Linus
Well-Known Member
http://www.folsomchurch.com/charts/Dead.PDF
You'll need adobe reader in order to view it...
Any thoughts?
You'll need adobe reader in order to view it...
Any thoughts?
-
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:- Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
- Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
- Access to private conversations with other members.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
Christians - What do you think of this chart?
- Thread starter Linus
- Start date
Hmmm,
I tend to agree with it.
I tend to agree with it.
Karl R
Active Member
I'm reminded of a quote from mathematics:
"For every problem, there's a solution that's simple, elegant, and probably wrong."
Given the number of times I've been told that I'm going to hell, I never believe anyone who seems absolutely certain about where other people are going. I'm certain that god hasn't spoken to those people directly about who's in and who's out. I am also also certain that god's the making the judgement call, and god's not likely to delegate the task to anyone at the Folsom Church.
"For every problem, there's a solution that's simple, elegant, and probably wrong."
Given the number of times I've been told that I'm going to hell, I never believe anyone who seems absolutely certain about where other people are going. I'm certain that god hasn't spoken to those people directly about who's in and who's out. I am also also certain that god's the making the judgement call, and god's not likely to delegate the task to anyone at the Folsom Church.
lilithu
The Devil's Advocate
I'm not Christian so I won't comment on what I think of the chart, but I did find it noteworthy that a couple of those who responded did not really say what they thought of the chart, only that it agreed with some other authority that they respect. To say that the chart is "interesting" does not really say anything.
So thank you Mr. Emu and Karl R for standing on their own convictions.:clap
So thank you Mr. Emu and Karl R for standing on their own convictions.:clap
sojourner
Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
It's amazing how many little formulas and flow charts and schemes we can invent in order to keep certain people away from God and present the gospel message as something frightening and deadly.
I disagree whleheartedly with the chart and the concept that produced it.
I disagree whleheartedly with the chart and the concept that produced it.
dawny0826
Mother Heathen
I don't quite understand it, in looking at it again.
Is this supposed to be a depiction of what happens when we pass on? A depiction of end time events? My MIL explained it to me at one time...only in her chart...there was a depiction of "sleep"...where all sleep until judgement and then according to judgement, go to be with Jesus or go to Hell.
This one is kind of going right over my head.
Is this supposed to be a depiction of what happens when we pass on? A depiction of end time events? My MIL explained it to me at one time...only in her chart...there was a depiction of "sleep"...where all sleep until judgement and then according to judgement, go to be with Jesus or go to Hell.
This one is kind of going right over my head.
Basically it is a Flow-chart of a belief in where a person goes after death... if you are a faithful Christian you goto paradise, if you aren't you goto sheol, then you get ressurected for the final judgement and either end up in the lake of fire(if you were in sheol) or Heaven(if you were in paradise)
Linus
Well-Known Member
This chart is derived directly from passages in the Bible. It is neither a dogma of the church at Folsom, nor one man's opinion. It is a chart based exclusively on what we know God says (through the Bible) on this issue. So, what are the reasons that some of you disagree with it?
You're right. It doesn't. Here is a similar representation of LDS doctrine.lilithu said:
We believe that, prior to our births, we lived with God, our Father in Heaven. This period of time is known as the Pre-existence. We existed for millenia in a spirit state, i.e. we did not have physical bodies. At the appointed time, we experienced birth, life on earth and death. (At birth, the memory of our pre-earth life is removed in order that we can learn to walk in faith.) At death, our spirit (which had entered the physical body at birth) separated from it. The body is laid to rest in the grave, while the spirit continues to exist in the Spirit World, which is comprised of Paradise for the righteous and Prison for the wicked. The spirit is a cognizant entity which continues to grow and develop while in the Spirit World. At the resurrection, each of us will stand before God to be judged, and each will be deemed worthy to enter into one of the three degrees of heavenly glory spoken of in the Bible. (I'm not sure why this diagram did not show Hell, or "outer darkness." We do believe that some will NOT be granted admission into Heaven. These, however, will be relatively few.)
Scriptural support:
The Pre-existence --
Ecclesiastes 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.
Job 38:4-7 Where was thou when I laid the foundations of the Earth? declare, if thou has understanding. Who hath laid the measures thereof, if thou knowest? or who hath stretched the line upon it? Whereupon are the foundations thereof fastened? or who laid the corner stone thereof; When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?
Jeremiah 1:5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee, and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.
Ecclesiastes 1:11 There is no remembrance of former things; neither shall there be any remembrance of things that are to come with those that shall come after.
Paradise in the Spirit World --
Luke 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.
2 Corinthians 12:4 How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.
Prison in the Spirit World --
Psalms 142:7 Bring my soul out of prison, that I may praise thy name: the righteous shall compass me about; for thou shalt deal bountifully with me.
John 5:25. Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.
1 Peter 3:18-19 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison...
1 Peter 4:6 For this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit.
The three "Degrees of Glory" in Heaven --
1 Corinthians 15:40-42 There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another. There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory. So also is the resurrection of the dead.
2 Corinthians 12:2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth ) such an one caught up to the third heaven.