Can science prove or disprove the existence of a Spiritual existence? God?

[R34L1TY]

This is true if and only if "a spiritual being exists" cannot be tested by experiment, i.e. there is no possible test we could do that behaves differently than we'd expect, due to spiritual beings.

And if spiritual beings affect literally nothing, in what way can they be said to exist?

Unfortunately you cannot prove that something spiritual does or does not exist. Just because you don't think it affects something or can't be tested by an experiment does not mean it doesn't exist. Yes..we can conclude that the factual evidence is against the existance of a creator but that doesn't mean we can disprove of a spiritual one.

I understand what you're saying but proving something doesn't exist 99.9999% is still not proving that it doesn't exist. The evidence would be on our side but we must keep an open mind to the "what ifs."

You cannot disprove spirituality and what it leads to. I agree that just because I cannot prove that unicorns never existed (talking about actual ones; not rhinoceroses) doesn't mean that they should be looked at as if they do. Its the same concept with everything in science. There is no such thing as 100% certainty which is what makes it interesting.

 

[Looncall]

Our logic is different from the logic of the universe. ours is limited.

Please explain what you mean by "logic" here. As it stands, your statement makes no sense to me.

 

[Call_of_the_Wild]

Yes..we can conclude that the factual evidence is against the existance of a creator but that doesn't mean we can disprove of a spiritual one.

Wait a minute, in what way can you conclude that the factual evidence is against the existence of a creator??? Do tell.

 

[Call_of_the_Wild]

This is a tough one but if you would tell me what # is one less than infinity I think we could count down to 0. That's why no to points are an infinite distance apart

So if you can count down to infinity, what # would you start off with in order to count down??

 

[Call_of_the_Wild]

All of them.




There are no such two points.


Because the quotes are talking about different houses.

 

[R34L1TY]

Wait a minute, in what way can you conclude that the factual evidence is against the existence of a creator??? Do tell.

Big Bang with an Evolution in there.

 

[PolyHedral]

You are discussing maths with a university-level mathematician. I could start from the axioms of number theory and work up to show you that I'm right, but I suspect I'd be wasting both of our time.

Just answer the question: which two points on an infinite road are an infinite distance apart?

 

[Call_of_the_Wild]

Big Bang with an Evolution in there.

All the big bang does is prove that the universe had a beginning, nothing more, nothing less. As far as evolution is concerned, it never happened.

 

[R34L1TY]

All the big bang does is prove that the universe had a beginning, nothing more, nothing less. As far as evolution is concerned, it never happened.

Prove it.

 

[Call_of_the_Wild]

You are discussing maths with a university-level mathematician. I could start from the axioms of number theory and work up to show you that I'm right, but I suspect I'd be wasting both of our time.

:cigar:

Just answer the question: which two points on an infinite road are an infinite distance apart?

Hmmm, since this question already have the scenario of an "infinite road", the two points that are an infinite distance apart is any point that is an infinite distance away from the present point. Obviously.

 

[Call_of_the_Wild]

Prove it.

Prove what? That evolution is a joke or that the universe began to exist with the big bang?

 

[R34L1TY]

Prove what? That evolution is a joke or that the universe began to exist with the big bang?

What education do you have again? Do you even know what a chromosome is?

Id like to hear exactly why Evolution is a joke and what you would define Evolution as.

 

[PolyHedral]

Hmmm, since this question already have the scenario of an "infinite road", the two points that are an infinite distance apart is any point that is an infinite distance away from the present point. Obviously.

That's a tautology. Given a point on the road, e.g. the one at "0", how many points are an infinite distance from it? Can you name them?

 

[Call_of_the_Wild]

What education do you have again? Do you even know what a chromosome is?

What does education have to do with it? Are you a biologists??? If the answer is no, then we are on the same level. But, even if you were, no biologists can prove evolution with science, as evolution is not part of science, but part of a religion.

Id like to hear exactly why Evolution is a joke and what you would define Evolution as.

