Can Religion Survive Being Wrong About Homosexuality?

[lunamoth]

Not only was the church wrong in rejecting the scientific view that the earth revolved around the sun, it revealed a heresy: humans (once again) putting themselves at the center of the universe.

No doubt the same will eventually be revealed about the church's heresy regarding homosexuality: humans allowing their fear of 'other' to displace love.

luna

 

[angellous_evangellous]

What they believe now has little to do with what the Bible actually says - in any language. That's the same wherever you go, in most faiths.

But they wrote it, handed it down generationally, and the interpretation is consistent from the time of the writing until today because we actually have many historical writings for Christianity and Judaism.

It's true that interpretation often changes throughout history.

The Church and the Jewish interpretation of homosexuality - from the writing of the original works until today has been one of the very few things that have not undergone revision. The argument for misinterpretation is incredibly weak.

 

[Feathers in Hair]

For me, I suppose that how the issue was treated would be the major factor on how or if a religion survived. For example, if they said acted on the belief of "We think it's wrong, but who among us is right, so I'll respect your right to love whom you wish as you respect mine and honor you as a fellow being of equal worth in the eyes of our creator", then I would imagine that it would survive nicely. If they only gave the latter part lip service (emphasizing the 'it's wrong' part), survival might be iffy. If a faith used the issue to condemn certain peoples and to state that eternal damnation will be theirs if they don't change who they they love, then I kind of wonder if the vitirolic (sp) nature of such a brand of faith would ultimately destroy itself.

 

[sojourner]

For me, I suppose that how the issue was treated would be the major factor on how or if a religion survived. For example, if they said acted on the belief of "We think it's wrong, but who among us is right, so I'll respect your right to love whom you wish as you respect mine and honor you as a fellow being of equal worth in the eyes of our creator", then I would imagine that it would survive nicely. If they only gave the latter part lip service (emphasizing the 'it's wrong' part), survival might be iffy. If a faith used the issue to condemn certain peoples and to state that eternal damnation will be theirs if they don't change who they they love, then I kind of wonder if the vitirolic (sp) nature of such a brand of faith would ultimately destroy itself.

And yet, despite this, the Southern Baptists seem to be flourishing...

 

[!Fluffy!]

I don't know if religions will survive, but I'm pretty sure G_d will be okay.

 

[robtex]

I don't know if religions will survive, but I'm pretty sure G_d will be okay.

so we can understand your post in context which God(s) do you believe in?

 

[Jaymes]

And yet, despite this, the Southern Baptists seem to be flourishing...

Personal experience, but...

The churches here seem to be emptying out. It seems like the old members are dying off, and not enough young people are taking their place. There are several churches within a few miles of me that get a mere handful of people each Sunday.

Or course there are bigger ones, but at least here it seems to be going out of style, so to speak.

 

[Gentoo]

If homosexuality is ambiguous in the Greek, why does the Greek Othrodox church consistently speak out against it, not marrying homosexuals or promoting the practice of homosexuality?

Maybe as a way to separate themselves from the ancient polytheistic Greeks?

 

[angellous_evangellous]

Maybe as a way to separate themselves from the ancient polytheistic Greeks?

No, I don't think so.

Greeks and Romans celebrated homosexuality but mostly as a deviant sex practice. That is, homoerotic behavior was in addition to heterosexual marriage (either adult or pederastic), although some wanted to do so. This homoerotic behavior can be expressed with adult friends (like Socrates and Alicbiades), pederasty, soldiers in the field, or children and slaves (both were sexually available to the pater familias and whoever he authorized).

I don't think that the Christian teachings against homosexuality (both in the NT and other Christian writings) were to subvert Greco-Roman practices, but rather re-inforced common moral philosophy - that humans should live according to reason (or religion) rather than animalistic impulses.

note: Commited Same-Sex Relationships in Plato

 

[!Fluffy!]

so we can understand your post in context which God(s) do you believe in?

The real one. The Creator.

 

[Sahar]

It currently looks as if it will one day be proven (as much as anything can be proven) that homosexuality is determined at birth. Consequently, many religious leaders in Christianity, Islam, and Orthodox Judaism will be proven wrong about homosexuality. So, will they or their religious views survive?

