Demons, is there any evidence they even exist?

[Dan From Smithville]

You missed the mirror. Perhaps you should look at it.


There is objective evidence for demons. It is seen activities which are documented all over the www. You can read them.


I have to listen to scientists, and you yourself. You have not shown me anything. What... You want me to go to CERN? Come let's go to Haiti.
want to go to a house where demons inhabit? I'm not going with you.
I'm saying you would have to see for yourself, or otherwise get the details from those with the experiences...and yes. that is objective evidence.

I asked for objective evidence. Not claims from you and other scientists.

So many scientists are saying "Nope". Why should I listen to your testimony?
as an alternative to dark matter in interpreting galactic kinematics
a simple test suggests that dark matter does not in fact exist

I don't have the time to find all of them for you. Search the www, if you have not heard.
If it turns out there is no Dark Matter, what would you say? "Oh. But there was evidence for some gravitational Easter Bunny."

Pony up. Show us the objective evidence.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Share yours here.

That's what I thought. Nothing.

 

[ElishaElijah]

I believe. I just don't see Christ as a piggy bank granting wishes and riches like some fairytale character.

Me either, I just take Him at His Word and ask Him to do what He said He would do in my life:
“And He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned. And these signs will follow those who believe: In My name they will cast out demons; they will speak with new tongues; they will take up serpents; and if they drink anything deadly, it will by no means hurt them; they will lay hands on the sick, and they will recover.””
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16‬:‭15‬-‭18‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Seems they don't seem to get that. Or they don't want to, because it makes them feel they have something over demons being the cause of observed effects.
If I saw a heavy door slam really hard, and I know the wind cannot move it, and no one touched that door, it is a phenomenon for which there is some explanation. What?
It's not my TV remote.

What do you think when you see smoke? There's nothing there? Based on what you have argued, I would suggest a job for the forest service wouldn't be a good fit for you.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Me either, I just take Him at His Word and ask Him to do what He said He would do in my life:
“And He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature. He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned. And these signs will follow those who believe: In My name they will cast out demons; they will speak with new tongues; they will take up serpents; and if they drink anything deadly, it will by no means hurt them; they will lay hands on the sick, and they will recover.””
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16‬:‭15‬-‭18‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

Do you speak in tongues?

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

Everyone needs coping strategies. Like religion, for example. Some are healthier than others. Your belief that prescribed medications monitored by a doctor are like drug addiction is not an informed opinion. So again, no, you don't know what you're talking about.



And I'd rather be able to wave a magic wand and make all my problems go away too. But that isn't reality.



Because it's snake oil rather than medicine.

Besides, he's already a Christian anyway. Oh let me guess, not a "real" one, not the right kind.

Look at what being a genuine believer in God and sincerely praying to God in Jesus' name for years got me: thirteen and a half years of severe abuse and neglect while growing up in a Christian home, twelve years of bullying and harassment at school while growing up, and having to deal with PTSD and trauma for the majority of my adult life. I can personally attest to the fact that having faith in God and being a Christian were detrimental to my mental health and emotional well-being. I lost count of how many times I prayed to God in Jesus' name when I was a child and teenager, pleading to be saved from being abused by my adopted mother and adopted older brother. I also prayed to God in Jesus' name, and pleaded with him to save me from being bullied and harassed at school. My adopted mother threatened my life more than once, and a couple of teenagers I knew in high school also threatened my life. I literally feared for my life more than once while I was growing up. For me, praying to God was like praying to a brick wall and expecting the wall to answer me. My point is that, after realizing that my faith and hope in God were emotional crutches and detrimental to my mental health, I finally made the decision to let it all go in order to emotionally heal and better my life. I've healed emotionally and significantly improved my life without believing in or having faith in God. I also realized that I don't need God in my life to be a moral person or to be at peace and content with life. I'm happy without God.

It was the best decision that I've ever made for my mental health and emotional well-being. It was, without a doubt, the best decision that I've ever made for myself. It took some time for me to let go of my faith in God and heal, but forsaking my faith turned my life around for the better. I have peace and joy in my heart, and I feel content with my life. That's something that I never felt during the thirty years I was a Christian and during the years before when I prayed to God, asking him to protect me from being abused and bullied. I think my experience of letting go of my Christian beliefs is analogous to being imprisoned, except that my cell door was always open and I was unaware that I could leave whenever I wanted to. Christianity was a prison for me, and now I'm free from it. There is no amount of shaming or threats of God's wrath and hellfire that Christians can hurl at me that will ever convince me to be a Christian again. As I explained before, being a devout Christian was an absolute nightmare for me, and I am determined to never be a Christian again.

