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Alternative medicines

Discussion in 'Health & Healing' started by Vinayaka, Feb 25, 2021.

  1. Vinayaka

    Vinayaka devotee
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    Ayurveda, indigenous herbals, acupuncture, Chinese herbal, naturopathy, pioneer home remedies, ...

    I take exception (some) to the label of alternative. Western medicine, in my view, has an egocentric view of 'we're right' and 'sure go ahead try that quacky stuff at your own risk'. I find it not very open minded at all. My doctor basically ignores me if I suggest I've seen a naturopath.

    The other day I was researching on the benefits of garlic, and discovered a scientific study that showed a decrease in blood pressure between 3 and 10 points on the top number (I forget the name) over 3 months of regular use of a daily supplement. This is comparable to the effect of Atenolol, the most commonly prescribed blood pressure med. (that I'm on). That's just one simpl example of dozens.

    So what's the reason for the big ignore? Is it the lobbying from pharmaceuticals, or some other factors?

    What about you? What alternatives have you uses successfully, and for what purpose?
    Why do you think western medicine is so closed off to alternatives? Especially if they've been proven to work?
    Other thoughts? (Huge topic I know.)
     
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  2. SalixIncendium

    SalixIncendium Advaita Vedantin
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    My experience with this goes back about 13 years, but allopathic medicine was heavily favored by doctors over herbal remedies when my daughter was being treated for cancer.

    Because of the narcotic pain medicine she was taking (Dilaudid aka hospital heroin) she was struggling with regularity. OTC and prescription meds were prescribed, but the doctors couldn't seem to manage the problem. After much argument and several discussions with nurses, doctors, and hospital administrators, I was allowed to introduce psyllium and casgara sagrada, two herbal remedies I've seen work on my mother in the past, to replace the meds that were either leaving her constipated or liquid.

    I administered the amount of these herbal remedies that I thought would be effective, and after adjusting the dosage, I was able to manage her regularity. The nurses and doctors were surprised, and I was permitted to manage her regularity for the duration of her treatment.

    It's certainly an uphill battle getting allopaths to accept herbal remedies, but they can be convinced with the proper arguments through the proper channels.
     
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  3. Quintessence

    Quintessence Tale Weaver
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    I've made a habit of calling "alternative" medicine traditional medicine. Because it is. It's what humanity has used for the vast majority of its history. It's the new stuff that's alternative. :D

    None of that is to say that traditional medicine is necessarily more efficacious that modern medicine. That depends on a lot of things. I grew up in a "home remedies" type of household where good self-care was all a body needs; when it isn't, then think about modern medicine as an alternative.

    It occurs to me as an adult that self-care and home remedies were encouraged by my folks a lot because the health care system in my country is straight up broken. Lots of superfluous visits to the doctor would have gotten costly and had little benefit.
     
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  4. Nakosis

    Nakosis crystal soldier
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    Western medicine generally has more validation along with more adverse side effects. Ayurveda is less risk to make things worse but no guarantee to make things better.

    Other than surgery, vaccines, antibiotics which I feel are pretty reliable.

    Ayurvedic medicine can make you feel better. Maybe sometimes that is enough for things to get better. The body really tries to heal itself. The most we can do is help it along. IMO, one's mental state can have a lot to do with that. If nothing else, Ayurveda can help with that.
     
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  5. Twilight Hue

    Twilight Hue The gentle embrace of twilight has become my guide

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    I had great success with garlic.

    The thing about alternative medicine is while it does have some credibility, should never replace professional medicine.

    The science involved far outweighs any ignorance in deciding medical solutions. At least when it comes down to more serious medical issues.
     
  6. sun rise

    sun rise "This is the Hour of God"
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    Besides 'not invented here', the #1 to me is money. Doctors don't get drug reps visiting them promoting cheap, OTC treatments.

    Acupuncture/herbs for a number of issues including exhaustion.