One day it will be proven that homosexuality is not determined at birth and no-one was created or will be created as a homosexual.
Quraan can't be wrong about anything and thus Islam.

 

[Faint]

So, will they or their religious views survive? Will being proven wrong on this issue, and issue that they have made so much of, weaken their moral authority on other moral issues? What do you think?

The adherents of the faiths you mentioned are quite good at ignoring scientific evidence, as well as contradictory and immoral passages in their holy books. Most people in general seem to lack decent critical thinking skills...adding a new variable to their limited world view will do little to change their minds. Moreover, judging by where we're at with the fact of evolution and it's extreme LACK of acceptance...we would probably end up with a whole new group of inborn-homosexuality deniers. Maybe they'll name their cause "Intelligent Sexuality" (IS for short) or something just as ridiculous.

Even if homosexuality is completely proven to be determined at birth (which is likely) the religious leaders will still be held in high esteem by their flocks, and accepted as moral authorities by those who don't know any better or need someone to tell them how to live their own lives. The wiser of these leaders will adapt their teachings to accomodate the acceptance of homosexuality, otherwise their churches will likely fade to the fringes of belief currently occupied by the more extreme, backwards thinking hate groups like the neo-nazis, or the KKK.

Keep in mind, the success of a meme complex does not depend on it's truth (or lack thereof) but rather how well it serves to bind people together and function as a social glue.

 

[Faint]

One day it will be proven that homosexuality is not determined at birth and no-one was created or will be created as a homosexual.
Quraan can't be wrong about anything and thus Islam.

Please enlighten us how people learn or decide to become homosexuals. Why would anyone consciously make the decision to be gay?

 

[sandy whitelinger]

It currently looks as if it will one day be proven (as much as anything can be proven) that homosexuality is determined at birth. Consequently, many religious leaders in Christianity, Islam, and Orthodox Judaism will be proven wrong about homosexuality. So, will they or their religious views survive? Will being proven wrong on this issue, and issue that they have made so much of, weaken their moral authority on other moral issues? What do you think?

If alcoholism is proven to be genetic could we not then use the same argument to say that alcholism is God-ordained and therefore not sinful?

 

[YmirGF]

Like many have implied it is all in how they "handle" the new science. Stem cell research comes to mind and the current hysteria over it, which is based largely on complete ignorance.

Religion has never been a bastion of intelligent thinking on human sexuality, imho, although their often significantly less-than-intelligent followers perceive them as such.

 

[Green Gaia]

Please enlighten us how people learn or decide to become homosexuals. Why would anyone consciously make the decision to be gay?

Obviously Faint, we're all lying about the "not choosing this" thing. It was part of the fine print that came with the toaster oven, don't you remember?

 

[standing_alone]

It was part of the fine print that came with the toaster oven, don't you remember?

Yeah... Got more than I bargained for when I got that damn thing...

 

[standing_alone]

One day it will be proven that homosexuality is not determined at birth and no-one was created or will be created as a homosexual.
Quraan can't be wrong about anything and thus Islam.

Well, that's quite the frightening assertion...

So if scientific evidence contradicted the Quraan, it would be the scientific evidence (that is gathered through a process involving the scientific method) and not the Quraan (a mere holy book) that would be wrong?

 

[PureX]

It currently looks as if it will one day be proven (as much as anything can be proven) that homosexuality is determined at birth. Consequently, many religious leaders in Christianity, Islam, and Orthodox Judaism will be proven wrong about homosexuality. So, will they or their religious views survive? Will being proven wrong on this issue, and issue that they have made so much of, weaken their moral authority on other moral issues? What do you think?

Being wrong about the mechanics of human sexuality is easily forgiven. Being divisive, prejudiced, bigoted, and abusive toward other human beings simply because they're different is not. If religions continue to try and hold themselves together be holding others apart from them, then they deserve to be left behind in the dust of history.

 

[Wandered Off]

If religions continue to try and hold themselves together be holding others apart from them, then they deserve to be left behind in the dust of history.

Very well said, PureX. Unfortunately, what holds many believers together in the first place is having a "them" so there can be an "us". It must be more fun to feel part of the special team on God's side, as if God chooses sides.