that same religion.
Wrong, not all religions have gods or an afterlife.
DragonHawk1959
Member
That is the appeal of modern paganism.
To worship the god(s) whom you most align with. You even get to worship the aspect(s) which appeals to you.
And the pagan gods punish relatively few with eternal torment. In Greek mythos suicides wandered eternally forgetful in a field of flowers.
interminable
منتظر
Every divine religions had their own merits when they were valid in their times.
By sending new prophet and new books by God almighty the previous religion would be null and invalidated.
If previous one should be valid too there was not any need to send new prophet
And sending new prophet was often because followers of previous one distorted the book and it's order and...
So after Moses pbuh God sent Jesus
This means new religion should be practiced
After Jesus pbuh God sent muhammad pbuh
This means Islam is valid
And since Qur'an clearly says the prophet is the last one Islam would be the last divine religion.
And the prophet said emergence of a Savior is necessary even if one day remains from this carnal world
And there were and there are lots of people that claimed they are saviors but they were liars.
And Bahaie and ahmadiah are in this kind.
Besides if they are new religions they should prepare a good miracle but do they have?????
Tumah
Veteran Member
The only reason you are calling them liars is because they contradict your religion. But your religion contradicts my religions, so does that make your religion a lie too?
Why do they need to prepare a miracle in order to be a new religion?
interminable
منتظر
See this
What is wrong with Islam?
Number 400
Besides
If the first cause isn't unlimited then it should be limited by something while we assumed that there wasn't anything before the first cause.
So first cause is unlimited.
Can we have 2 unlimited existents?
No because each one of them won't have attributes and perfections of the other so will be limited and I proved the first cause is unlimited
Why would a religion need a miracle?
interminable
منتظر
interminable
منتظر
Look
Shia and sunny both believe in muhammad pbuh but Bahaie and ahmadiah don't. That's why they were apostates in our views.
And wahabi is a kind of interpretation of the Qur'an and traditions so they believe in muhammad pbuh but have some extremely opinions so we call them extremists
interminable
منتظر
According to u god should send for every village a prophet
Pretexts will never end.
When God sends a prophet telling people I'm a prophet for everyone forever shouldn't we accept him because he isn't from my country or is black and I'm white and other pretexts
And it's not rational to deny thousands of books that are written in past simply because we couldn't record them accurately.