    Massage and chiropractic for quite a few bodily issues along with taichi and Qigong.

    Neti pot for sinus problems.

    Plant stanols along with a low dose statin for cholesterol. My doctor was surprised how much my cholestrol was reduced with such a low statin dose (!).

    The problem with me claiming success is of course, the placebo effect along with not knowing for sure how much was natural healing that would have happened any way.

    A side comment: what I do can be called 'complementary' or 'integrative' medicine per https://www.nccih.nih.gov/health/complementary-alternative-or-integrative-health-whats-in-a-name
     
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  7. Vinayaka

    Vinayaka devotee
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    There has been very little research done, because of the assumption that it's not as good as allopathy. Could be a false assumption. I just wish more people would be open to more research instead of casting it aside sight unseen, sort of.
     
  8. SalixIncendium

    SalixIncendium Advaita Vedantin
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    But sometimes it is. One thing that occurred to me while during my year and a half in and out of the hospital...most allopathic medicine only masks symptoms. It doesn't cure anything. I've seen alternative treatments do more than only mask symptoms. In some cases, they supplement what the body needs to heal itself.
     
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  9. Vinayaka

    Vinayaka devotee
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    I've used neti pot for a long time. but it was recommended by a friend, a western trained doctor, ENT. He did have his own cheap recipe for salt/baking soda instead of the stuff that comes with the neti pot. The other thing about some herbs or pioneer remedies is cost effectiveness. My kids got lice once, and Mom suggested the old pioneer kerosene treatment at 12 cents a teaspoon, or less, versus the $15 a bottle shampoo that didn't work.
     
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  10. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    I have never used Ayurveda, indigenous herbals, acupuncture, Chinese herbal, naturopathy, or pioneer home remedies, but for about 15 years back in the late 1980s and 1990s I went for constitutional homeopathic treatment under three different medical doctors who had formerly practiced conventional medicine. I was being treated for depression and anxiety both of which were completely cured by homeopathic remedies. I was immediately free of the depression that I had all my adult life but a complete cure took many years because I had many layers of disease.

    Towards the end of my homeopathic treatment I attended the School of Homeopathy in Devon, England which was done my mail correspondence back in those years. After 3.5 years I obtained a degree in homeopathy which I had planned to use in conjunction with my counseling psychology degree in a private practice but that never worked out for personal and family reasons.

    Before I was treated with homeopathy I was on various antidepressants and anti-anxiety drugs for five years but I was only barely able to stay afloat in order to continue working. I was still depressed and anxious even with all those medications. I also became addicted to the antidepressants and the anti-anxiety drugs and I was unable to get off them until I started homeopathic treatment. Within a month I was off all those drugs and never had to take them again. I infrequently take a very low dose of alprazolam now mostly for sleep but that is the only drug I ever take. I believe that homeopathy literally saved my life because before that I was in a hopeless condition.
     
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  11. aketo

    aketo Active Member

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    As far as I know there haven't been enough studies conducted into these forms of medication. Maybe because of pharmaceuticals too, but primarily because of the doctors themselves.

    I've used ayurveda extensively as my family has traditional cures for minor sicknesses. It didn't seem to work for me most of the time. But there is a great deal of science behind it and it works for most of the people I know.

    Seems to me to be something like this: alternate medicine may be effective but it's not known to be as efficient as the western medicine. It's effects can't always be predicted as well as for WM. Also, it covers a smaller range of illness. Even if doctors wouldn't consciously deny the effects, it would be much safer just using medicine that's been well researched and known to work. Taking even slight risks can put their jobs on the line.

    Note: these are just probable factors I've thought of myself, after some basic research. It's not exactly facts because I haven't found any official study on this.
    That's the main issue: not many official studies on alternatives. People either don't have the time or funding for this research because the known drugs are effective and go through enough trials and tests to prove it.
     
