Islam vs western values

[Father Heathen]

3.8 billion people watched it. you guys don't watch it because america can never win it and it hurts your ego knowing that america is not good at it

Again, it's just grown men chasing a ball around.

 

[Pro Gamer]

Again, it's just grown men chasing a ball around.

yeah they have real skills unlike any of your american celebrities. infact ronaldo is bigger than your entire country. if any of the american celebrity comes to asia or non english speaking european countries then most people are gonna be like "who is this guy"

 

[Father Heathen]

yeah they have real skills unlike any of your american celebrities. infact ronaldo is bigger than your entire country. if any of the american celebrity comes to asia or non english speaking european countries then most people are gonna be like "who is this guy"

Oh my goodness.

 

[Pro Gamer]

Oh my goodness.

infact messi is going to america this month so joe biden is no longer the most important person in usa anymore

 

[Father Heathen]

infact messi is going to america this month so joe biden is no longer the most important person in usa anymore

Golly.

 

[Pro Gamer]

5 million people just to have a glance at messi

 

[Debater Slayer]

infact ronaldo is bigger than your entire country.

It must be hard for him to walk around carrying more than 50 states.

 

[Mock Turtle]

iran is a shia country but you see same hijab and burkha imposed there so basic laws that came from the quran are same everywhere. also country laws have nothing to do with islamic laws so i live in a country where dress is not imposed but ask anyone on the street and they would claim that it is better to wear burkha because islamic beliefs are same out there. all of your western freedoms will fade away soon

If all Muslims believed in Islamic Law why do they behave differently then? Surely they should all just live in those countries where their behaviours matched their beliefs rather than in countries where they have to behave differently, and according to the laws and cultures of these countries. Or are they just hypocrites?

As to our Western freedoms, well such have been built over a long period of time and are progressing rather than receding - at least in the many countries where the right-wing and/or religious don't tend to dominate. Whatever our views as to differences between peoples, the more tolerant attitude will tend to win out over dogmatic belief systems - such as yours - and having lived for over seventy years (in the UK), the changes I have seen have been for the betterment of humans and societies - despite the many deficits of having such freedoms.

If you think that Islam will one day dominate, one has to wonder if so many in the rich Arab states are setting the best example. They seem to be behaving as much like the Western wealthy, and more inclined to worldly wealth than heavenly wealth.

 

[Debater Slayer]

I also would hope that Muslims are changing their thinking and not blowing each other up with bombs strapped to their bodies.

The vast majority of the world's two billion Muslims already don't "[blow] each other up with bombs strapped to their bodies." Your post referred to "Muslims," but what percentage of Muslims do you think would support such a thing in the first place and would, therefore, need to change their thinking about it?

 

[danieldemol]

what's the contradiction

it's not blindly following any forefather. we don't care about forefathers. we follow the same quran that people in 7th century followed

You say you don't blindly follow any forefather then make a vague reference to following a way "that people in the 7th century followed", but who are those 7th century people whose way you (in my view) blindly follow if not your Islamic forefathers?

Here is the litmus test for determining whether you are blindly following in my opinion, if you are not blindly following you should be able to support your way using reason, so demonstrate according to reason that lgbt folk should be murdered and that slavery should be supported in the age of the industrial revolution please.

 

[danieldemol]

what is harmful for someone can be beneficial for someone else

A)That doesn't make it circular in my view.
B) It is still wrong if it causes demonstrable harm except where its the lesser of two evils eg if i kill you and take your property it is of harm to you and some degree of benefit to me, but it is still wrong because a demonstrable harm has occurred in my opinion.

 

[danieldemol]

Why? What would be the point? What benefit would that have to me, and more importantly, to them?

It benefits me as passing judgement on those who wish to enslave me motivates self defence. It will benefit them if they are open-minded enough to learn from wise judgement in my view.

 

[Twilight Hue]

There were many cultural values and systems in past that were lost in time but Islam always stood. all the western morality you are claiming right now might be seen as immoral in future because cultural values change over time and western values will fade away as well but Islam will always stand. in next hundred years you might not see western liberalism or feminism or whatever but i can gurantee you that Islamic values will remain in next thousand years as well because Islam never changes

Unfortunately with all the human misery it entails as well.

 

[Twilight Hue]

christianity that augustus and many others believed is not the same as what christians are believing right now

It will be a great day when Abrahamic religions will be no more.

 

[danieldemol]

we don't have a caliph or empire but that's political change not religious.

Islam seems to be a political religion, so to arbitrarily call something that some Muslims interpreted as being a pillar of Islam a "political change" as opposed to a religious change seems to be fallacious to me.

For example;
'Ibn Khaldun (1334-1406 CE) holds that the issue of politics and caliphate is related to representing God’s justice among His servants. Therefore whoever is capable of providing justice when ruling Muslims can be elected as a caliph. He argues that, at the beginning of Islam, caliphs were chosen from the bloodline of Quraysh and they all tried to provide justice for all the citizens in the Islamic state. Then it became a kingdom where obeying a caliph was accepted as one of the pillars of the Islamic creed.'

Source: Caliphate, a disputed concept, no longer has a hold over all Muslims

 

[danieldemol]

if it was in a war so i would have bid you. would you rather have american bombing in your country or islamic slavery?

Better to die on my feet than live on my knees

 

[SalixIncendium]

There were many cultural values and systems in past that were lost in time but Islam always stood. all the western morality you are claiming right now might be seen as immoral in future because cultural values change over time and western values will fade away as well but Islam will always stand. in next hundred years you might not see western liberalism or feminism or whatever but i can gurantee you that Islamic values will remain in next thousand years as well because Islam never changes

If Islam never changes, why the different denominations and schools?

That which resists change does so at its own peril.

 

[Pro Gamer]

It must be hard for him to walk around carrying more than 50 states.

i mean his value is more than america

 

[Pro Gamer]

Better to die on my feet than live on my knees

why is death better than living

 

[Pro Gamer]

If Islam never changes, why the different denominations and schools?

That which resists change does so at its own peril.

different schools of thoughts have never negated basic islamic laws and common folks aren't even aware of schools of thoughts