Activist atheism

[tayla]

Dogmatic adherence to belief can hold back progress, but it does not have to be dogmatic belief in a religion. Politics, economics, criminal justice, superstition, and a host of other ideologies can hold back progress or be used to create havoc. Taking things to the extreme often has a negative impact. Extremism does not have an exclusive source with a single view, but given the disparity in numbers of atheists compared to the religious, it should be no surprise that extremism is numerically superior in groups with a religious basis.

I actually would prefer being ruled by atheists. As long as they didn't burn me at the stake for rejecting materialism/physicalism. Weird that atheists think I'm opposed to them.

 

[ChristineM]

I believe this definition of atheist assumes they are materialists/physicalists; that they reject any notion of souls or spirits, etc.

And, their belief in no gods energizes their attitudes about society and changes they would prefer. In other words, they express their belief in the public forum and actively wish to convert others.

What you believe is irrelevant, the definition is specific, anything else is personal misrepresentation.

And the religious dont?

Lets rewrite your paragraph with one word deleted

And, their belief in gods energizes their attitudes about society and changes they would prefer. In other words, they express their belief in the public forum and actively wish to convert others​

Do you not think is rather hypocritical to make such an accusation when religion is by far the biggest abuser of their belief

 

[mikkel_the_dane]

A lot of Dawkins stuff there. Perhaps if you had really studied you would know that Dawkins is not,a by his own admittance, not atheist.
...

They clearly can't be irrevocably linked because a very large number of theologians believe in evolution. In fact, any respectable theologian of the Catholic or Anglican or any other sensible church believes in evolution. Similarly, a very large number of evolutionary scientists are also religious. My personal feeling is that understanding evolution led me to atheism.
Read more at The Problem with God: Interview with Richard Dawkins

 

[tayla]

Also, how many of you atheists ASSUMED that because the OP did not specifically say ALL, MANY, SOME, or A FEW ATHEISTS that he meant each and every atheist, and therefor that "dmap" meant YOU, SPECIFICALLY? And so you responded as if you, personally, had been accused?

And WHY? Why did you make this assumption?

Thank you for noticing the limits of language and how hard it is to express any and every idea without someone jumping to conclusions.

I personally don't think it's necessary to limit sentences by adding the words "some", "a few", "many, but not everyone", and etc. Because -- of course there are exceptions to every viewpoint; we don't need to remind ourselves with every sentence.

For example, if I claim: "Atheists don't believe in God", some (many?) will probably object that they do believe in God, and how dare I say they don't. (OK, that's a silly example, I admit.)

 

[tayla]

My experience what really they truly hate is the allowed moron factor in the church.

Yes, I think that's correct. Thanks for stating it so clearly.

But assuming materialism/physicalism are true without allowing for philosophical discussion of whether the subjective experience of consciousness (for example) violates it; this kind of assumption seems misguided. Considering such questions equally as moronic as those believing in miracles shows a lack of subtlety of thinking.

 

[tayla]

Now we do have the total freedom to be a moron and as such the moron factor holds it true as a constitutional right to be a moron. Atheists do allow being a moron constitutional rightn is true, but they balk at the idea that moron is natural or has anything much to or say at all about nature.

Atheists also rightly balk that stupid untrue ideas should be allowed to dominate our society. And, amen to this.

 

[tayla]

I have seen a lot of atheists respond to the spiritual observations and concepts of others with contempt. They assume these are the make-believe nonsense of weak-minded 'suckers', and they treat anyone who proffers them, accordingly. And if you have not seen this, too, I think you are letting some kind of bias blind you to it. I fear for these young, ignorant, "neo-atheists" who have fallen under the ego-titillating spell of 'scientism' and so now imagine that they know with absolute surety what is "real" and what isn't. It closes the mind and heart, unnecessarily, and that is not a good thing for anyone.

Yes, thank you. You have expressed my concerns very eloquently.

Technically I should ask, "who are these a-lot-of-atheists" and "please provide names and quotations". But I know what you mean without this so don't bother.

 

[tayla]

One further thought I have on atheists I have met on here. I appreciate very much that none of them have professed to be holding out hope for a great cleansing when they will swoop down from the hills in the dead of night and put an end to those that disagree with them or do not embrace some utopian ideological view. I have seen religious people make claims that amount to just that.

