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Firelight

Inactive member
What I am seeing here is theology is irrelevant the origin of the faith can be different as long as the faith has Jesus as the Savior and it can be called Christianity

THEOLOGY- What theological differences would exclude a church from being Christian? The comparisons you presented showed the same basic beliefs, i.e. God the Father, Jesus Christ, Son, and Holy Spirit; the Bible; death and resurrection of Christ. Having more written beliefs, books of faith, and leadership doesn’t exclude a church from being Christian. The Catholic church has a lot of doctrine and books that other Christian churches do not have. Several churches have their own unique books.

ORIGIN- Why would the origin exclude a faith from being Christian? What type of origin would exclude a church from being Christian? Christian churches do not have the same origin.

JESUS AS SAVIOR- Yes, this is #1 for any church to be Christian. Accepting Jesus Christ as Savior is the very foundation and center of any Christian church. No church would be Christian without it.

You have not presented any definitive differences as to why a certain church would be excluded from being called Christian.
 
Its my duty as a Christian to defend the core beliefs of Christianity - the core beliefs of Christianity cannot be changed if it is its called heresy. Doctrine does vary from Church to Church but not the core belief.
In the Mormon Church the core belief and doctrine are open and can be changed by the Prophet at any time and I believe by apostles of the Mormon Church.
The Mormons believe they are the one true Church of Christ and Christians have lost their way. The goal is to do away with denominations they believe they are heresy because they broke away from the Catholic Church - They believe the Catholic or Mormon Churches are the only ones who could be the one true Church of Christ not the Protestant Churches and of course they believe they are the true church of Christ .
With the open theology and doctrine that can be change I have said that over time it appears to me they are aligning it to the Christian faith in the changes made to the point that one day they will be able to absorb Christianity not the other way around.
If you can't see the danger to Christianity I really don't know what to say we already have Christians accepting Mormonism as Christianity.
I am just defending the faith call me what you want I will never accept Mormonism as Christianity
 

Jane.Doe

Active Member
Its my duty as a Christian to defend the core beliefs of Christianity - the core beliefs of Christianity cannot be changed if it is its called heresy. Doctrine does vary from Church to Church but not the core belief.
In the Mormon Church the core belief and doctrine are open and can be changed by the Prophet at any time and I believe by apostles of the Mormon Church.
The Mormons believe they are the one true Church of Christ and Christians have lost their way. The goal is to do away with denominations they believe they are heresy because they broke away from the Catholic Church - They believe the Catholic or Mormon Churches are the only ones who could be the one true Church of Christ not the Protestant Churches and of course they believe they are the true church of Christ .
With the open theology and doctrine that can be change I have said that over time it appears to me they are aligning it to the Christian faith in the changes made to the point that one day they will be able to absorb Christianity not the other way around.
If you can't see the danger to Christianity I really don't know what to say we already have Christians accepting Mormonism as Christianity.
I am just defending the faith call me what you want I will never accept Mormonism as Christianity
No. Peter, I do not know which specific denomination of Christianity you believe, but not a single one of them is so weak as to need "defended" by crusaders running around the internet denying other people's relationship with Christ. Me loving Christ is not a threat in any way to your love of Christ. I"m sorry that you feel that way, but I can in no way going to deny my Lord & Savior. I also celebrate your love of Christ & pray that you ever go strong on that walk with Him.
 

Jane.Doe

Active Member
Christians were told to watch out for this kind of stuff or they could all find themselves bowing to the Prophet of the Mormon church.

I have NEVER seen a Christian denomination so pitiful that it had to bad mouth others to keep people in their doors. No, in each denomination I have seen strong people whom love Christ. Whom celebrate Christ & their salvation in Him - singing like the herald angel of old. Whom receive their own individual relationship & testimony of Him through the Holy Spirit. Baptist, Methodist, Calvary Chapel, Roman Catholic, Byzantine Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, Lutheran, non-denominational, Episcopalian, Evangelical, Pentecostal, and so many more. Strong disciples of Christ whom feed on His mana and zero need to attack or degrade others.
 

