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Anyone feel they are considered poor?

MissAlice

Well-Known Member
I don't really consider myself poor but I do live within a tight budget. I only afford what I need and even then I try and keep it at a minimum. I've never been comfortable in telling people how much I make or what I do for a living.

I've had people ask me the magic question "why?" I really don't know how to answer that. What ****** me off though is whenever I try to make friends with anyone they notice what I don't have. Here's a few examples: Cable, air conditioning, mobile phone, pretty clothes, mp3 player, Wii games...and there's more but I'd rather not bother sharing. It's as if aspergers doesn't come close to weird as the way I live my lifestyle.

Whenever anyone asks me to go shopping, go to a casino or hang out in a restaurant I hesitate mainly because I can't afford it. Even when I do hang out with them, there's always this stupid issues about money. "You should get a debit card or you should do this or you should do that. I get so sick of it. Why do humans have to define friendship or relationships on wealth and status?

I just don't get it.... >_<
 

Madhuri

RF Goddess
Staff member
Premium Member
Hmm, I can't say I've had that experience. I can imagine it would be frustrating. It's very cultural though Alice. For the most part, people don't mean anything by it. Of course, there are also those who enjoy being judgemental and feeling superior. You have to stay away from those people. But generally, the average person means well. If they are giving advice, it probably comes naturally to them because they are culturally conditioned to see this as a normal behaviour.
 

Rakhel

Well-Known Member
I once told someone I managed to feed a family of 5 on $20 for a week, and they thought I was mad. It was all the money we had and everyone needed to eat.

I admit it was hard to do, but not impossible.
 

.lava

Veteran Member
I don't really consider myself poor but I do live within a tight budget. I only afford what I need and even then I try and keep it at a minimum. I've never been comfortable in telling people how much I make or what I do for a living.

I've had people ask me the magic question "why?" I really don't know how to answer that. What ****** me off though is whenever I try to make friends with anyone they notice what I don't have. Here's a few examples: Cable, air conditioning, mobile phone, pretty clothes, mp3 player, Wii games...and there's more but I'd rather not bother sharing. It's as if aspergers doesn't come close to weird as the way I live my lifestyle.

Whenever anyone asks me to go shopping, go to a casino or hang out in a restaurant I hesitate mainly because I can't afford it. Even when I do hang out with them, there's always this stupid issues about money. "You should get a debit card or you should do this or you should do that. I get so sick of it. Why do humans have to define friendship or relationships on wealth and status?

I just don't get it.... >_<

Why do humans have to define friendship or relationships on wealth and status?

because they are poor. i certainly do not want to have friends who chose to be with me for what i have. i rather live alone. i rather be friends with stray dogs. at least what they love is not what i have but what i could give. i could give love. so those who care for money and what money could buy should walk in bazaars and try to find some love to buy and taste what's given in the name of love instead love itself

.
 

Sunstone

De Diablo Del Fora
Premium Member
I think Americans are especially apt to let wealth interfere with friendships.

Perhaps that's because ours is a culture in which wealth is mystified -- it not only connotes wealth itself, but it also, in some largely unexamined way, wealth implies success in life, and (beyond success in life) wealth also suggests how deserving and virtuous one is. Therefore, there can be a bit of a stigma in not possessing wealth equal to, or greater than, your friend's wealth.

It's more than the simple fact that your friend is less wealthy than you. It's also the mystical "fact" that your friend, because he or she is less wealthy than you, is less successful than you, and hence, less deserving than you.

Some people have traced that attitude back to the Puritans.
 

Smoke

Done here.
I know a group of guys who live pretty high on the hog. Lots of expensive travel, expensive dinners, theater, etc. They're not really friends of mine, but I've known them all for a long time. A good friend of mine socializes with them, but remarked to me that he doesn't participate in all their expensive activities.

"I just can't afford to do all the things they do," I said.

"Honey, they can't either," he replied. "Every one of them's in debt up to his eyeballs."