As an ex-Christian, I no longer fear being judged by God or being sent to hell. I've let go of these fear-based tactics of Christianity, and I no longer allow these beliefs to control my thoughts or my life. It was such a relief for me after I finally let go of these beliefs: the fear of God, the shame of disobeying God, the constant worry that I'd lose my salvation if I sinned against God and then died, and the persistent fear of going to hell even though I accepted Jesus Christ as my savior (Matthew 7:21–23). Now, I believe that these beliefs can be very detrimental to a person's mental and emotional well-being. It certainly was for me. The only regret I have regarding my decision to renounce my faith in God is that I should have done it years ago rather than continue to hold on to the false hope that God is a loving and merciful heavenly father who loves me and cares about me. I could have saved myself many years of anxiety and depression if I had been able to realize that my belief, faith, hope, and trust in God were the root causes of my anxiety and depression in the first place. I realize and understand that all the years of negative experiences I've had with Christianity are only anecdotal evidence, just as when Christians share their positive stories about having God in their lives. My point is that, after realizing that my faith, hope, and trust in God were an emotional crutch, I made the decision to let it all go in order to emotionally heal and better my life. To paraphrase Penn Jillette, a person does not need God in their life to be moral and a good person. I believe his statement is validated by my personal experience of significantly improving my life without having a belief in or faith in God. You can read his quote here. In my opinion, he is spot on. I'm not sure how I can say it more emphatically: I don't need or want God in my life.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Look at what being a genuine believer in God and sincerely praying to God in Jesus' name for years got me: thirteen and a half years of severe abuse and neglect while growing up in a Christian home, twelve years of bullying and harassment at school while growing up, and having to deal with PTSD and trauma for the majority of my adult life. I can personally attest to the fact that having faith in God and being a Christian were detrimental to my mental health and emotional well-being. I lost count of how many times I prayed to God in Jesus' name when I was a child and teenager, pleading to be saved from being abused by my adopted mother and adopted older brother. I also prayed to God in Jesus' name, and pleaded with him to save me from being bullied and harassed at school. My adopted mother threatened my life more than once, and a couple of teenagers I knew in high school also threatened my life. I literally feared for my life more than once while I was growing up. For me, praying to God was like praying to a brick wall and expecting the wall to answer me. My point is that, after realizing that my faith and hope in God were emotional crutches and detrimental to my mental health, I finally made the decision to let it all go in order to emotionally heal and better my life. I've healed emotionally and significantly improved my life without believing in or having faith in God. I also realized that I don't need God in my life to be a moral person or to be at peace and content with life. I'm happy without God.

It was the best decision that I've ever made for my mental health and emotional well-being. It was, without a doubt, the best decision that I've ever made for myself. It took some time for me to let go of my faith in God and heal, but forsaking my faith turned my life around for the better. I have peace and joy in my heart, and I feel content with my life. That's something that I never felt during the thirty years I was a Christian and during the years before when I prayed to God, asking him to protect me from being abused and bullied. I think my experience of letting go of my Christian beliefs is analogous to being imprisoned, except that my cell door was always open and I was unaware that I could leave whenever I wanted to. Christianity was a prison for me, and now I'm free from it. There is no amount of shaming or threats of God's wrath and hellfire that Christians can hurl at me that will ever convince me to be a Christian again. As I explained before, being a devout Christian was an absolute nightmare for me, and I am determined to never be a Christian again.

As an ex-Christian, I no longer fear being judged by God or being sent to hell. I've let go of these fear-based tactics of Christianity, and I no longer allow these beliefs to control my thoughts or my life. It was such a relief for me after I finally let go of these beliefs: the fear of God, the shame of disobeying God, the constant worry that I'd lose my salvation if I sinned against God and then died, and the persistent fear of going to hell even though I accepted Jesus Christ as my savior (Matthew 7:21–23). Now, I believe that these beliefs can be very detrimental to people's mental and emotional well-being. It certainly was for me. The only regret I have regarding my decision to renounce my faith in God is that I should have done it years ago rather than continue to hold on to the false hope that God is a loving and merciful heavenly father who loves me and cares about me. I could have saved myself many years of anxiety and depression if I had been able to realize that my belief, faith, hope, and trust in God were the root causes of my anxiety and depression in the first place. I realize and understand that all the years of negative experiences I've had with Christianity are only anecdotal evidence, just as when Christians share their positive stories about having God in their lives. My point is that, after realizing that my faith, hope, and trust in God were an emotional crutch, I made the decision to let it all go in order to emotionally heal and better my life. To paraphrase Penn Jillette, a person does not need God in their life to be moral and a good person. I believe his statement is validated by my personal experience of significantly improving my life without having a belief in or faith in God. You can read his quote here. In my opinion, he is spot on. I'm not sure how I can say it more emphatically: I don't need or want God in my life.

I'm sorry that you had to experience so much hurt. But it is a sad fact that you are not alone in those experiences. And not alone in where it lead you. Even sadder, there are many of the faith that practice what I can only describe as a brand of hatred and abuse that they feel entirely justified in dispensing in the name of God. I don't see them as having a mature faith or truly have experienced the peace and love that Christ offered. To me they are wiping their noses with the sacrifice Christ made. I do not care for that overbearing, vindictive worship of God through threat of violence or fact of it. That type of Christian does more harm to the Word of God and drives people away rather than gathering them in.