Evolution is a joke because it is taught in school as a science, despite it not being a science. Science is based on experiment and observation. We have neither experimented nor have we observed the theory of evolution, at least on the scale that evolutionists would like. Yes, there is small scale evolution, as there are many different varieties of dogs, cats, fish, bears, etc. This is what we can see, but what we don't see is animals producing different kind of animals. And before you start crying about "what do you mean by kind??", well.....DOGS PRODUCE DOGS, CATS PRODUCE CATS, FISH PRODUCE FISH. A dog is a dog, a cat is a cat, they are different kind of animals/mammals. If you, or anyone else believe that long ago, animals were changing in to different kind of animals (such as a dog producing a non-dog), then you have left science and resorted to religion.That is in a nut shell. Now I predict you will say "thats not what evolution is"......or..."you dont know what evolution is", or both. But that IS what evolution teaches. Evolution teaches that we all share a common ancestor. So if we all share a common ancestor, then it follows that long ago animals were producing different kind of animals. If there was ever a point were a dog didnt exist, and now it exist, that mean that it came from a NON-DOG. There is no way around it. You can sit here and argue until you are blue in the face, but the fact still remains...dogs produce dogs...cats produce cats...etc.

 

[Call_of_the_Wild]

That's a tautology. Given a point on the road, e.g. the one at "0", how many points are an infinite distance from it? Can you name them?

Poly.....you are asking me these questions yet Im still waiting on my question to be answered. If I am an infinite distance away from you and you are running towards me, that would mean that for every step you took, there are an infinite amount of steps to go. No matter how long you run, or how fast you run, you will never get to me. So how could you ever reach me???

I am waiting for a definite answer to this instead of this wishy washy stuff....but since I know there is no "good" answer to this, then this furthers my point. Time cannot be eternal in its past, because if the past is eternal, it would never reach the present moment for the same exact reason why you wouldn't reach me in the example that I gave. The only logical way to rid ourselves of this absurdity is to posit a timeless cause. A cause that was not dependent upon time in order to exist. A cause that was outside the boundary of time. A cause that was the originator of time. This is the only way out...but if you can think of another way out, I would love to see.

 

[PolyHedral]

Poly.....you are asking me these questions yet Im still waiting on my question to be answered. If I am an infinite distance away from you and you are running towards me, that would mean that for every step you took, there are an infinite amount of steps to go. No matter how long you run, or how fast you run, you will never get to me. So how could you ever reach me???

Unless you answer my question, we don't know for sure that there's anywhere for you to stand.

 

[Call_of_the_Wild]

Unless you answer my question, we don't know for sure that there's anywhere for you to stand.

Ahh yes..evasiveness

 

[lunakilo]

What does education have to do with it? Are you a biologists??? If the answer is no, then we are on the same level. But, even if you were, no biologists can prove evolution with science, as evolution is not part of science, but part of a religion.



Evolution is a joke because it is taught in school as a science, despite it not being a science. Science is based on experiment and observation. We have neither experimented nor have we observed the theory of evolution, at least on the scale that evolutionists would like. Yes, there is small scale evolution, as there are many different varieties of dogs, cats, fish, bears, etc. This is what we can see, but what we don't see is animals producing different kind of animals. And before you start crying about "what do you mean by kind??", well.....DOGS PRODUCE DOGS, CATS PRODUCE CATS, FISH PRODUCE FISH. A dog is a dog, a cat is a cat, they are different kind of animals/mammals. If you, or anyone else believe that long ago, animals were changing in to different kind of animals (such as a dog producing a non-dog), then you have left science and resorted to religion.That is in a nut shell. Now I predict you will say "thats not what evolution is"......or..."you dont know what evolution is", or both. But that IS what evolution teaches. Evolution teaches that we all share a common ancestor. So if we all share a common ancestor, then it follows that long ago animals were producing different kind of animals. If there was ever a point were a dog didnt exist, and now it exist, that mean that it came from a NON-DOG. There is no way around it. You can sit here and argue until you are blue in the face, but the fact still remains...dogs produce dogs...cats produce cats...etc.

Are you really still going at this?!

Call_of_the_Wild, have you ever heard of small changes?

Yes dog produce dog, but the puppy is not an exact copy of any of its parents. It is SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT from its parents.
When that dog has puppies those are again going to be dogs but again dogs that are slightly different from its parents.
Over many generations all these little differences add up.
let us call the first dog 'dog 1' and the decendent which we are looking at many generations later 'dog x'
many generations later 'dog x' will still have offspring which is slightly different from 'dog x', but could be VERY DIFFERENT from 'dog 1'

You can claim that 'dog x' is still a dog even if it is very differnt from 'dog 1' simply because it is a descendant of 'dog 1', but that would be like claiming that you are an Australopithecus.

 

[PolyHedral]

Ahh yes..evasiveness

So answer my question. Which two points are an infinite distance away from each other? (And don't use a tautology like the last time.) If you can tell me, I can answer your question.

 

[adi2d]

So if you can count down to infinity, what # would you start off with in order to count down??

That is why I said I needed someone to tell me what # is one less than infinity. If you can do that the rest is easy