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What Jehovah's Witnesses got right.

Deeje

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
Saint Frankenstein said:
You've basically just confirmed what I said. You voice support for sexist gender roles and repression of sexuality, especially female sexuality, and also admit to the fear of the effect of female sexuality on men. So, um, thanks for proving my point? :rolleyes:
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LOL, maybe if you revert back to Catholicism again you will appreciate that it wasn't what "I" said at all...it was what the Bible said.
It is the Creator who set the respective roles of men and women. You can argue with him about it if you like, but I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for him to agree with you. :oops:

Perhaps your present god is lying to you again? :confused: He hasn't got a great reputation for telling the truth you know. :(
 
Saint Frankenstein

Saint Frankenstein

Wanderer From Afar
Premium Member
Deeje said:
LOL, maybe if you revert back to Catholicism again you will appreciate that it wasn't what "I" said at all...it was what the Bible said.
It is the Creator who set the respective roles of men and women. You can argue with him about it if you like, but I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for him to agree with you. :oops:
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Yes, the Bible was written from the perspective of sexist, patriarchal cultures that viewed women as little more than property, and you agree with it. I don't care for your self-serving religious slant on it ("it's the word of God!!!"). I'm interested in the plain facts of it.

Perhaps your present god is lying to you again? :confused: He hasn't got a great reputation for telling the truth you know. :(
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I don't believe in a literal Satan, as a deity or otherwise. It's an archetype. The closest to a deity that I have is Kali although I tend to see Her as more of a spiritual framework for viewing the Cosmos and an internal process through rather than a literal personal deity. I am agnostic.
 
Deeje

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
Saint Frankenstein said:
Yes, the Bible was written from the perspective of sexist, patriarchal cultures that viewed women as little more than property, and you agree with it. I don't care for your self-serving religious slant on it ("it's the word of God!!!"). I'm interested in the plain facts of it.


I don't believe in a literal Satan, as a deity or otherwise. It's an archetype. The closest to a deity that I have is Kali although I tend to see Her as more of a spiritual framework for viewing the Cosmos and an internal process through rather than a literal personal deity. I am agnostic.
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People who love God, love what he loves and hate what he hates. I am happy to do that. It is the only "framework" I am interested in as it is rock solid and unchangeable...unlike human opinion which can change on a whim. I know what I believe and why I believe it...I also know that it is what I will believe tomorrow and the day after that, and the year after that, and the millennium after that....:) (James 1:5-8)
 
Saint Frankenstein

Saint Frankenstein

Wanderer From Afar
Premium Member
Deeje said:
People who love God, love what he loves and hate what he hates. I am happy to do that. It is the only "framework" I am interested in as it is rock solid and unchangeable...unlike human opinion which can change on a whim. I know what I believe and why I believe it...I also know that it is what I will believe tomorrow and the day after that, and the year after that, and the millennium after that....:) (James 1:5-8)
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:rolleyes:
 
savagewind

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
If anyone dedicates his or her life to Jehovah via the Christian Congregation of Jehovah's Witnesses he or she will be taught that to leave them is to deny God's promise to save and to teach which God is doing through them, according to them.

They also claim that the whole Bible is righteous and is to be believed and obeyed.

So leaving them means to leave the love of God. But what does the Bible say about the love of God?

Romans 8:38-39 …38 For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, 39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

They teach that leaving them will separate a person from the love of God but the Bible says nothing can do it.
 
D

djhwoodwerks

Well-Known Member
savagewind said:
If anyone dedicates his or her life to Jehovah via the Christian Congregation of Jehovah's Witnesses he or she will be taught that to leave them is to deny God's promise to save and to teach which God is doing through them, according to them.

They also claim that the whole Bible is righteous and is to be believed and obeyed.

So leaving them means to leave the love of God. But what does the Bible say about the love of God?