:rolleyes:
 

Father Heathen

Veteran Member
Why do humans have to define friendship or relationships on wealth and status?

Because they're shallow, superficial, materialistic turds? Don't bend over backwards for the sake of gaining their acceptance because people with that sort of mentality aren't worth anyone's time. On the upside it's a good way to filter out those who really do matter and those who don't.
 

Smoke

Done here.
I think Americans are especially apt to let wealth interfere with friendships.

Perhaps that's because ours is a culture in which wealth is mystified -- it not only connotes wealth itself, but it also, in some largely unexamined way, wealth implies success in life, and (beyond success in life) wealth also suggests how deserving and virtuous one is. Therefore, there can be a bit of a stigma in not possessing wealth equal to, or greater than, your friend's wealth.

It's more than the simple fact that your friend is less wealthy than you. It's also the mystical "fact" that your friend, because he or she is less wealthy than you, is less successful than you, and hence, less deserving than you.

Some people have traced that attitude back to the Puritans.
I've heard a friend of mine mocked for not having a car. He hadn't lost his license or anything, but he decided to go back to school and get his degree and he just couldn't afford a car. He lived downtown and walked to school and work. I thought it was perfectly sensible, but these people acted like he was some kind of trash because he didn't have a car. I really don't understand it, but I think there's something fundamentally wrong with people who have values like that.
 

Sunstone

De Diablo Del Fora
Premium Member
I've heard a friend of mine mocked for not having a car. He hadn't lost his license or anything, but he decided to go back to school and get his degree and he just couldn't afford a car. He lived downtown and walked to school and work. I thought it was perfectly sensible, but these people acted like he was some kind of trash because he didn't have a car. I really don't understand it, but I think there's something fundamentally wrong with people who have values like that.

It's hard understanding their point of view except maybe they are clutching at any straw that can make them feel superior even for an instant. Seems kind of sick, though.
 

MissAlice

Well-Known Member
Wow I didn't think this post would get much input. I ask these questions with many people online and in real life and either they go ignored or I get a lecture on how much I could make if I went to a great college (as if I could afford it) and do this or that as a career and then it's "Why don't you marry yourself a rich husband?" :rolleyes:


I get so angry when people assume those who can't afford education or anything for that matter are drunks, bums or something to be looked down upon. It's as if there is if even the smartest people here have this intellect of the superior vs the inferior sublimity. I normally try and not get into debates with such people since you can only walk in one's shoes to really understand what that person is going through.....even then it's different for everyone.

And .lava, I feel the same way except they're mostly stray cats that hang around;). I also feel people aren't worth my time if it's going to involve the stress of financial issues. For fun, I live across a lake and swimming pool. Sometimes I do paper mache dolls, games outside like frisby, basket ball (we have a free court to use), going on nature trail or just hanging out for fun. I just don't understand why exceptions to basket ball my life is considered boring for the other person. I try to find ways to entertain people and it's as if I'm a freak or something. I do consider myself a child at heart, I enjoy simple things like going to the park and get a kick out of watching for deer or any other wild animal.

I don't assume everyone has this attitude but it just seems I get the attitude that there's something wrong with me or I'm not doing enough. I've had to work double shifts and two jobs just to make ends meet and I'm beginning not to care anymore.
 

.lava

Veteran Member
And .lava, I feel the same way except they're mostly stray cats that hang around;). I also feel people aren't worth my time if it's going to involve the stress of financial issues. For fun, I live across a lake and swimming pool. Sometimes I do paper mache dolls, games outside like frisby, basket ball (we have a free court to use), going on nature trail or just hanging out for fun. I just don't understand why exceptions to basket ball my life is considered boring for the other person. I try to find ways to entertain people and it's as if I'm a freak or something. I do consider myself a child at heart, I enjoy simple things like going to the park and get a kick out of watching for deer or any other wild animal.