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  12. Aupmanyav

    Aupmanyav Be your own guru

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    Herbal or Ayurvedic (Unani, Siddha, Homeopathic) medicines have no standardization, no quality checks, no research on effects or after-effects. One takes the medicine on faith. I go only by evidence and not on faith. Sure, components from herbs, natural venoms, etc. are used in Allopathic medicine, but a lot of work goes in it.

    We have this yoga guru Baba Ramdev in India. He is a favorite of the ruling party. The drugs prepared by his company will be purchased in states ruled by the Central government party. In turn, Ramdev will finance election of ruling party candidates. So that is how it goes. Ramdev has repeatedly come up with Corona-cures, I do not know how much the government has bought from him. It is said that he grinds roots, trunk, branches, leaves and flowers of whichever vegetation he comes across and sells it as Ayurvedic medicines. Naturally, he is a billionnaire.

    Baba Ramdev and the Indian Health Minister, Harsh Vardhan endorsing "Coronil".
    [​IMG]

    During these days of Corona virus, every one has tagged along the 'immunity' band-wagon. Have a look, you will find it interesting:
    immunity advertisements India - Google Search

    [​IMG]
    Immunity.png
     
    #12 Aupmanyav, Feb 25, 2021
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2021
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  13. Heyo

    Heyo Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]

    I'm quite sceptical with all those "alternative" medicine that's out there. And I have to frequently research some of those because my father is on two or three traditional medicines and a dozen of supplements and he is constantly trying some more.
    I can talk him out of the dangerous ones and those which are too expensive for no known effect. He is probably the healthiest 87 year old I know.

    There are "alternative" medicines, supplements and OTC medicine that have a general positive impact but don't qualify for becoming prescription drugs. Some have already been named, garlic, tai chi, neti. I could name a few more, omega 3 fish oil for example but there are many for which some studies exist that confirm that they are at least harmless at best effective but with too few data to recommend them. That's when you have to know that you become your own guinea pig. Try it, it may work.
     
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  14. JustGeorge

    JustGeorge Well-Known Member
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    I think its too easy sometimes to label one branch of medicine or the other as correct, but I think a lot of responsibility lies on the practitioner. I suspect all different medicinal traditions have something to offer, when practiced correctly and free of ulterior motives.

    Whether you're seeing a 'standard' practitioner, or a practitioner of one of the various fields of alternative medicine, you risk seeing someone who is incompetent in their field. I don't believe any one system is infallible, and a lot of the success or the failure a person has is based on the skill of the care provider(regardless of the type of medicine they practice), and a bit of luck.

    I think with medicine, less is more, and I'm skeptical of those who try to give me something to take without(or in lieu of)advising me on my lifestyle. Oftentimes, a medical condition is brought on by something we're doing/not doing, and if you don't remove the root, all the medicine is going to do is improve the symptoms. Sometimes a condition really does come out of nowhere, but there are often simple steps we can take to help us get relief(with or without the usage of other prescriptions).
     
  15. Deeje

    Deeje Avid Bible Student
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    I agree...its not "alternative" but in many cases "complimentary"....sometimes so successful that drug therapy is no longer necessary. I guess that is why the doctors and drug companies want them ridiculed. No money in curing people...is there?

    My GP almost has a stroke if I tell him that I have had more success with naturopathy and homeopathy than with "orthodox" medicine....and with no side effects. I visit the chiropractor regularly too.....he has the opinion that it is all quackery. That has never been my experience. Consequently I don't go to the doctor very often....I don't need to.

    True story....I was getting very severe reflux at night and the doc gave me Nexium, but the side effects were awful. Then I happened upon an article in a health magazine that linked reflux with coffee in the morning on an empty stomach. I would never have linked the two if I had not read that article. So I decided to forgo my morning coffee and drank tea instead....no more reflux! And it was that simple. Not everything is solved with a pill.