Firelight

Inactive member
Its my duty as a Christian to defend the core beliefs of Christianity - the core beliefs of Christianity cannot be changed if it is its called heresy. Doctrine does vary from Church to Church but not the core belief.
In the Mormon Church the core belief and doctrine are open and can be changed by the Prophet at any time and I believe by apostles of the Mormon Church.
The Mormons believe they are the one true Church of Christ and Christians have lost their way. The goal is to do away with denominations they believe they are heresy because they broke away from the Catholic Church - They believe the Catholic or Mormon Churches are the only ones who could be the one true Church of Christ not the Protestant Churches and of course they believe they are the true church of Christ .
With the open theology and doctrine that can be change I have said that over time it appears to me they are aligning it to the Christian faith in the changes made to the point that one day they will be able to absorb Christianity not the other way around.
If you can't see the danger to Christianity I really don't know what to say we already have Christians accepting Mormonism as Christianity.
I am just defending the faith call me what you want I will never accept Mormonism as Christianity


You have listed your religion as “not sure.”

You don’t seem to know what the core beliefs of Christianity are. So far, you haven’t listed any that the Mormon church does not have. Accepting Jesus Christ as the Savior is the foundation of Christianity.

Doctrines of the Catholic Church can be changed by their pope. The leaders of any of the Christian churches can change their doctrine and in fact, do.

“The goal is to do away with denominations they believe they are heresy because they broke away from the Catholic Church.” What are you talking about?

“They believe the Catholic or Mormon Churches are the only ones who could be the one true Church of Christ.”
Who is “they?” I doubt the Mormon church believes that the Catholic Church could be the one and only true church, or they would be Catholic.

Mormons are Christians. There is nothing to prove otherwise. If Christians want to change what church they are a member of, it is their right to do so.

Putting down a particular church, especially bullying a member(s) on the forum, is not defending the faith. It’s attacking. Did Christ teach his followers to attack one another? No. Jesus taught us to love one another. So, as I suggested before, you should be working on your own soul. Learn more about Christ, His teachings, and follow his ways. This will serve your faith far better than attacking any church or member thereof.
 

Firelight

Inactive member
Christians were told to watch out for this kind of stuff or they could all find themselves bowing to the Prophet of the Mormon church.


Christians bow to Jesus Christ. Mormons are Christians and they bow to Jesus Christ. But, if someone wants to bow to the prophet of the Mormon church, then that is their choice, you cannot stop them.
 
False Christianity , a false prophet , a religion where a man speaks as and for God - where have I see this before? Could it be in the Book of Revelations? I guess Satan wouldn't dare go near the Mormon Church it has to be the Catholic Church you'll say that the Antichrist will show up in. Mean well the Mormon Church teaches false Christianity , has a false prophet who claims to speak with the authority of God.
There are no prophets in Christianity after John the baptist they were all pointing to Jesus. Christ fulfilled all prophecies when he came.

What would you say - I didn't see it coming? I was not warned ?
 
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The Pope can speak ex cathedra but it not consider prophecy and has only happened once in the 2000 years of Christianity - which was the belief Mary was assumed that applies only to Catholics. Popes stay away from it because they know the implications and its handled very carefully.
 
Mormonism’s teaching of God and Jesus Christ

What does the LDS Church teach about Jesus Christ? First of all, it is already documented above that Brigham Young taught that Jesus was a spirit child of Adam and spirit brother of all human kind, as well as a brother of angels, spirit beings, even the fallen ones, i.e., Jesus being a brother of Lucifer. Brigham further taught that Jesus was also physically a son of Adam who as an exalted resurrected being had come to Mary and fathered Jesus. Brigham also emphasized that Jesus was not begotten by the Holy Ghost, as the Bible says.

This teaching shows that the Jesus of the LDS Church is not “Emmanuel,” “God with us,” God who, according to the Bible (Matt. 1:23) became a man for us, to be our Redeemer. Jesus of the LDS Church is a created being who also had to be redeemed… But Jesus of the Bible is the Creator – uncreated God who created everything, including Lucifer (John 1:3; Col. 1:16).

The current teachings of the LDS Church have not changed in this matter. President Ezra Taft Benson said, in his book, “Come unto Christ,” at page 4,

“…The body in which He performed His mission in the flesh was sired by that Holy Being we worship as God, our Eternal Father. Jesus was not the son of Joseph, nor was He begotten by the Holy Ghost. He is the Son of the Eternal Father. (Emphasis added)

Apostle Bruce R. McConkie, on page 742 of Mormon Doctrine, says,

“God the Father is a perfected, glorified, holy Man, an immortal Personage. And Christ was born into the world as the literal Son of this Holy Being; he was born in the same personal, real, and literal sense that any mortal son is born to a mortal father. There is nothing figurative about this paternity; he was BEGOTTEN, CONCEIVED and born in the normal and natural course of events, for he is the Son of God, and that designation means what it says.”