I don't assume everyone has this attitude but it just seems I get the attitude that there's something wrong with me or I'm not doing enough. I've had to work double shifts and two jobs just to make ends meet and I'm beginning not to care anymore.

we are alike :) but try not to get angry with those people. i pity them mostly. (and sometime angry lol) human is such a interesting creature with lots of surprising things within; opinions, way of expression the same things...etc many things. most of the time people who care for what they could see literally to offer attention miss all that stuff even with people they are friends with. that is a fact and that's their tragedy. unfortunately they earn it. short cut to unhappy life if you ask me. though i understand how it feels like to be lonely in path where you go and reach completeness in solitude. oh i love cats. i always find houses to live that has gardens so i always have friends wait for me outside the window. so easy to make them happy therefor so easy to be happy with them. i like the same kind of people, who's easily be happy. easy to make me happy too, i believe it is easy to make you happy too. that's why i could not consider you poor. you just don't have lots of money. i am broke too but i have everything i need, so still thankful

.
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
Wealth is useful for evaluating people... if one does not want to use actual criteria.

That is probably a good thing in the long run, because it helps in selecting those who have such criteria from those who don't.

Anyway, don't feel bad about having priorities and doing honest work. Having met my share of those who refuse to do so, I can honestly tell you that I can't quite bring myself to feel respect for them.
 

Sunstone

De Diablo Del Fora
Premium Member
A very large chunk of American wealth is used to buy things that are put aside within six months. For instance, someone buys a thousand dollar exercise machine, uses it for three weeks and puts it in their storage room.
 

mho123

Atheist
I don't really consider myself poor but I do live within a tight budget. I only afford what I need and even then I try and keep it at a minimum. I've never been comfortable in telling people how much I make or what I do for a living.

I've had people ask me the magic question "why?" I really don't know how to answer that. What ****** me off though is whenever I try to make friends with anyone they notice what I don't have. Here's a few examples: Cable, air conditioning, mobile phone, pretty clothes, mp3 player, Wii games...and there's more but I'd rather not bother sharing. It's as if aspergers doesn't come close to weird as the way I live my lifestyle.

Whenever anyone asks me to go shopping, go to a casino or hang out in a restaurant I hesitate mainly because I can't afford it. Even when I do hang out with them, there's always this stupid issues about money. "You should get a debit card or you should do this or you should do that. I get so sick of it. Why do humans have to define friendship or relationships on wealth and status?

I just don't get it.... >_<

I am not a poor person , in fact I can say I am financially above average , but I have been poor . Very very poor . So I can understand how difficult it can be .
Unfortunately we are living in a consumption society and money talks . People are getting more and more brainwashed by media / advertisements , we are turning into materialistic monsters .
Real friendship has nothing to do with money .
My advice would be to try to find real friends , who will appreciate you for who you are .
Maybe a lame advice . Why am I writing this quote ?
Cause I see you are under a lot of pressure and asking yourself questions about materialism spiritualism etc .
You are at a religious discussion forum .
Beware : Religious people seek victims like you . When you are at your weakest , desperate for some relief , you are a sitting duck for religious people . They will attack you like hyenas attacking a zebra . They will promise you happiness and heaven and infinit life etc .
You are vulnerable , but sticking your head in the sand and believe in lies will not change anything .
I don't know where you are from .
I am from holland .
If you like send me a message and we can chat ,, maybe it helps .
Good luck and strength .
Take good care
 

blackout

Violet.
People should Put Up, or shut up.

You need to be compatable and balanced
with the people you seek to spend time with.
If they consistantly go places that require money,
then they probably aren't going to be a good fit
for a person without money.
Unless of course, they're willing to bring you along
out of love, and include you completely...
because your company is something they value enough...
to actively and ACTUALLY support.

This of course would be relationship
that trumps economics.