I think it makes a big difference in the denomination and the people that a person is surrounded by. In my experience, I have been blessed I suppose to be with a sound family and a kind and decent church family. But I know that doesn't always turn out that way for everyone.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

I asked God for help and He didn't show up, but people often do show up to help, like my friends @Truthseeker , @Sgt. Pepper , and @JustGeorge.

Most people, in my opinion, are far more reliable and trustworthy than God, based on my own lifetime of praying to him with no results. I've met many former Christians who have had similar life experiences to mine, including years of abuse, neglect, and bullying, since I left Christianity two years ago.

 

[YoursTrue]

Another post that deserves the Winner Frube.

Except that sometimes it's true about doctors prescribing medications that could hurt a person and get hooked with serious consequences

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

Another post that deserves the Winner Frube.

I second that.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

LOL that's what you're promising to mentally ill people if they go to one of your revivals or whatever. If you want to make your religion sound less like magic, stop promising people magical results.

Just stop.

^ This.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Most people, in my opinion, are far more reliable and trustworthy than God, based on my own lifetime of praying to him with no results. I've met many former Christians who have had similar life experiences to mine, including years of abuse, neglect, and bullying, since I left Christianity two years ago.

Sometimes, after watching the antics of some Christians, I am reminded that often they do more harm than good while thinking themselves so righteous. Some of them are more apt to drive people from God than bring them to Him.

 

[Left Coast]

Yeah I told him it was possible, is that a promise?

You strongly implied. We both know this. The readers can judge.

 

[YoursTrue]

I wasn’t comparing your situation but only sharing mine and identifying the similarity with needing drugs.
I also asked why you stopped taking them in 2016 and wouldn’t you rather be off of the drugs and be free from them?
I didn’t say stop taking them but the contrary, sometimes drugs are needed, if you’re good with that then fine but for me I would rather be free like I am now and Jesus Christ did that.
What would you say if you ended up going to a Deliverance Conference and God set you free In the Name of Jesus? You believe you’re set free and you see your doctor and with his supervision you’re able to stop the drugs and are a changed man all by the power of God?

I can understand what you're saying. Psychiatrists really do not know how to 'cure' a person, drugs are often the remedy applied, and these drugs can have a deleterious effect on a person. They can be and are addictive, but as you say, each one must determine for himself how to cope with these things. God can certainly help a person. But again -- each one must decide for himself how to deal with these things.

 

[YoursTrue]

Sometimes, after watching the antics of some Christians, I am reminded that often they do more harm than good while thinking themselves so righteous. Some of them are more apt to drive people from God than bring them to Him.

Honesty is a good thing. Since Jesus was accused of insulting others, yet then again some people do not believe he really existed as portrayed in the Bible, so I wonder -- how can a person pray to God in the name of Jesus yet not believe the accounts about him? Among other things. I mean as we learn about the theories of abiogenesis, the universe, before anything, etc., again -- as I am seeing 'anything goes.'

 

[Left Coast]

Except that sometimes it's true about doctors prescribing medications that could hurt a person and get hooked with serious consequences

Who better than a licensed medical professional to help a person navigate those risks?

 

[Dan From Smithville]

From what I read on here and all the erroneous information bandied about as if it were fact, I can honestly say that I am glad many of you are not in charge of my health and hope are not in charge of the health of anyone but yourselves.

Most of the drugs used to treat mental illness are not addictive and offer help to people that was not available in the past. Despite that many of you have a medical degree from the University of Never Got One, I think I will stick with actual educated and accredited physicians if I ever find myself needing that sort of help. And doing that isn't an attack on God or denial of Christ. Good grief, He gave us brains.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Who better than a licensed medical professional to help a person navigate those risks?

Absolutely!

Winner Frube!

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

Sometimes, after watching the antics of some Christians, I am reminded that often they do more harm than good while thinking themselves so righteous. Some of them are more apt to drive people from God than bring them to Him.

I'm reminded of what you said after watching some Christians' antics as well, and I'm also reminded of these two quotes.

"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ." - Mahatma Gandhi

"The greatest single cause of atheism in the world today is Christians: who acknowledge Jesus with their lips, walk out the door, and deny Him by their lifestyle. That is what an unbelieving world simply finds unbelievable.” - Brennan Manning (also mentioned in the DC Talk song, "What if I Stumble?").

I'd often play this song by Casting Crowns when I was a Christian, and I recall how it made a few Christians around me feel very uncomfortable.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Who better than a licensed medical professional to help a person navigate those risks?

Often wonder if the people that are so busy into telling everyone else how they should live ever gave much thought to the possibility that modern medicine might be the answer to prayers.