Confession about free exercise of religion

[shunyadragon]

Well some people have told me that they've seen firsthand attacks on Jews and Christians.

"Well some people told me . . ." means nothing. Yes there have been attacks on Jews, Christians, Moslems, Baha'is, Buddhists and very many other belief systems and cultures of the world. So what?!?!?!!?

Christians have atacked Christians, Jews and Moslems. Moslems have attacked Jews, Baha'is, Moslems, and Christians. Jews have attacked Christians, Jews, and anilated othe tribes in history.

What is the purpose of your one sided accusation.

 

[shunyadragon]

I didn't say that. But I botched the brackets so that it seemed I did.
(Just looked, I didn't botch the brackets. They were broken before.)

I didn't respond to robocop, only to your claim that church services were never restricted while liqure stores were not.

I think the comparison is valid.

No, I said church services were never restricted or closed to keep liquor stores, bars, pot shops and casinos open!

I said . . .

. . . but these closing and limits on churches and businesses are not related in the manner that @robocop (actually), which is that churches were closed, because the alcohol, pot stores, and casinos were open. His statements have nothing to do with the efforts to control the spread of COVID-19.

The comparison is invalid as presented by @robocop (actually).

 

[IndigoChild5559]

. . . but these closing and limits on churches and businesses are not related in the manner that @robocop (actually), which is that churches were closed, because the alcohol, pot stores, and casinos were open. His statements have nothing to do with the efforts to control the spread of COVID-19.

Oh, I just ASSUMED that he was referring to the lockdown rules. I recognized what he was taalking about right away. It has been very, very controversial, with some churches refuses to obey the rules and staying open anyhow, and getting fined and stuff.

I think perhaps yu just didn't recognize what he was referring to because it's just not a thing in yur neck of the woods???? (Don't remember where you hail from.)

PS, and its all houses of worship that have been closed, not just Christian churches. My synagogue now only meets via Zoom.

 

[robocop (actually)]

"Well some people told me . . ." means nothing. Yes there have been attacks on Jews, Christians, Moslems, Baha'is, Buddhists and very many other belief systems and cultures of the world. So what?!?!?!!?

Christians have atacked Christians, Jews and Moslems. Moslems have attacked Jews, Baha'is, Moslems, and Christians. Jews have attacked Christians, Jews, and anilated othe tribes in history.

What is the purpose of your one sided accusation.

Well if "Well some people told me" means nothing, "Shunyadragon told me" means nothing too.

I know it has gone both ways in history, but right now I just believe that there is religious persecution.

And you don't need to persecute me for just saying I believe that, or you really are attacking my religion.

 

[shunyadragon]

Well if "Well some people told me" means nothing, "Shunyadragon told me" means nothing too.

I know it has gone both ways in history, but right now I just believe that there is religious persecution.

And you don't need to persecute me for just saying I believe that, or you really are attacking my religion.

I am not claiming 'third party anecdotal references' to argue my points.

Yes, right now there is well documented religious persecution against Jews Christians, Muslims, Buddhists and Baha'is, and othe belief systems..

 

[shunyadragon]

Oh, I just ASSUMED that he was referring to the lockdown rules. I recognized what he was talking about right away. It has been very, very controversial, with some churches refuses to obey the rules and staying open anyhow, and getting fined and stuff.

I think perhaps you just didn't recognize what he was referring to because it's just not a thing in your neck of the woods???? (Don't remember where you hail from.)

PS, and its all houses of worship that have been closed, not just Christian churches. My synagogue now only meets via Zoom.

He may or may not be referring to this, but nonetheless he said that churches were being closed because of alcohol, pot, and casinos were open 'causing' churches to be closed.

Bars, pubs, party gatherings, churches, parties, crowded gatherings, restaurants that could not insure safe social distancing, and other meetings were closed in response to COVID-19, because they were associated directly with the major cause of the spread of COVID-19. Liquor stores, and pot shops have not been known for contributing to the spread of COVID-19, because of the limited number of people involved, and the rules were extended to these facilities to face covering and social distancing. Casinos were also restricted to the number of people allowed, masks and social distancing and the closing of card games, and othe games with crowds. The closing of churches and other houses of worship had nothing to do with religion.

Assuming, makes an A** of those that assume based on the lack of information.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

I'm with @IndigoChild5559 on this one. I don't think it should be displayed but I don't think it should be banned as a part of a display of legal documents. Putting the 10 commandments together with Roman laws, the Magna Carta and the Code Civil 1. emphasises the legal aspect and 2. doesn't show recognition or endorsement of a single religion. It would be save under the First Amendment.

Putting up the 10 commandments WOULD endorse abrahamic religion. The first 4 have nothing to do with society or how one should act and everything with worshipping a jealous and vengefull god.

