not to get too personal, but i was raised a christian prude, it wasnt til i was 18 that i started questioning my beliefs, and by the time i was through praying to god for guidance, talking to several pastors, deacons, sunday school teachers, fellow brothers and sisters in christ, my family etc, reading the bible, several christian and atheist books on the issue, and finally making up my mind, i was 22... by that time the damage had already been done. here i was an atheist prude having lost the best years of my life, not having had fun or experimented with anything....sex, drugs, gambling, parties, flirting, chasing tail at the club nothing...... but the real damage had only started, because at that point i only had christian friends, no members of other religions and certainly not those evil rebellious atheists i have been taught to stay away from.....well, to make matters worse, my doubts and questions slowly alienated a good chunk of my christian friends, and by the time i finally came out as a non believer, i had but 2 christian friends/friends at all.. remaining, who were really secular/in name only christians..... so here i was at 24 years old, robbed of my youth, unable to make new friends because my prude christian personality had already been shaped, a lone wolf with no social support system...i couldnt fit into christian or secular society....which naturally lead to further withdrawal and depression.....it took years and years to undo some of the damage, but plenty remains and can never be undone. talk about missing out on all the fun
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not to get too personal, but i was raised a christian prude, it wasnt til i was 18 that i started questioning my beliefs, and by the time i was through praying to god for guidance, talking to several pastors, deacons, sunday school teachers, fellow brothers and sisters in christ, my family etc, reading the bible, several christian and atheist books on the issue, and finally making up my mind, i was 22... by that time the damage had already been done. here i was an atheist prude having lost the best years of my life, not having had fun or experimented with anything....sex, drugs, gambling, parties, flirting, chasing tail at the club nothing...... but the real damage had only started, because at that point i only had christian friends, no members of other religions and certainly not those evil rebellious atheists i have been taught to stay away from.....well, to make matters worse, my doubts and questions slowly alienated a good chunk of my christian friends, and by the time i finally came out as a non believer, i had but 2 christian friends/friends at all.. remaining, who were really secular/in name only christians..... so here i was at 24 years old, robbed of my youth, unable to make new friends because my prude christian personality had already been shaped, a lone wolf with no social support system...i couldnt fit into christian or secular society....which naturally lead to further withdrawal and depression.....it took years and years to undo some of the damage, but plenty remains and can never be undone. talk about missing out on all the fun
AmbiguousGuy
Well-Known Member
Too bad! You missed this pic of me....
You don't look like you're missing out on any fun.
I'd like to address it:
Religious bigotry is acceptable or not depending upon just who is scorned.
- We may dis Catholics, Mormons, Scientologists & Baptists all we want. They're fair game.
- We may cast some aspersions upon Hindus & Muslims, but there are limits because they have some victimhood street cred.
- We must walk on eggs regarding Jews & Amer-Indians, since they have the ultimate in victimhood status.
Example of bigotry:
I recently burned a dead mouse in my wood stove.
So I named the stove "Mauschwitz". ("Maus" is "mouse in German, of course.)
Example of good clean rip roaring fun:
[youtube]3f72CTDe4-0[/youtube]
Tom Lehrer - The Vatican Rag - YouTube
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Alceste
Vagabond
Ethnicity is not a choice. That's one difference.
That's not to say religious "bigotry" is ok, but criticism on the basis of religious belief is often fair and reasonable.
Alceste
Vagabond
That's a really sad story. If it's any consolation, I'm almost 40 and I'm still having fun. Sex, booze, parties, you name it!
how about MAUthausen? , although i would agree mauschwitz is more accurate because it refers to a MOUSE SWEATING in an oven MAUS + SCHWITZEN but then again one could argue the oven is the mouses HOUSE.
Gjallarhorn
N'yog-Sothep
Um, because it ruins the joke? Or at least lowers it to a less identifiable one.
how so? auschwitz and mauthausen were both nazi concentration camps. one could be a wordplay on mouse sweat, the other on mouse house
that would be true for the general population i suppose.
LemonGrenade
Member
Hi. I think you equate theism with the spiritual side of life too exclusively; Buddhism one example to the contrary. To my mind there are many who derive spiritual nourishment from practices devoid of theistic content.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
And more often than not, it's based on misconceptions and half-truths perpetrated by the ignorant, and encouraging further ignorance. You know me, Alceste, well enough to know how much I detest stereotyping and prejudice based on someone's religious affiliation. I don't care if it's directed at me or at somebody else.
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Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
I'll take it a step further... Some groups are not only "fair game"; it's actually politically correct to dis them. It's the cool thing to do. You make fun of one religion and you get killed in retaliation. You make fun of another one, make lots of people laugh, and get rich off of your prejudices.
Hufflechuff
Member
Re OP. Life seems much more fun now I don't feel like God is always judging me. Everything else remains the same. And the wonder of what we are learning about the world/universe through science is awe-inspiring. A drunk has fun, but I wouldn't recommend being a devout alcoholic.
