atheism is a (religious position)

[shunyadragon]

Read the newspaper sometime, or watch the news, or stand on any street corner long enough, and then tell me what hope that you have for mankind?

Read the newspapers Bools and records going back to at least the Tanakh. Human violence and in human conflict is as old as human civilization. you neglect humanity has a positive side. Yes the Jewish, Christian and Islamic countries are prone to tribal violence, I prefer the more peaceful less religious Nordic countries

Negative views like yours fans the flames of tribal conflicts;

 

[shunyadragon]

My understanding is that the gospels were written around 60-70 years after Jesus. It's still not eye witness, and its still unreliable.

Actually it remains later for the present versions. I emphasis in there present form, because there is evidence of editing and redacting, and possibly an early simpler Q.

The various references indicate that the estimated range of the date of the gospels ~60 to ~120 AD with Mark being first and John last. The problem is the fact that nothing is found before this early period. the later scraps and early manuscripts after 200 AD show editing and redacting and different versions, No manuscripts or even scraps are known before 200 AD, Yes some sort of early Mark gospel existed early and a possible Q and sayings of Jesus existed early, but the original text is unknown. I do consider the later John to the one that lacks significant editing and redacting and is basically as it was written. The letters have variable provenance of authorship and some questions of provenance without early copies.

 

[shunyadragon]

...oh, but I was!

??????

Nice badmouthing humanity based on ancient myth,

 

[F1fan]

...oh, but I was!

??????

You bad mouth God and you aren't worried about God judging you harshly?

Or are you one of those Christians who believe God is powerless to condemn you to hell because you accept Jesus as savior?

I've heard some Christians actually claim that they can murder people and still go to heaven because they were saved before the murders. No doubt those Lutherans and Catholics who committed the Holocaust must have been told by their Christian leadership that it was moral to murder Jewish people, much the same way that Christians of the 17th century thought it moral to torture and murder people for witchcraft, some 30,000 souls murdered because believers interpreted the Bible a certain, self-serving way.

Do you think Christian Nazis and those Christian who condemned people at witch trials went to heaven despite their acts after being saved?

 

[DNB]

The problem remains there are not any witness testimony date.d to the life of Jesus. The gospels are not known to exist within a hundred years of the death of Jesus, What we have today complied and edited later.

All the Apostles were contemporaries of Jesus - the saw, touched, and ate with him - they wrote their testimonies. Mark, the earliest is between 60 - 70 ad.
Oral communication and tradition was a very accurate and reliable form of transmission - people without literacy or having writing utensils readily available, would train themselves by necessity to listen acutely and remember .
That's the smallest factor - the holy spirit brought to memory any facts outside their recollection or what they were privy to at the time.
The Gospel was meant to spread far and wide, under the auspices of God.

 

[DNB]

Read the newspapers Bools and records going back to at least the Tanakh. Human violence and in human conflict is as old as human civilization. you neglect humanity has a positive side. Yes the Jewish, Christian and Islamic countries are prone to tribal violence, I prefer the more peaceful less religious Nordic countries

Negative views like yours fans the flames of tribal conflicts;

The world is a cesspool, including Scandinavia - you haven't been visiting planet earth lately?

 

[shunyadragon]

The world is a cesspool, including Scandinavia - you haven't been visiting planet earth lately?

Scandinavia is pretty wonderful peaceful place to visit and live there. I have been there. I have been around the world and seen the good and bad.

Why would God Create a Cesspool planet. God is the omnipotent, all powerful all knowing Creator, and responsible for everything as it is?

The most peaceful and without terrible troubles of the world you describe, and the are mostly agnostic, atheist and very marginally religious.

The USA is bit of a scary and uncomfortable place to live as a non-Christian.

 

[DNB]

You bad mouth God and you aren't worried about God judging you harshly?

Or are you one of those Christians who believe God is powerless to condemn you to hell because you accept Jesus as savior?

I've heard some Christians actually claim that they can murder people and still go to heaven because they were saved before the murders. No doubt those Lutherans and Catholics who committed the Holocaust must have been told by their Christian leadership that it was moral to murder Jewish people, much the same way that Christians of the 17th century thought it moral to torture and murder people for witchcraft, some 30,000 souls murdered because believers interpreted the Bible a certain, self-serving way.