Yikes, scary that some (many) throughout history have had to endure this kind of fear. I wish that in the future people won't have to fear this kind of thing from zealot atheists.

 

[tayla]

What has all this to do with Welsh carrots?

Ha ha

 

[David T]

Yes, I think that's correct. Thanks for stating it so clearly.

But assuming materialism/physicalism are true without allowing for philosophical discussion of whether the subjective experience of consciousness (for example) violates it; this kind of assumption seems misguided. Considering such questions equally as moronic as those believing in miracles shows a lack of subtlety of thinking.

We are staring at a shared crazy not a separate crazy!!!! But some are slowly realizing it and that is lime the extremes are pulling apart further and further to aloe the middle to be where we end up growing and the nonsense today drops like leaves. So with nonsense revealing itself as not breathing i say breathe because they dont. Simple!

 

[tayla]

Considering that they rely on conclusions based on evidence, how do you find it surprising that they would be skeptical of claims made without evidence?

Yes, this is my objection. I agree that things provably true should be believed as true.

But I question whether the subjective experience of consciousness (for example) is explainable by materialism/physicalism.

 

[David T]

Atheists also rightly balk that stupid untrue ideas should be allowed to dominate our society. And, amen to this.

Of course. The church need atheists hell its crazy enough with em. I cant imagine if atheists disappeared what would happen. Disaster.

 

[tayla]

Being responded to with contempt is far more desirable than being put on somebodies hit list.

I fear for anyone that gets in your way when that emotional reactor has reached critical mass.

Yikes! Should I be afraid?

 

[ecco]

Thanks for your honesty.

Often my interactions with atheists has been limited to them saying, "prove it"

You talk about honesty and then you make a comment like your second sentence. Wow!

If you want to be really honest, show us an encounter with an atheist where he/she said: "prove it".

It should be easy since it happens to you often.

 

[tayla]

And i'm pretty sure he's on this very thread for a purpose not so noble. I.E trying to badmouth atheists.

I hope no one thinks I'm badmouthing atheists. I'm considering converting, but have some serious questions which atheists so far refuse to consider. They prefer instead to say: "prove it", "give me names", and etc. and even including mocking and belittling.

 

[ecco]

I think atheists in general care very much that religious people believe false ideas.

Atheists don't care that you believe false ideas.

Atheists care very much when religious people try to push their false ideas onto the general public like advocating the teaching of Creationism in public schools or schools which have taxpayer support.

Atheists care very much when religious people try to push their false ideas into Courtrooms with signs proclaiming "In God We Trust" behind the judge.

Get it?

 

[Audie]

These quotes express hatred of certain beliefs:

--------------------------------------------------------------------

I think I would abolish schools which systematically inculcate sectarian beliefs.
--Richard Dawkins

How dare you force your dopey unsubstantiated superstitions on innocent children too young to resist? How DARE you?
--Richard Dawkins

Pat Robertson would be harmless comedy, were he less typical of those who today hold power and influence in the United States.
--Richard Dawkins, The God Delusion

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.
--Richard Dawkins, The God Delusion

Hate? Nah. By this, any disagreement or accurate
evaluation is "hate".

 

[Audie]

I hope no one thinks I'm badmouthing atheists. I'm considering converting, but have some serious questions which atheists so far refuse to consider. They prefer instead to say: "prove it", "give me names", and etc. and even including mocking and belittling.

I cannot hope you are not doing what you are doing

 

[tayla]

Which i guess was written to deliberately provoke.

These are honest questions, not meant to provoke. The question of what viewpoints should be allowed to be expressed in society and in our public institutions is an important one. And in listening to many atheistic conferences and seminars, I think it's fair to say that their mocking of religious people is an expression of hatred (or at least of disdain and ill-will, which are subsets of hatred).

 

[Audie]

My sentence was:

Ignoring atrocities by both atheists and religious, I don't see evidence that improvements to our world are all the result of atheism, and that religion holds us back.​

I assume you don't believe that all improvements to the world are the result of atheism; neither do I.

I occasionally hear someone supporting the view that only atheists can improve human knowledge; this, because the religious are not truly scientific and will, therefore, inject their supernatural and unscientific views. I'm surprised you haven't heard of views such as this, but I don't wish to try to find examples; perhaps I'll start collecting them when I come across them in the future.

I wont expect to ever see an actual example