Romans 8:38-39 …38 For I am convinced that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers, 39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

They teach that leaving them will separate a person from the love of God but the Bible says nothing can do it.
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Good point SW. JW's probably don't pay attention to the last part of that verse either, "separate us from the love of God which is "IN" Christ Jesus our Lord" they probably see that verse as saying, "separate us from the love of God which is in His earthly organization".
 
savagewind

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
djhwoodwerks said:
Good point SW. JW's probably don't pay attention to the last part of that verse either, "separate us from the love of God which is "IN" Christ Jesus our Lord" they probably see that verse as saying, "separate us from the love of God which is in His earthly organization".
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I was a JW for almost twenty years and I did not see it. Looking at their point of view from the outside I see they teach that God's people where alone with no hope until the faithful and discreet slave arrived to feed God's people. OR if it was God feeding God's people before now it is men who have not endured to their end whose job it is to feed us. It is a no wonder that people don't understand what I write because what I see is so very ridiculous.
 
savagewind

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
kerndog said:
UNBELIEVABLE ! ....BREAKING WIND IS OF THE SAME MIND YOU ARE, both blind guides, both will fall into a pit, your bible knowledge is seriously lacking, really, quite pathetic !
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I do not know what you mean but you either prove you are not paying attention (breaking wind?) or you make stuff up. I guess it is both.

Can you answer these questions? Does the table of Jehovah change? According to @Deeje it changes. And does Jesus sit at your table with you?
 
savagewind

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Come on! I think I might agree with the JWs that the table of Jehovah pictures accurate knowledge learned. Am I right?


@Deeje says accurate knowledge changes. If she is right, it means the table of Jehovah changes.

@kerndog can you say that the table of Jehovah changes? Where is Jesus relative to it? Is he at it?
 
savagewind

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
kerndog said:
UNBELIEVABLE ! ....BREAKING WIND IS OF THE SAME MIND YOU ARE, both blind guides, both will fall into a pit, your bible knowledge is seriously lacking, really, quite pathetic !
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Tell us, who are we GUIDING??? Maybe he is trying to guide. I am not a guide.
 
McBell

McBell

mantra-chanting henotheistic snake handler
blue taylor said:
The God of the bible is for jews. There are lots of "gods" out there. Why would you assume I would choose the god of the jews?
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I have no idea what you are talking about.
I am talking about the Bible.
More specifically, I am talking about your ignorance of the Bible.

I said nor implied anything about god, yours or anyone else's.
 
U

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
Mestemia said:
You have just revealed your ignorance of the Bible.
Thank you for the confirmation.
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There seems to be some difference when using the word 'kill '

God does ' execute ' for the sake of justice. So, there is a BIG difference between killing and an execution.
The words from Jesus' mouth will only ' execute ' the wicked - Isaiah 11:3-4; Revelation 19:14-16
In other words, the only warfare Jesus carries on is ' righteous warfare - Revelation 19:11 - meaning No one righteous will be in harm's way.
Only the wicked will be destroyed forever (executed) - Psalms 92:7
 
U

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
djhwoodwerks said:
Mat 25:40 (ESVST) 40 And the King will answer them, ' Truly, I say to you, as you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.
Question, if only the 144,000 are Jesus' brothers, as is claimed by some, then God is the Father of only the 144,000 with a heavenly hope, correct? Why does the "great crowed" of JW's call God Father then? If they aren't Jesus' brothers, God is not their Father.
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Please notice the humble ' sheep'-like people of Matthew 25:31-33,37 are Not Jesus' brothers' of Matthew 25:40.
Matthew 25:40 is in reference to Jesus ' spiritual brothers ' who are alive on earth at the soon coming ' time of separation ' on earth.
The ' sheep ' do good to Jesus' spiritual brothers.
Jesus did Not make a kingdom covenant with just everyone - Luke 22:28-30
Jesus' brothers' of Matthew 25:40 are those who have a first or earlier resurrection to reign and rule with Christ for a thousand years
- Revelation 20:6; Revelation 5:9-10; Revelation 2:10

The ' sheep ' on earth are called to be part of the humble meek people to inherit the earth, or the earthly part of God's kingdom government when there will be global Peace on Earth.
- Matthew 5:5; Psalms 37:11; Psalms 37:29; Proverbs 2:21-22
 
D

djhwoodwerks

Well-Known Member
URAVIP2ME said:
Please notice the humble ' sheep'-like people of Matthew 25:31-33,37 are Not Jesus' brothers' of Matthew 25:40.
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Mat 25:32 (ESVST) 32 Before him will be gathered all the nations, and he will separate people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats.