In the same book, pages 546-547, McConkie says further, under the heading “ONLY BEGOTTEN SON,”

…Each word is to be understood literally. Only means only; begotten means begotten; and Son means son. Christ was begotten by an Immortal Father in the SAME WAY THAT MORTAL MEN ARE BEGOTTEN BY THEIR MORTAL FATHERS. (Emphasis added)

This is not what the Bible says. The Bible says that a virgin will conceive and bring forth a Son, who is called Emmanuel, meaning “God with us” not, a brother with us! (Matt. 1:18-23) The Mary of the LDS church was not a Virgin who brought forth a son, but a “wife” of the Heavenly Father, whom Brigham declared to be Adam.

Orson Pratt, an apostle, explains in his doctrinal book titled, The Seer, at page 158,

…The fleshly body of Jesus required a Mother as well as a Father. Therefore, the Father and Mother of Jesus, according to the flesh, must have been associated together in the capacity of Husband and Wife; hence the Virgin Mary must have been, for the time being, the lawful wife of God the Father. Inasmuch as God was the first HUSBAND TO HER (Mary), it may be that He only gave her to be the wife of Joseph while in this mortal state, and that He intended after the resurrection to again take her as one of his own wives to raise up immortal spirits in eternity…. (Emphasis added)

The leaders of the LDS Church have also taught that their Jesus was married and had children, and that he was even a polygamist. Again, Apostle Orson Pratt, says in The Seer, page 172, says,

“…the great Messiah who was the founder of the Christian religion was a Polygamist…the Messiah chose to take upon himself his seed; and by marrying many honorable wives himself, show to all future generations that he approved the plurality of Wives under Christian dispensation… The son followed the example of his Father, and became the great Bridegroom to whom kings’ daughters and many of the honorable Wives were to be married. We have also proved that both God the Father and our Lord Jesus Christ inherit their wives in eternity as well as in time….

In answer to the question “Was Jesus married?” Joseph Fielding Smith, who was the president of the LDS Church in the 1970’s, said, “Yes, but do not throw pearls to the swine!” We can clearly see that the LDS church still believes that Jesus was married, but doesn’t want to “throw pearls to the swine” in other words, to reveal this to non-Mormons.

LDS President Gordon B. Hinckley made a statement June 4, 1998 acknowledging that he (and the LDS Church) does not believe in the same Jesus Christ as traditional Christianity. He said,”The traditional Christ of who they speak in not the Christ of whom I speak. For the Christ of whom I speak had been revealed in this the Dispensation of the Fullness of Times. He together with His Father, appeared to the boy Joseph Smith in the year 1820, and when Joseph left the grove that day, he knew more of the nature of God than all the learned ministers of the gospel of the ages.” (Church News, June, 20 1998, p. 7. emphasis added)

In the LDS Church’s 147th General Conference, General Authority Bernard P. Brockbank, stated that “the CHRIST FOLLOWED BY THE MORMONS IS NOT THE CHRIST FOLLOWED BY TRADITIONAL CHRISTIANITY”.

He said: “It is true that many of the Christian churches worship A DIFFERENT JESUS CHRIST than is worshiped by the Mormons.” (“The Ensign,” May 1977, p. 26.)

In summary, Jesus of the LDS Church is not Jesus of the Bible. God of the LDS Church is not God of the Bible. Joseph Smith said that there is “A GOD ABOVE THE FATHER OF OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST…” and in Mormon Doctrine, pages 322, we read, …If Jesus Christ was the Son of God, and… God the Father of Jesus Christ had a Father, you may suppose that he had a Father also. Where was there ever a son without a father? …Hence if Jesus had a Father, can we not believe that he had a Father also?” In 1844, Joseph Smith, as recorded in the Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, pp. 344-347, first told the audience that: “…every man has a natural, and, in our country, a constitutional right to be a FALSE PROPHET, as well as a true one…” Then on the next page, he says: “I am going to tell you how God came to be God. We have imagined and supposed that God was God from all eternity. I will refute that idea and take away the veil, so that you may see.” He explains that “…God himself was once as we are now…and you got to learn how to be Gods yourselves… the same as all Gods have done before you… (Emphasis added)

The LDS does not tell Christians this as in the quote it would be like throwing pearls to swine
 
