72 Raisins, not 72 Virgins

[Estro Felino]

https://globalnation.inquirer.net/163694/raisins-not-virgins-quran-scholars-say

From the article
It has been said that Muslim martyrs will be rewarded with 72 virgins in heaven, or paradise. But a growing number of Quran scholars and Islamic theologians have contested its interpretation.

In the CNN special show “Why They Hate Us” in 2016, Canadian author and Quran scholar Irshad Manji said the word “virgin” in the Quran meant “raisin.”“Nowhere in the Quran does it promise 72 virgins, 70 virgins, 48 virgins. … The Arabic word for ‘virgin’ has been mistranslated. The original [word] that was used in the Quran was the word for raisin, not virgin

 

[BSM1]

Raisins? Raisins? In what alternate reality does that even make sense? Now dates I could understand.

 

[Altfish]

I think it was Billy Connelly who said, (and I paraphrase) "Why do you want virgins? I want experienced women, sluts, harlots. The sex will be much better"

 

[Revoltingest]

Raisins? Raisins? In what alternate reality does that even make sense? Now dates I could understand.

The alternative translation of "raisins" has been kicking around for decades.
I've long found the idea amusing.....some thug martyrs himself in a horribly
painful death, taking many innocents with him...then he's rewarded with....

How do you divide up your 72 raisins to be satisfying for an eternity?

 

[Augustus]

https://globalnation.inquirer.net/163694/raisins-not-virgins-quran-scholars-say

From the article
It has been said that Muslim martyrs will be rewarded with 72 virgins in heaven, or paradise. But a growing number of Quran scholars and Islamic theologians have contested its interpretation.

In the CNN special show “Why They Hate Us” in 2016, Canadian author and Quran scholar Irshad Manji said the word “virgin” in the Quran meant “raisin.”“Nowhere in the Quran does it promise 72 virgins, 70 virgins, 48 virgins. … The Arabic word for ‘virgin’ has been mistranslated. The original [word] that was used in the Quran was the word for raisin, not virgin

Makes for good headlines, unfortunately it isn't really true. For a start, it doesn't quite match the rest of the context...

"Surely for the godfearing awaits a place of security,(31) gardens and vineyards (32) and maidens with swelling breasts, like of age"

"They will be reclining on arrayed couches, and We will wed them to big-eyed houris."

So unless we are to believe that folk in heaven get married off to grapes with big tits, probably best stick with the traditional interpretation

 

[BSM1]

The alternative translation of "raisins" has been kicking around for decades.
I've long found the idea amusing.....some thug martyrs himself in a horribly
painful death, taking many innocents with him...then he's rewarded with....

How do you divide up your 72 raisins to be satisfying for an eternity?

Well, personally,it takes me forever to chew a handful.

 

[BSM1]

I think it was Billy Connelly who said, (and I paraphrase) "Why do you want virgins? I want experienced women, sluts, harlots. The sex will be much better"

Muhammed Ali said that what would a man do with 72 virgins? One would kill you.

 

[Stevicus]

https://globalnation.inquirer.net/163694/raisins-not-virgins-quran-scholars-say

From the article
It has been said that Muslim martyrs will be rewarded with 72 virgins in heaven, or paradise. But a growing number of Quran scholars and Islamic theologians have contested its interpretation.

In the CNN special show “Why They Hate Us” in 2016, Canadian author and Quran scholar Irshad Manji said the word “virgin” in the Quran meant “raisin.”“Nowhere in the Quran does it promise 72 virgins, 70 virgins, 48 virgins. … The Arabic word for ‘virgin’ has been mistranslated. The original [word] that was used in the Quran was the word for raisin, not virgin

Well, you get two scoops of raisins from Raisin Bran. I don't know if that comes to 72.

Then there was this part of the article which was interesting:

Likewise, New York Times columnist Nicholas Kristof said “the Arabic language was born as a written language with the Koran, and there’s growing evidence that many of the words were Syriac or Aramaic.”

“The Koran says martyrs going to heaven will get ‘hur,’ and the word was taken by early commentators to mean ‘virgins,’ hence those 72 consorts. But in Aramaic, hur meant ‘white’ and was commonly used to mean ‘white grapes’,” Kristof said.

Of course, the word "hur" makes me think of Ben Hur (Ben Raisins?), played by Charlton Heston.

 

[Revoltingest]

Well, personally,it takes me forever to chew a handful.

There's a thought....the raisins last forever.
After chewing & swallowing, they reappear in the box.
(We'll avoid discussing their magical journey in between.)

 

[Revoltingest]

Well, you get two scoops of raisins from Raisin Bran. I don't know if that comes to 72.

Then there was this part of the article which was interesting:



Of course, the word "hur" makes me think of Ben Hur (Ben Raisins?), played by Charlton Heston.

Or "Ben The Virgin".

 

[Stevicus]

Or "Ben The Virgin".

Two scoops are on their way!

 

[Debater Slayer]

https://globalnation.inquirer.net/163694/raisins-not-virgins-quran-scholars-say

From the article
It has been said that Muslim martyrs will be rewarded with 72 virgins in heaven, or paradise. But a growing number of Quran scholars and Islamic theologians have contested its interpretation.