It has no business being on the wall of any governmental building.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

If you want to put up a display of Bible passages that have influenced Western laws, Exodus 22:18 and 1 Timothy 2:12 probably have more claim to be there than the Ten Commandments do.

Or Exodus 21

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Gay relationships and marriage are legal, so it doesn't matter what someone's personal opinion on it is. Gay people have rights and one of those rights is equal access to services.

I recognize the law of the land. And I don't go around talking bout my views unless people ask. I'm very opposed to the LGTB community getting bullied etc. But my beliefs are my beliefs.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I recognize the law of the land. And I don't go around talking bout my views unless people ask. I'm very opposed to the LGTB community getting bullied etc. But my beliefs are my beliefs.

And it's fair to have your beliefs but your arguments don't really add up.

 

[shunyadragon]

Putting up the 10 commandments WOULD endorse abrahamic religion. The first 4 have nothing to do with society or how one should act and everything with worshipping a jealous and vengefull god.

It has no business being on the wall of any governmental building.

Actually the Supreme Court build has statues of most world religions and beliefs contributing to the US Law including Moses with the Ten Commandments. On the world stage of law empasizing only one set of laws or commandments would endorse one over the other, and does not present the reality of the world evolution of law including th eUSA..

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I recognize the law of the land. And I don't go around talking bout my views unless people ask. I'm very opposed to the LGTB community getting bullied etc. But my beliefs are my beliefs.

The way you so often argue for the right of bullies and bigots to harass LGBTQ people suggests that you aren't actually opposed to the behaviour.

 

[Heyo]

Putting up the 10 commandments WOULD endorse abrahamic religion. The first 4 have nothing to do with society or how one should act and everything with worshipping a jealous and vengefull god.

It has no business being on the wall of any governmental building.

Putting up only the 10 commandments would endorse Abrahamic religions. Together with the Code of Hamurabi, Roman Law and the Code civil, the religious aspect becomes irrelevant.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Putting up only the 10 commandments would endorse Abrahamic religions. Together with the Code of Hamurabi, Roman Law and the Code civil, the religious aspect becomes irrelevant.

That depends on the intent behind the display.

"A wide-ranging secular display of the history of law" is very different from "the Ten Commandments, but with just enough window-dressing to probably survive a court challenge."

Another way of looking at it: would the "secular" display be there if the Ten Commandments weren't in it? If the answer is "no," then the religious aspect was the point, regardless of how much other stuff they added.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Putting up only the 10 commandments would endorse Abrahamic religions. Together with the Code of Hamurabi, Roman Law and the Code civil, the religious aspect becomes irrelevant.

Just a thought:

If this display includes the text of the Ten Commandments, then it's necessarily favouring one religious group over another.

There are eight different numbering systems for the Ten Commandments. Any given Christian or Jewish denomination generally only uses one of them. Unless you're including the Ten Commandments eight times in your display, you're picking and choosing one religious group over others.

Ten Commandments - Wikipedia

 

[Clara Tea]

Are you asserting that Secular views are threatening to take away Christian religion by

1. Not allowing Christians to stop schools to have everyone pray to their God, several times per day.

2. Teaching evolution (which some construe to be a religious view, since it is about how we got here)

3. Being pro-abortion.

4. Passing out free condoms

5. Condoning Gays

The secular view is that we can all get along if we don't force others to believe as we do. However, teaching evolution does cram science down the throats of everyone (even if it is valid). Everyone can pray while sitting in school, without having all pray to the same God (it would be awkward to force Christians to pray to Satan every day). Religion can be taught in churches on weekends, and still allow DNA evidence (accepted as proof in courts) to prove evolution of life. Pro-abortion people don't want to abort fully formed babies, but they consider fetuses to be a collection of cells until there is brain activity. I am against abortion because it is not a substitute for a condom. Condoms don't condone sex, but make it safer (STDs, including AIDS), and less apt to procreate. Babies could be adopted. Trump is right, that states should rule on abortion without Federal mandates because the nation is evenly split. Each faction could then examine the merits of their position (cutting down STDs, unwanted pregnancies, adopting, etc). Gays should have legal rights to continue parenting the children of their Gay partners, right to inherit properties and money. Gays should have a right to exist without continually be banned. Gays should have a right to employment. Though the bible is against Gay sex, only God may judge them. Gays should not be at the mercy of religious zealots who mean them harm.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Well some people have told me that they've seen firsthand attacks on Jews and Christians.

Indeed. At this point, who hasn't seen the video of the brazen daylight murder of this Christian:

George Floyd - Wikipedia

... or this attack on a Christian church itself, along with its clergy and attendees:

Protesters Dispersed With Tear Gas So Trump Could Pose at Church