All roads lead to the same God ?

[Jona Israel]

Check out the similarities between NT and Jewish interpretations here:
Unconditional love discussed in Israel
Might interest you..

 

[KerimF]

I am afraid, living the Unconditional Love/Care towards all others, as revealed by Jesus, cannot be a subject for a public (open) discussion. It is strictly a personal choice (a hard one) anywhere on earth. And all formal religious systems (including the formal Christianity) and all political ruling ones around the world 'cannot' approve it or even recommend it in any way because, clearly, it is against (opposes) the human's instincts. In other words, it is not easy at all for a human being to follow the same way that his Creative Will/Energy does in life; It makes the sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust (this could be applied on the natural catastrophes as well).

But nothing prevents the discussing, you pointed out, to be very interesting to many people.

 

[blü 2]

Yet here we are 2000 years later still referring to Jesus . Someones wrong here . All the early church were Jews.

Christianity, the evidence uniformly suggests, arose as a sect within Judaism and the original members of that sect appear to have been Jews ─ but equally they appear to have been only a small and local fraction of the Jewish population. Christianity's success (thanks, it appears, to Paul's example) was among the pagans. The very great majority of Jews meanwhile went on being Jews.

Note too that the NT is written in Greek. (I've never seen any satisfactory evidence to back the claim that Matthew is a translation into Greek from an Aramaic original.) Greek was indeed the lingua franca of that part of the Roman Empire, used in inter-regional commerce and taught to the educated of Judea. Given an historical Jesus, he may have had Aramaic as his first language, but Christianity is essentially Greek at its roots.

Jews receiving Jesus as their messiah.

No, only a tiny fraction did.

Then the world is turned upside down with the biggest impact on the world.

This was largely due to Constantine in the early 4th century CE, ie, close to three hundred years down the track.

 

[John1.12]

Christianity, the evidence uniformly suggests, arose as a sect within Judaism and the original members of that sect appear to have been Jews ─ but equally they appear to have been only a small and local fraction of the Jewish population. Christianity's success (thanks, it appears, to Paul's example) was among the pagans. The very great majority of Jews meanwhile went on being Jews.

Note too that the NT is written in Greek. (I've never seen any satisfactory evidence to back the claim that Matthew is a translation into Greek from an Aramaic original.) Greek was indeed the lingua franca of that part of the Roman Empire, used in inter-regional commerce and taught to the educated of Judea. Given an historical Jesus, he may have had Aramaic as his first language, but Christianity is essentially Greek at its roots.
No, only a tiny fraction did.
This was largely due to Constantine in the early 4th century CE, ie, close to three hundred years down the track.

Acts 17:6

“And when they found them not, they drew Jason and certain brethren unto the rulers of the city, crying, These that have turned the world upside down are come hither also;”

 

[John1.12]

Christianity, the evidence uniformly suggests, arose as a sect within Judaism and the original members of that sect appear to have been Jews ─ but equally they appear to have been only a small and local fraction of the Jewish population. Christianity's success (thanks, it appears, to Paul's example) was among the pagans. The very great majority of Jews meanwhile went on being Jews.

Note too that the NT is written in Greek. (I've never seen any satisfactory evidence to back the claim that Matthew is a translation into Greek from an Aramaic original.) Greek was indeed the lingua franca of that part of the Roman Empire, used in inter-regional commerce and taught to the educated of Judea. Given an historical Jesus, he may have had Aramaic as his first language, but Christianity is essentially Greek at its roots.
No, only a tiny fraction did.
This was largely due to Constantine in the early 4th century CE, ie, close to three hundred years down the track.

The actual narrative explains the transition from Jew to Gentile . Prior to Acts 7 the programme was to reach Israel .

 

[blü 2]

The actual narrative explains the transition from Jew to Gentile . Prior to Acts 7 the programme was to reach Israel .

And as I said, the Christian program substantially failed in Judea. It owes its success to its popularity among the pagans.