It does happen occasionally.
It has happened for me.
I have (literally) been picked up out of my poverty,
loved and lavished.
(of course 'lavished' is a concept relative to one's poverty)
Sadly though, an occasional weekend of happiness
does not a "complete life" make.
But it can help SO much,
in the making of a complete life.


When people love truly,
they TRULY do give all that they can.
(whatever "form" that may take)
 
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blackout

Violet.
I for one would rather support my friends,
my loved ones...
than a stupid casino.

For me, who I am with, is primary to where I am.

The worst poverty in the world is to go unloved.

This is something I know first hand.
Poverty of things, while often difficult and disapointing,
is nothing at all
compared to the poverty of lack of relationship.
Lack of love, partnership, support, understanding,
communication... affection... kindness...
is the WORST poverty there is.
 
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.lava

Veteran Member
I for one would rather support my friends,
my loved ones...
than a stupid casino.

For me, who I am with, is primary to where I am.

The worst poverty in the world is to go unloved.

This is something I know first hand.
Poverty of things, while often difficult and disapointing,
is nothing at all
compared to the poverty of lack of relationship.
Lack of love, partnership, support, understanding,
communication... affection... kindness...
is the WORST poverty there is.

it would not let me frubal you again. that was beautiful, so beautiful and so true. thank you for taking time and typing it

.
 

Kathryn

It was on fire when I laid down on it.
Hi, Anne - excellent OP. You bring up a lot of good questions and points.

Here's my take on it:

First of all, let me give you my perspective. For many years of my life, I struggled financially. I was a single mom for several years, and a stay at home mom for 10 years (I birthed four children during that time), married to an enlisted soldier for many years before that (he did become an officer 6 years after we were married and that was a huge help financially - till we divorced).

As a single mom, I had to work extremely hard for many, many years in order to provide a very modest lifestyle for my four kids and myself. We had very few luxuries, and did most of our shopping at thrift shops and discount stores. We took no vacations, we didn't have cable for many years, no cell phones, not even a home computer for many years. I drove the same car for 10 years - till it totally died on me with nearly 300,000 miles on it.

Over time, I built a career and eventually moved into what I'd call the "middle class." Then I hit the real estate boom as a realtor and suddenly became pretty well off. About that time, I met my husband. He works in the oil field and has worked harder than just about anyone I know. He's built a good career for himself, but it's taken 30 years of sweat to do so.

I married my husband five years ago. We have both worked since we were young teens, and worked HARD all our lives. My kids are grown and out of the house now.

My husband and I are now financially comfortable. By our local standards, we're affluent (though I wouldn't say we're "wealthy"). We both work full time. However, I work mainly because I'd be bored if I didn't, though of course if I suddenly stopped working we'd have to make some significant adjustments.

I work as a banker at a large local bank. I am not trying to build a career - in fact, I'm underemployed for my skill set, and that's a great feeling! But one curious offshoot of all this is that my co workers are not nearly as affluent as I am. This includes my manager.

This has created an unusual set of circumstances for me. Throughout my working life, I've enjoyed the cameraderie of my coworkers - in fact, many of them have become some of my closest friends over the years. But in the past, they've been at the same economic level as me. Now this is different, and it's created some interesting challenges for me.

I find myself really downplaying my "off work" lifestyle because my co workers think we're rich. They make comments to that effect often. "Oh, you wouldn't understand - you guys are rich." "You probably don't know what I'm talking about - you don't have to worry about money." That sort of thing. Sometimes I pick up on a level of jealousy or dismissal, even though without exception the people I work with are very, very nice folks, and I really like them.

But my husband and I have some interests and hobbies that are financially out of the range of my co workers. I find myself simply not talking about these things with them. But then, what do you do when the topic is, "What did you do this weekend?"