    I have been taking garlic oil capsules for decades and avoiding a lot of the cold's and flus that others around me were getting routinely every year. Coupled with large doses of Vitamin C and echinacea, zinc and other immune system boosters, I was distressed to learn a few months ago that garlic oil is now almost unprocurable. Apparently people got the message about how it boosts immunity and bought up all the supplies. I wouldn't be at all surprised if they were told to stop manufacturing it. It could well help with preventing Covid....but they have vaccinations to give everyone.....costing billions of dollars that all goes to the massively wealthy drug companies.
    I am not against all vaccinations, but not trusting of one that has been rushed and poorly tested, long term.

    Follow the money trail.....big pharma has no interest in preventing illness....just treating it with artificial drugs that your body will likely reject. That is what "side effects" are. IMO the Hippocratic oath is broken the minute they do harm to a patient. Synthetic drugs can cause way more harm than they fix. And I have first hand experience with that. They are not designed to kill you outright, but to mask symptoms so that people think that they are getting better. But "better" never comes....it turns into a lifetime dependence on those drugs and a succession of regular customers for the drug companies and the doctors who are encouraged to prescribe them.

    And a topic that needs discussion because the myths created by orthodox practitioners was created by the drug company funded medical schools that train them. Anything that didn't involve their drugs was quackery. I know which is quackery, but people put such great store in the drugs on offer that they will take themselves to the brink of death before they twig to the fact that their drugs are often making them sicker than the illness that they are supposed to be treating.

    What are we hearing about cannabis now? A drug with so many properties for healing and treating a wide variety of ailments, but demonized for decades because it would interfere with the sale of synthetic drugs that the human body was never meant to ingest. Natural is best and properly prescribed, causes no harm.

    We need to register the practitioners so that the charlatans can be identified and the herbal medicines can be regulated for efficacy and purity. We need to see the cannabis pharmacies in all places, just like they have in California....but will we ever see them? Probably not. :( Its a powerful lobby.
     
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  16. paarsurrey

    paarsurrey Veteran Member

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    I use prayer and also Western Medicine, home remedies and Homeopathic. The cure comes from G-d, I understand. Right?

    Regards
     
  17. paarsurrey

    paarsurrey Veteran Member

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    Almost all people in the developed countries these days die in the hospitals. Doesn't it prove, as I understand, that the modern medical science can't save humans from death, please? Right?

    Regards
     
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  18. Aupmanyav

    Aupmanyav Be your own guru

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    Are you ever wrong, Paarsurrey?
    In that case you could do even without Western medicine, home remedies and homeopathy. Allah is bountiful and merciful.
     
  19. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    I believe that we have to use conventional medicines for some diseases such as insulin and antibiotics and heart medicines, and certain medicines for kidney and lung disease, even medicines for cancer, in order to keep people alive, but I believe that medicines that are used for mental-emotional problems are completely unnecessary, dangerous and damaging, because all they do is mask symptoms and drive the disease deeper. They do not cure anything at all. That is why when people go off an antidepressants or anti-anxiety medications they become depressed so they have to go back on these medications or try new medications and stay on them often for their entire lives. By contrast, when a person is cured by homeopathy they do not have to take homeopathic medicines forever because the remedies cure the underlying disease.

    Conventional medicines used for physical diseases do not cure anything either, they only manage the disease and allow people to stay alive, at the price of all the side effects and money they cost. They also keep the drug industry going and making billions of dollars.
     
  20. paarsurrey

    paarsurrey Veteran Member

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    We Ahmadiyya peaceful Muslims do both the things, we pray to God to provide us the best medical treatment for cure of a disease and it is most successful, please. Right?
    One may like to read a very small book title "Barakat-ud-Dua" or "Blessing of Prayer" by Mirza Ghulam Ahmad 1835-1908- The Promised Messiah, Imam Mahdi, and Krishna of this age:
    https://www.alislam.org/library/books/Blessings-of-Prayer.pdf
    Right?

    Regards
     
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