One thing Christianity proved very successful at was antisemitism, coming up to two millennia of it.

 

[KerimF]

If real Jews/Israelis are supposed to also love their enemies, Jesus could be one of them.

 

[Windwalker]

The verse doesn't say anything about Joining a religion . This is what sets christianity apart ( not Catholicism, Jehovah witnesses, Mormons , ect) from all religions . Jesus says HE is the WAY THE TRUTH and THE life , no one comes to the father but through him.

Sure, but what does that mean to you? Can someone who has never heard of Jesus or Christianity, still come to the Father through Christ? If yes, then it has nothing to do with the Christian religion. If no, then you are saying they must convert to the religion. Which is it? Which do you believe?

 

[SeekingAllTruth]

Sorry, you forgot to mention the Gods of all other well-known religions in the world on whom your statement also apply


So I am just curious to know if it happened that some Jesus teachings were the cause of anything bad that happened to you, your family or friends.

You give me the impression, so I hope I am wrong, that you don’t like Jesus at all for a certain unknown reason (unknown to me in the least).

But perhaps you mean by Jesus some Christians who couldn’t behave as real disciple of Jesus sometimes; but, as you know, this could happen in best families anytime.

I believe the Jesus of the gospels wasn't a real person. I believe it's conceivable that a person upon whom the stories were based could have lived and was crucified for sedition against Rome. But the son of God stuff dying for our sins is all early church accretion that grew over the first 150 years or so. The new religion needed an avatar/mascot/figurehead for their religion and so they slowly invented the stories which got incorporated into the gospels 50-100 years later.

I have never benefited from being a Christian. in 60 years God has never communicated with me. To the contrary my life improved 1000% once I gave up all the religious baggage. I came to see God doesn't interfere in humans' lives. I believe he's a deist God based on what I observe God NOT doing in the world.

 

[Windwalker]

Opinions abound . Yes there are some ' Christians ' who don't believe the bible ,

Why do you put Christian in quotes? First, what does it mean to "believe the bible"? You mean, have faith in it like faith in God? You mean, read the words, have an interpretation, and consider that God's words and not your interpretation, and that you should "believe in" what your interpretation is?

None of that makes any sense to me. Christians should not "believe in the bible". They should use scripture, look at it, read it, interpret it, consider it, ponder it, and so forth. But "believe in it"? What on earth does that really mean? Explain?

they don't actually believe that Jesus was anything more than a wise teacher , coming to bring a message of love, peace , and unity to fellow man .

There is no "they" here. Christian beliefs are a wide spectrum of views. Some may view Jesus as just that, others may view him in other ways. Are you saying Christians should all think of Jesus only one way, and that being the way you currently are in your life? Please explain.

Everything is alegorised to death, Everything is a cryptic, spiritual message, poetry a fable that tells some truths but never really happened. Yes I've come across a few special cases like this .

Everything, always, all of them, etc. Why such absolutes, and no nuances? Why no spectrum of views represented. You seem quite dismissive of views that are different than your own. Why is that?

 

[KerimF]

I believe the Jesus of the gospels wasn't a real person. I believe it's conceivable that a person upon whom the stories were based could have lived and was crucified for sedition against Rome.

On my side, when I need analyzing a new idea, my analysis doesn't base on its origin in any way. For example, when I accepted Pythagoras theorem of the right triangle I didn't search about Pythagoras (if he existed or not).

But the son of God stuff dying for our sins is all early church accretion that grew over the first 150 years or so. The new religion needed an avatar/mascot/figurehead for their religion and so they slowly invented the stories which got incorporated into the gospels 50-100 years later.

Being an engineer also in data communications, I don't assume that everything I receive (read) has to be real. As in data receiver, I also apply various filtering processes (based on my logic) on the received information (received from the Gospel for example) to construct a coherent meaningful image from it. In other words, I focus on ideas only (scientific or religious) not on words of any language.