Do you think Christian Nazis and those Christian who condemned people at witch trials went to heaven despite their acts after being saved?

Mankind is evil - I haven't a clue as to what you are talking about outside of that???

 

[shunyadragon]

Mankind is evil - I haven't a clue as to what you are talking about outside of that???

Why would God Create a Cesspool planet and an evil humanity. God is the omnipotent, all powerful all knowing Creator, and responsible for everything as it is?

 

[DNB]

Scandinavia is pretty wonderful peaceful place to visit and live there. I have been there. I have been around the world and seen the good and bad.

Why would God Create a Cesspool planet. God is the omnipotent, all powerful all knowing Creator, and responsible for everything as it is?

The most peaceful and without terrible troubles of the world you describe, and the are mostly agnostic, atheist and very marginally religious.

The USA is bit of a scary and uncomfortable place to live as a non-Christian.

Man is wicked - there is absolutely no excuse for the atrocities that are committed throughout the centuries, and on a daily basis.
Even the best of those on earth, are miserable failures when it comes to honouring God with their actions, obedience, and worship.
No one loves their neighbour as themselves, nor God as He deserves.

 

[F1fan]

Mankind is evil -

Just as God created. Remember, God admits to creating evil, so that's where the buck stops.

I haven't a clue as to what you are talking about outside of that???

Not a surprise. Your dogma is quite superficial and does not hold up to critique.

 

[F1fan]

Man is wicked - there is absolutely no excuse for the atrocities that are committed throughout the centuries, and on a daily basis.

They are following God's example, i.e. genocide, rape, theft, and don;t forget the global flood that killed everyone except seven people, who were not themselves moral. That's poor judgment on God's part.

Even the best of those on earth, are miserable failures when it comes to honouring God with their actions, obedience, and worship.
No one loves their neighbour as themselves, nor God as He deserves.

Are you telling us about yourself?

 

[DNB]

Just as God created. Remember, God admits to creating evil, so that's where the buck stops.

Not a surprise. Your dogma is quite superficial and does not hold up to critique.

Humans are wicked

 

[DNB]

They are following God's example, i.e. genocide, rape, theft, and don;t forget the global flood that killed everyone except seven people, who were not themselves moral. That's poor judgment on God's part.

Are you telling us about yourself?

Eight people survived the flood

 

[F1fan]

Humans are wicked

You are not representative of all humans. There are some very good people out there.

You should ask your God why he made humans wicked. God has alternative options, but he chose poorly.

Eight people survived the flood

Who sinned, so the whole Flood solution failed. I suggest you find a more competent God.

 

[Mock Turtle]

Humans are wicked

100% or what amount, and backed by what evidence? Or simply projection from delusional beliefs perhaps. Besides being an appalling philosophy of life to live by - expecting the worst all the time. Yuk!

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Man is wicked - there is absolutely no excuse for the atrocities that are committed throughout the centuries, and on a daily basis.
Even the best of those on earth, are miserable failures when it comes to honouring God with their actions, obedience, and worship.
No one loves their neighbour as themselves, nor God as He deserves.

Do you think that your criticism here of God's creation reflects the love you think God deserves?

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Humans are wicked

Eight people survived the flood

Strange, then, that anybody at all should have survived the flood, isn't it? I mean, God could have just wiped them all out and been done with it, since surely an omniscient God would know that the progeny of those 8 would be just as wicked as before!

Your "christianity" has given you a most depressing and disturbing view of what you suppose is "God's creation." This is very hard to understand.

 

[DNB]

You are not representative of all humans. There are some very good people out there.

You should ask your God why he made humans wicked. God has alternative options, but he chose poorly.


Who sinned, so the whole Flood solution failed. I suggest you find a more competent God.

Humans are evil - I would've destroyed them also - and I'm not an infinitesimal fraction as righteous and holy as God

 

[DNB]

100% or what amount, and backed by what evidence? Or simply projection from delusional beliefs perhaps. Besides being an appalling philosophy of life to live by - expecting the worst all the time. Yuk!

You ask for evidence, because you assume that my claims are conjecture or indoctrination, are you serious?
.
And you conclude that my views are pessimistic, when they are meant to reverse the effects of desensitization?

How oblivious are you?