In the CNN special show “Why They Hate Us” in 2016, Canadian author and Quran scholar Irshad Manji said the word “virgin” in the Quran meant “raisin.”“Nowhere in the Quran does it promise 72 virgins, 70 virgins, 48 virgins. … The Arabic word for ‘virgin’ has been mistranslated. The original [word] that was used in the Quran was the word for raisin, not virgin

That's enough mental gymnastics to win the Olympics right there.

Aside from the fact that Irshad Manji is far from an authoritative Islamic scholar, I think it is much more productive to understand the Qur'an in its historical and cultural context instead of trying to make the word "hur" into something it isn't. Looking at seventh-century Arab culture should make it easier to see why "hur" indeed refers to women and why that is used in the Qur'an to encourage certain actions, especially given how patriarchal ancient Arabia was.

 

[Tumah]

I don't know how it works in context, but maybe the possibility isn't so far-fetched. If you consider - as I do - that early Islam plagiarized a number of elements from Judaism, then the concept becomes another somewhat altered Jewish idea:

What is "[the] eye has not seen (Isa. 64:3)"* [referring to]? Rabbi Yehoshuah ben Levi said, 'This is the wine preserved in it's grapes from the six days of Creation'.
*( This verse is understand to relate to the reward of the World to Come.)
-Talmud​

 

[Thief]

I mean no disrespect to Islam....
I'm sure heaven has some representatives there.....somewhere....

but this thing about reward in heaven.....dealt in terms of flesh.....
is a bit naive

not that I have ruled out good times .....OH NO!

but to entice servitude in this life by some reward in the next.....
no

and it does seem odd......
blow myself (and the jewels ) all the way to kingdom come
and still be able to receive the so called reward

how is that suppose to work?

 

[Audie]

Muhammed Ali said that what would a man do with 72 virgins? One would kill you.

If someone tried to use me that way, one of us would die.

It is just such a disgustingly sexist idea, so degrading to
women. Being awarded as prizes, to be used for recreation.

 

[Nakosis]

Raisins? Raisins? In what alternate reality does that even make sense? Now dates I could understand.

72 dates with 72 virgins? Or maybe 72 dates with one virgin... but then for how many dates does the virgin remain a virgin?

 

[Audie]

72 dates with 72 virgins? Or maybe 72 dates with one virgin... but then for how many dates does the virgin remain a virgin?

I was told that, as I hang in eternal fire by my hair for the
grim and unnatural sin of going about with my hair
uncovered, thus inciting men to lust and lose their way,
my skin will be eternally replaced so that it may be burned off
again.

So I suppose, the poor virgins will have to get recycled
too.

 

[Brickjectivity]

I don't know how it works in context, but maybe the possibility isn't so far-fetched. If you consider - as I do - that early Islam plagiarized a number of elements from Judaism, then the concept becomes another somewhat altered Jewish idea:

What is "[the] eye has not seen (Isa. 64:3)"* [referring to]? Rabbi Yehoshuah ben Levi said, 'This is the wine preserved in it's grapes from the six days of Creation'.
*( This verse is understand to relate to the reward of the World to Come.)
-Talmud​

I do not think the OP is from a reliable source, T. I think this was a prank thread. If they actually are reviewing the translation that is really good, even if it is only an exercise. I'd need to hear it from a credible source.

 

[Anthem]

I do not think the OP is from a reliable source, T. I think this was a prank thread. If they actually are reviewing the translation that is really good, even if it is only an exercise. I'd need to hear it from a credible source.

It is a famous misconception. But also famous for that it isn't true.

This false myth of "white raisins" originated from Christoph Luxenberg, a modern author writing under a pseudonym.[40] His anti-Islamic claim,[41] which has been accused of having a "Christian apologetic agenda",[42] is that the Qur'an was drawn from Christian Syro-Aramaic texts in the early 8th century, in order to evangelize the Arabs,[43] and that the Aramaic word 'hur' (white raisin) had been mistranslated by later Arab commentators into the Arabic word 'houri' (virgin).[44]

The Qur'an describes the physical characteristics of the houri in many places, and a reading of relevant verses show that Luxenberg's theory regarding heavenly white raisins is in error.

Raisins, which are dried grapes, cannot have large eyes,[17] big breasts,[20] cannot restrain their glances,[25] cannot be described as chaste,[25] or have any of the characteristics listed above. The Qur'an further states that men will be wed to these houri.[1] Men cannot be married to raisins or white grapes.

Additionally, for someone to accept this "72 raisins" theory, they would also have to accept that the Qur'an was not written by Allah or revealed to the Prophet Muhammad in Arabic during the 7th century, but was in fact written by Christian evangelists in Syro-Aramaic during the 8th century.

72 Virgins - WikiIslam

 

[sun rise]

Raisins? Raisins? In what alternate reality does that even make sense? Now dates I could understand.

White raisins are sweet. In other words, Heaven will be very sweet.

This issue goes back to at least 2002 Virgins? What virgins?