ImmortalFlame
Woke gremlin
You are aware that what you just did was stereotype a rather large group of people as being "ignorant", right?
and yet your religion did the very same thing you "detest" to the, as your church leaders put it "NEGRO".
you call those who point out this historical fact bigots. oh the irony.
They'll say it's OK because religious orientation is a "choice".
Did you choose? I certainly can't choose to not be an atheist.
historical fact: it wasnt until 1978, after well over a decade of civil rights criticisms and pressure from secular society that all of the sudden your church leaders received a miraculous revelation from the heavens instructing them to reverse the racial restriction policy...
Brigham Young comments about blacks
"You see some classes of the human family that are black, uncouth, uncomely, disagreeable and low in their habits, wild, and seemingly deprived of nearly all the blessings of the intelligence that is generally bestowed upon mankind....Cain slew his brother. Cain might have been killed, and that would have put a termination to that line of human beings. This was not to be, and the Lord put a mark upon him, which is the flat nose and black skin." (Journal of Discourses, vol. 7, p. 290).
"In our first settlement in Missouri, it was said by our enemies that we intended to tamper with the slaves, not that we had any idea of the kind, for such a thing never entered our minds. We knew that the children of Ham were to be the "servant of servants," and no power under heaven could hinder it, so long as the Lord would permit them to welter under the curse and those were known to be our religious views concerning them." (Journal of Discourses, vol. 2, p. 172).
"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so." (Journal of Discourses, vol. 10, p. 110).
Brigham Young said you are damned if you deny polygamy.
"Now if any of you will deny the plurality of wives, and continue to do so, I promise that you will be damned," (Journal of Discourses, vol. 3, p. 266). Also, "The only men who become Gods, even the Sons of God, are those who enter into polygamy," (Journal of Discourses, vol. 11, p. 269).
Brigham Young said he had never given any counsel that was wrong.
"I am here to answer. I shall be on hand to answer when I am called upon, for all the counsel and for all the instruction that I have given to this people. If there is an Elder here, or any member of this Church, called the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, who can bring up the first idea, the first sentence that I have delivered to the people as counsel that is wrong, I really wish they would do it; but they cannot do it, for the simple reason that I have never given counsel that is wrong; this is the reason." (Journal of Discourses, vol. 16, p. 161).
now, tell me katzpur, was your esteemed leader and prophet wrong or was god wrong.
Brigham Young comments about blacks
"You see some classes of the human family that are black, uncouth, uncomely, disagreeable and low in their habits, wild, and seemingly deprived of nearly all the blessings of the intelligence that is generally bestowed upon mankind....Cain slew his brother. Cain might have been killed, and that would have put a termination to that line of human beings. This was not to be, and the Lord put a mark upon him, which is the flat nose and black skin." (Journal of Discourses, vol. 7, p. 290).
"In our first settlement in Missouri, it was said by our enemies that we intended to tamper with the slaves, not that we had any idea of the kind, for such a thing never entered our minds. We knew that the children of Ham were to be the "servant of servants," and no power under heaven could hinder it, so long as the Lord would permit them to welter under the curse and those were known to be our religious views concerning them." (Journal of Discourses, vol. 2, p. 172).
"Shall I tell you the law of God in regard to the African race? If the white man who belongs to the chosen seed mixes his blood with the seed of Cain, the penalty, under the law of God, is death on the spot. This will always be so." (Journal of Discourses, vol. 10, p. 110).
Brigham Young said you are damned if you deny polygamy.
"Now if any of you will deny the plurality of wives, and continue to do so, I promise that you will be damned," (Journal of Discourses, vol. 3, p. 266). Also, "The only men who become Gods, even the Sons of God, are those who enter into polygamy," (Journal of Discourses, vol. 11, p. 269).
Brigham Young said he had never given any counsel that was wrong.
"I am here to answer. I shall be on hand to answer when I am called upon, for all the counsel and for all the instruction that I have given to this people. If there is an Elder here, or any member of this Church, called the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, who can bring up the first idea, the first sentence that I have delivered to the people as counsel that is wrong, I really wish they would do it; but they cannot do it, for the simple reason that I have never given counsel that is wrong; this is the reason." (Journal of Discourses, vol. 16, p. 161).
now, tell me katzpur, was your esteemed leader and prophet wrong or was god wrong.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
And which rather large group did I stereotype?
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Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
Brigham Young was wrong. That does not make all, or even most, Mormons racist. Furthermore, even though there was definitely once a racist policy in place, you really know very little about why the policy was actually changed. Now could we please get back on topic. If you wish to bash my faith, at least be courteous enough to the OP to start your own thread.
Katzpur
Not your average Mormon
Can you really? I ask because I'm not all that sure it's a choice. I can and have choosen Mormonism over Lutheranism and Catholicism and Presbyterianism, but I don't think I could actually choose not to believe in God. I've actually tried to talk myself into believing that He's just a figment of my imagination, but I just can't do it. I'm not all that convinced that you could choose to believe in Him when His existence simply doesn't seem reasonable to you. Can you turn belief off and on like you can a water faucet, just because somebody tells you your eternal soul is at stake?
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