Don't get me wrong - my co workers and I share many common interests and we can talk about those things. But sometimes I admit it - I feel awkward. I've had a couple of women from work over to my house from time to time, but after the last time, I think I'm going to stop doing that. Not because I'm inhospitable, but because I literally watched the gap widen between my co workers and me during their visit. This didn't come from me, it came from THEM. As they toured the house, I heard a lot of comments like, "Wow, must be nice." And "So this is how the rich people live." "Oh my gosh, this bedroom is as big as half my house!" It felt very awkward. I'm used to being "one of the girls."

My point is - no matter what socio economic class is involved, some people insist on drawing lines, making assumptions, judging, etc. I have told these same co workers that when I was their age, I was struggling. I am not sure they believe me. And I'm not sure it matters to them now anyway. They feel the gap and insist on pointing it out. I would NEVER point it out.

By the way, I don't have an mp3 player or a wii! And I have a cheap *** phone too. My computer is 8 years old, and my car is 7 years old. And I still love to shop at resale shops! And I am too cheap to put internet or even texting on my cell phone.

Meanwhile, the asst mgr at our bank has every techie gadget made (including the new Apple thingie and the latest Smart Phone), a truck that's a lot newer than mine, and a much nicer house than I had when I was his age. His buddies may think he's rich. I don't know. Everyone has their own priorities.

That's just my perspective.
 

Magic Man

Reaper of Conversation
I don't really consider myself poor but I do live within a tight budget. I only afford what I need and even then I try and keep it at a minimum. I've never been comfortable in telling people how much I make or what I do for a living.

I've had people ask me the magic question "why?" I really don't know how to answer that. What ****** me off though is whenever I try to make friends with anyone they notice what I don't have. Here's a few examples: Cable, air conditioning, mobile phone, pretty clothes, mp3 player, Wii games...and there's more but I'd rather not bother sharing. It's as if aspergers doesn't come close to weird as the way I live my lifestyle.

Whenever anyone asks me to go shopping, go to a casino or hang out in a restaurant I hesitate mainly because I can't afford it. Even when I do hang out with them, there's always this stupid issues about money. "You should get a debit card or you should do this or you should do that. I get so sick of it. Why do humans have to define friendship or relationships on wealth and status?

I just don't get it.... >_<

I don't know all the specific of your situation, MissAlice, so please don't take this as me trying to tell you what your situation is. I offer another perspective which may or may not be at all true in your case. I don't have a lot of money. My wife and I do OK, and we have a couple luxuries like a big TV and 2 computers, but we're certainly lower middle class. I have a friend who now has 2 kids. Since he and his wife got pregnant the first time, he has cut back on extra things like going to the driving range or playing golf, things we used to do fairly often. From my perspective, it would be nice for him to have the money to do these things because I enjoyed doing them with him before.

Maybe that's the perspective these suggestions come from sometimes.
 

Terrywoodenpic

Oldest Heretic
Peoples pastimes and lifestyles are usually ring fenced by what they can afford.

Over a certain level of wealth, what you chose to do is not limited by cash but be inclination.

At the other end of the scale are the rest of us, if our income fails we are in trouble. the closer to the wind we sail, the more frightened we become about spending what little we have.

I felt like that all my working life I was thought to be "Careful"... now I am retired I am actually quite comfortable. If my pension failed entirely, I could live at the present rate for six or seven years.
However the same money would last my son or daughter less than one year. Wealth is relative to real need.

Truth be told, I spend very little on things I don't need.
I spend on Photography and computers but not much else. I replace household equipment when it fails. and I eat well enough.

Of course I pay my taxes

It would probably be cheaper for me now to take cabs, rather than own a car, as I don't put in the miles to make it economic. but it is nice to go where and when I want in the comfort of my old Camry.

I have never used credit cards or owed money, except for a now paid up mortgage.

I have always had a very quiet lifestyle. The things I enjoy come cheap... classical music, woodwork, the countryside and my cameras, and not much else.

I still have my various spinning wheels but have given away my looms, all things I have designed and built my self, usually as prototypes of ones I built for other people.

Most people would say I lead a dull life.

But there is a lot to be said for it.... and who cares what others think.
 
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