I have never benefited from being a Christian. in 60 years God has never communicated with me. To the contrary my life improved 1000% once I gave up all the religious baggage. I came to see God doesn't interfere in humans' lives. I believe he's a deist God based on what I observe God NOT doing in the world.

Although Jesus helped me discover all crucial natural truths I was looking for about my existence and the real world, I can't see myself Christian. It is out of question for me to believe in magic; including the magical salvation that all formal Christian Churches around the world insist on.

 

[Rival]

If real Jews/Israelis are supposed to also love their enemies, Jesus could be one of them.

They're not. This is a Christian doctrine.

 

[KerimF]

They're not. This is a Christian doctrine.

Of course they are not
Also most Christians in the world cannot love their enemies; starting from the faithful soldiers and politicians who say they are Christian.
This is why Jesus wasn't exaggerating when he said:
"Strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leads unto life, and few there be that find it."

I mean Jesus was certainly not a Jew though he was born among them.
And He wasn't a founder of any earthly system.
His true Church is spiritual and for independent individuals only, not for groups of people of any sort. After all, only an independent person can love his enemies; otherwise he would be a traitor betraying his group.

 

[Rival]

I mean Jesus was certainly not a Jew though he was born among them.

 

[KerimF]

View attachment 50242​

The Honorable Jewish Elders asked Romans for his death because they couldn't see in Jesus a faithful good Jew as they were.

 

[Rival]

The Honorable Jewish Elders asked Romans for his death because they couldn't see in Jesus a faithful good Jew as they were.

 

[Trailblazer]

View attachment 50242​

Oy Vey.... I have not heard that expression since high school...
My two best friends in high school were Jewish.

 

[paarsurrey]

So, in your world, the 'entire' story of Jesus life is simply this statement and nothing else! Right?
Regards

Please do tell us, if it is reasonable. Right?
I have sympathy with the Christian friends. They take their religion simply on blind-faith . They are dedicated people to their religion alright.
All denominations of Christians (32000+ of them) claim

1. that they are supported by the Holy Spirit and
2. narrate their personal experiences and testimonies to that effect,
3. yet these denominations differ in their teachings and deeds with one another radically and
4. consider other denomination as heretics.
5. This has damaged Christianity considerably
6. people silently cease attending Churches and
7. become Atheists.

This needs to reflect on the situation by every Christian. Right?
There is something drastically wrong with their religion, they themselves have have to find out, please. Right?

Regards

 

[John1.12]

Sure, but what does that mean to you? Can someone who has never heard of Jesus or Christianity, still come to the Father through Christ? If yes, then it has nothing to do with the Christian religion. If no, then you are saying they must convert to the religion. Which is it? Which do you believe?

I'm saying this . Anyone can Come to Jesus for salvation . For those that have never heard of Jesus. The ones who seek God , responding to the light thats given, God will make a way to bring the message of Jesus to him . Just like Cornelius in Acts 10 and 11 .But if the message is brought, through another person ,a dream ,a vision even ,and they reject and do not believe then they will remain lost.

 

[John1.12]

I believe the Jesus of the gospels wasn't a real person. I believe it's conceivable that a person upon whom the stories were based could have lived and was crucified for sedition against Rome. But the son of God stuff dying for our sins is all early church accretion that grew over the first 150 years or so. The new religion needed an avatar/mascot/figurehead for their religion and so they slowly invented the stories which got incorporated into the gospels 50-100 years later.

I have never benefited from being a Christian. in 60 years God has never communicated with me. To the contrary my life improved 1000% once I gave up all the religious baggage. I came to see God doesn't interfere in humans' lives. I believe he's a deist God based on what I observe God NOT doing in the world.

//I believe the Jesus of the gospels wasn't a real person.//
This puts you at odds with every reliable scholar , historian, secular or otherwise. This is not a serious consideration in any recognised academic field on the matter of history and the bible. Of course your entitled to your opinion .