Do you see something in that verse I don't see? Jesus said, "before Him will be gathered "ALL" the nations, does that leave anyone out? How do you get that His "brothers" aren't among the nations? Can Jesus have any other kind of brother besides "spiritual" brothers?



URAVIP2ME said:
Jesus did Not make a kingdom covenant with just everyone - Luke 22:28-30
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Ok, with that verse, no one today is meant. No one other than the 11 apostles, "continued with Him in His temptations". No one today can be under that covenant.

Mat 19:28 (ESVST) 28 Jesus said to them, " Truly, I say to you, in the new world, when the Son of Man will sit on his glorious throne, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

Will there be 12,000 people on each of the 12 thrones?
 
savagewind

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
URAVIP2ME said:
Please notice the humble ' sheep'-like people of Matthew 25:31-33,37 are Not Jesus' brothers' of Matthew 25:40.
Matthew 25:40 is in reference to Jesus ' spiritual brothers ' who are alive on earth at the soon coming ' time of separation ' on earth.
The ' sheep ' do good to Jesus' spiritual brothers.
Jesus did Not make a kingdom covenant with just everyone - Luke 22:28-30
Jesus' brothers' of Matthew 25:40 are those who have a first or earlier resurrection to reign and rule with Christ for a thousand years
- Revelation 20:6; Revelation 5:9-10; Revelation 2:10

The ' sheep ' on earth are called to be part of the humble meek people to inherit the earth, or the earthly part of God's kingdom government when there will be global Peace on Earth.
- Matthew 5:5; Psalms 37:11; Psalms 37:29; Proverbs 2:21-22
Click to expand...
djhwoodwerks said:
Mat 25:32 (ESVST) 32 Before him will be gathered all the nations, and he will separate people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats.

Do you see something in that verse I don't see? Jesus said, "before Him will be gathered "ALL" the nations, does that leave anyone out? How do you get that His "brothers" aren't among the nations? Can Jesus have any other kind of brother besides "spiritual" brothers?





Ok, with that verse, no one today is meant. No one other than the 11 apostles, "continued with Him in His temptations". No one today can be under that covenant.

Mat 19:28 (ESVST) 28 Jesus said to them, " Truly, I say to you, in the new world, when the Son of Man will sit on his glorious throne, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

Will there be 12,000 people on each of the 12 thrones?
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It seems to me the JWs ignore Jesus until he comes to reward them and that will be the last day.
I think it is OK to think of Jesus in his glory with the angels when he ascended to The Father and all authority was given him.

Isaiah 52:13 Look! My servant will act with insight.He will be raised up high,He will be elevated and greatly exalted.
Matthew 28:18 Then Jesus came to them and said, "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.
Acts of the Apostles 2:32-33 God resurrected this Jesus, and of this we are all witnesses.33 Therefore, because he was exalted to the right hand of God and received the promised holy spirit from the Father, he has poured out what you see and hear.
Philippians 2:9 9 For this very reason, God exalted him to a superior position and kindly gave him the name that is above every other name
Ephesians 1:20-2120 which he exercised toward Christ when he raised him up from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly places,21 far above every government and authority and power and lordship and every name that is named, not only in this system of things but also in that to come.

How much more glory do they expect from him?
 
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savagewind

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Believe it or not savagewind does a little study. While doing so she found out to her surprise that come also means go. Do you not believe me? Look it up!

When he was raised to Heaven he WENT. And from there he is able to see us all. Therefore, Matthew 25:31 really might mean, "when moreover goes the son of man". OK?

Too much, he says.
 
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