Charlottesville: It's about the 1st Amendment

[idav]

And I'm sorry you can't read posts to completion. If I had crayons and more time I'd explain this to you.

No need to get snarky. Does free speech give a right to a venue and a willing audience? Probably not.

 

[icehorse]

My point to you is that the alt-right especially the neo-nazis, kkk and other white supremist hate groups would actually take away freedom if they gain more power.

Since you care about freedom then I don't see why you do not prioritize these same hate groups in your bucket of organizations that take away freedom?

Fair question. My honest feeling is that the extreme left and the MSM are bigger threats to our freedoms than the relatively small alt-right. If there were millions of alt-righters I'd put them at the top of my threat list.

 

[icehorse]

No need to get snarky. Does free speech give a right to a venue and a willing audience? Probably not.

Dude! Wasn't your crack about me getting my fill of hate speech just a tad on the snarky side?

As I said earlier in this thread, free speech does NOT guarantee a platform. BUT.. these asshats got themselves a permit.

 

[idav]

Dude! Wasn't your crack about me getting my fill of hate speech just a tad on the snarky side?

As I said earlier in this thread, free speech does NOT guarantee a platform. BUT.. these asshats got themselves a permit.

How's a person gonna give free speech if they get booed off stage, even if they had presidential invite.

 

[suncowiam]

Fair question. My honest feeling is that the extreme left and the MSM are bigger threats to our freedoms than the relatively small alt-right. If there were millions of alt-righters I'd put them at the top of my threat list.

I honestly don't know which side is bigger. I guess you can argue that. I'll just say hell to both of them, equally.

 

[idav]

Dude! Wasn't your crack about me getting my fill of hate speech just a tad on the snarky side?

I was being sincere, don't know how you get your info but I would recommend a book. I had read some pretty informative stuff on anti-semitism that really shows the perspectives but don't remember what it was called, if you really want knowledge on that sort of hate filled nonsense.

 

[Skwim]

My, my, what a smouldering plate of utter codswollop. The left has itś very own thugs, and always has. In my day as a young cop, they were called the weathermen, who set bombs and blew up people, the SDS, who did such things as roll cherry bombs in glue, then carpet tacks to set off under a police horse, hoping to kill the rider in a fall, but if not, they would just swarm him and beat the hell out of him, the black panthers who strutted around a lot at demonstrations, but except for a court take over where a a number of people were killed, they were just talk. Today the lefts soldiers are antifa, blm, and the masked anarchists who set fire and destroy property whenever the opportunity arises. Also the mobs who burn down their own communityś, then demand money to rebuild them, all in the pocket of the left, and unchained whenever there is a need for further erosion of the Republic that once was. Oops I failed to mention the gaystopo, who contribute their bit of violence to the leftist agenda. I find your complaining about the surveillance of the citizenry by the government amusing . Sorry, but your boy obama did more in this regard than the three previous administrations combined. As to the media, you are partially correct. The left views them as a glorious institution. Conservatives view them suspiciously at best. Let me give you a personal example of what a reporter with an agenda can do. Far from being neautral reporters of fact, they too have their, mostly left wing, goals. Almost 50 years ago, at a very violent demonstration, I happened to arrest the leader of the vietnam veterans against the war, the guy who took over after kerry stepped down. Of course the rich lefties ensured he had the best lawyer in NY they could find. The trial was in Ca. I spent hours and hours on the stand being questioned ( we got a conviction). The primary lefty reporter there did not print anything I didnt say, he just artfully left out paragraphs between paragraphs so that it looked as though I was a fool and the defendant was a prince. I hated them from that point on, they regularly confirmed my dislike of the, Many, many years later, as a Chief, I never trusted them. Media companies today are as money grubbing as any other private company or institution. Couple that with their liberal bias, and they have a lower trust percentage than trump or congress

.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

The media that I've seen has been largely silent on the 1st amendment, and this was a HUGE test of the 1st amendment, and we failed the test.

If I may ask, in what way was this a huge failure of the first amendment? I think, to answer this, you might first say what you think the amendment actually means and what it allows, and how you think phrases like "Jews will not replace us" fit into what the amendment protects. (By the way, did you know the US has more gays than Jews? There's a surprise, I'll bet.)

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

app

.

It would seem that we are of an age...

 

[Skwim]

It would seem that we are of an age...

So it seems. The age of reason.

.

 

[ChristineM]

I never excused that murderer. His actions are independent of what I'm talking about.

Why independent? Without violent people exercising their "freedom of speech", violently - according to news reports, that murder would not have happened. The two are linked

Freedom of speech is great but it comes with personal responsibility

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

So it seems. The age of reason.

.

I do my best...

 

[icehorse]

I was being sincere, don't know how you get your info but I would recommend a book. I had read some pretty informative stuff on anti-semitism that really shows the perspectives but don't remember what it was called, if you really want knowledge on that sort of hate filled nonsense.

I understand the broader issue. But now we have a new batch of enemies to understand and defeat.

 

[icehorse]

If I may ask, in what way was this a huge failure of the first amendment? I think, to answer this, you might first say what you think the amendment actually means and what it allows, and how you think phrases like "Jews will not replace us" fit into what the amendment protects. (By the way, did you know the US has more gays than Jews? There's a surprise, I'll bet.)

I guess you haven't read the thread, it is getting long...

The asshats got a permit to speak. The counter-protestors shut down the asshats before they could finish their asshat protest. I have heard very little coming from the MSM concerning the fact that the counter-protestors and the cops effectively stifled the speech of the asshats.

 

[icehorse]

Why independent? Without violent people exercising their "freedom of speech", violently - according to news reports, that murder would not have happened. The two are linked

Freedom of speech is great but it comes with personal responsibility

THIS thread is about how free speech was trampled this weekend. Of course if we're looking at the broader event, the murderer is a crucial piece of the puzzle. But from the perspective of free speech issues, the murderer was not involved.

 

[idav]

I understand the broader issue. But now we have a new batch of enemies to understand and defeat.

What happened in Charlottesville is a clear a case of how not to handle it but I'm not convinced rights were violated. The anti-protest group had a right to free speech too.

 

[shmogie]

.

Quite an intellectual response here. When you have utterly nothing to say, you have something to say

 

[shmogie]

What happened in Charlottesville is a clear a case of how not to handle it but I'm not convinced rights were violated. The anti-protest group had a right to free speech too.

Did the anti protest group have a permit ?

 

[idav]

Did the anti protest group have a permit ?

Permit or not people will boo you off stage if you suck.

 

[Flame]

Did the anti protest group have a permit ?

They had two.

Charlottesville Grants 2 Permits for Counterprotests of Unite the Right Rally