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Watchmen

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
I have NEVER seen a Christian denomination so pitiful that it had to bad mouth others to keep people in their doors. No, in each denomination I have seen strong people whom love Christ. Whom celebrate Christ & their salvation in Him - singing like the herald angel of old. Whom receive their own individual relationship & testimony of Him through the Holy Spirit. Baptist, Methodist, Calvary Chapel, Roman Catholic, Byzantine Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, Lutheran, non-denominational, Episcopalian, Evangelical, Pentecostal, and so many more. Strong disciples of Christ whom feed on His mana and zero need to attack or degrade others.
Wow. That’s rich. Mormons declaration that they are the one true church is bad mouthing every other religion in the world. Shall we read some McConkie and see what he has to say about Catholics?
 
Apologetics (from Greek ἀπολογία, "speaking in defense") is the religious discipline of defending religious doctrines through systematic argumentation and discourse. Early Christian writers (c. 120–220) who defended their beliefs against critics and recommended their faith to outsiders were called Christian apologists.
Apologetic's is not a Christian denomination
 

Jane.Doe

Active Member
So yes call me pitiful sometimes you have to take the heat to protect the faith. Its a badge of honor for me.
Throughout this thread, I have seen you repeatedly: attacking others, denying the love others have of Christ, refusing to talk / downplay a saving relationship with Christ, misrepresent folks, and copy/pasted other people’s thoughts.

Is that really what you call a badge of honor?
Who needs you to “defend” them with the above? It’s not Christ- He’s all powerful.
.
 
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It doesn't matter what I say I have proved by the words of LDS themselves that the Jesus and God the father they believe in is a different God the Father and Jesus Christ than Christianity by their own words at that! Yet it still falls on deaf ears and doesn't seem to matter and I get criticized for doing it and defending the Christian view of Jesus and God the Father. But nobody see the difference even when its put right in front of them. Nobody cares about the theology and tenants of their faith nor do they defend them they just believe.

I walk away and shake the dust from my sandles.
 

Jane.Doe

Active Member
It doesn't matter what I say I have proved by the words of LDS themselves that the Jesus and God the father they believe in is a different God the Father and Jesus Christ than Christianity by their own words at that! Yet it still falls on deaf ears and doesn't seem to matter and I get criticized for doing it and defending the Christian view of Jesus and God the Father. But nobody see the difference even when its put right in front of them. Nobody cares about the theology and tenants of their faith nor do they defend them they just believe.
You're not defending at all. Nor are you even under attack ever. My love of Christ doesn't negate yours. The thing that you are criticized for is attacking others and asking them to deny Christ.
I walk away and shake the dust from my sandles.
Ok.
I pray that you ever grow closer to Christ.
 
I will make one more post and ask -
Which Jesus do you believe in
The LDS - Jesus is only the first born son (God has lots of sons Jesus is a brother) The Jesus who is not God - no blessed trinity.
Christian - God only son - part of the blessed Trinity -is God himself.
 

Jane.Doe

Active Member
I will make one more post and ask -
Which Jesus do you believe in
The LDS - Jesus is only the first born son (God has lots of sons Jesus is a brother) The Jesus who is not God - no blessed trinity.
Christian - God only son - part of the blessed Trinity -is God himself.
I believe in Jesus Christ, the Only Begotten Son of God. He is the my Lord & Savior, that relationship is foundation to everything I have the greatest treasure.

Jesus Christ is the 100% divine Son of God. 100% perfect. He has always existed, and was God before being born of Mary, during His mortal life, and after His resurrection. He, the Father, and the Spirit are three different persons in 1 God.

Another important point here: a person's salvation is not determined by their ability to pass a theology test. A 4 year old whom has embraced Christ is just as saved as the greatest scholar.
 
Mormons believe that Jesus had a natural birth. The Mormons believe in a heavenly father, who has a physical body.

You can't change that.
As I said the theology is slowly changing to absorb Christianity - The prophet has to change it and you have to listen to the Prophet without question as he speaks as God. Bow to the Prophet.(False)
 

Jane.Doe

Active Member
Mormons believe that Jesus had a natural birth. The Mormons believe in a heavenly father, who has a physical body.
Actually, "Mormons" believe Jesus Christ has always existed and always been God. He was born to the virgin Mary (yes, virgin) and lived a mortal life, before His sacrifice & resurrection to a glorified body.

It is believed that God the Father likewise has a glorified body.
 
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