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Understanding the holy scriptures is impossible unless God gives you the interpretation

Samael_Khan

Samael_Khan

Goosebender
oldbadger said:
What evidence do you think would convince you that my claims about the Oz JWs being open and honest is true?
Click to expand...

Did I say they weren't?

Most Witnesses I know are honest. So i think the same would apply in Australia. Obviously there are bad eggs among them but I would say that JWs as a whole have to maintain honesty as best as they can to please Jehovah.

The policies of the organisation itself is what I have a problem with. Which is what I am pointing out.

As an organisation i would say that they ommit information but that is on a worldwide basis not an Australia JW only basis.
 
Audie

Audie

Veteran Member
Hockeycowboy said:
A reasonable open-minded person, after doing further research, would recognize that there is way more than two stories which speak of a global flood.....over 260, sharing many of the details! And these stories are world-wide, some even coming from land-locked areas, where flooding is non-existent (so historical experience can't be assumed as an explanation.)

Have you ever considered the numerous "Day of the Dead" celebrations, from many different cultures worldwide, most of which are held in October /November, corresponding w/ the time of year the Flood occurred?
References will be forthcoming. Soon.

Goodnight.
Click to expand...

Way more than two accounts of mermaids and dragons.

A reasonable and open minded person would note
that there is no physical evidence in geology or biology
for the "flood".
They would also note the data that is wholly inconsistent
with the "flood" model.

They would not employ grossly inconsistent standards for
evidence that disproves theories. ( see "Cambrian" as
disproof of ToE) v polar ice disproving "flood".

Reasonable people do not find it necessary to hand wave
all research methods that dont dance to their tune.

Oh, and open minded intellectually honest do not do
conclusion first then try to make such frozen mammoths
force fit as proof.
 
sooda

sooda

Veteran Member
Audie said:
Way more than two accounts of mermaids and dragons.

A reasonable and open minded person would note
that there is no physical evidence in geology or biology
for the "flood".
They would also note the data that is wholly inconsistent
with the "flood" model.

They would not employ grossly inconsistent standards for
evidence that disproves theories. ( see "Cambrian" as
disproof of ToE) v polar ice disproving "flood".

Reasonable people do not find it necessary to hand wave
all research methods that dont dance to their tune.

Oh, and open minded intellectually honest do not do
conclusion first then try to make such frozen mammoths
force fit as proof.
Click to expand...

Saudi Arabia was NEVER flooded.

  1. Mammoth remains found in Nafud Desert | Arab News
    www.arabnews.com/node/1196831
    JEDDAH: The Saudi Geological Survey (SGS) discovered the remnants of tusks, ribs, and forearms of a small mammoth in the Nafud Desert, east of the town of Tayma, noting that the discovered parts ...


 
Samael_Khan

Samael_Khan

Goosebender
oldbadger said:
Well, you got that wrong.
The JWs of Australia openly presented every report of an alleged incident to Government investigators, and one led to a conviction and one other to a JW giving up eldership. We debated and discussed this very subject about two years ago on RF.

@Deeje would know more about this.
Click to expand...
oldbadger said:
Your point?
My point was that the JWs were open and clear in producing all of their records!

Enough. You clearly cannot let go of the watchtower, it seems?
Click to expand...

So I was just rechecking my posts to see whether I might have said anything that might portray that I view JWs as liars.

I think it might be because of this:

"It is applied to potential child sexual abuse situations yet is obviously incapable of determining the truth of the situation because nobody abuses a child in the presence of another person who isnt also involved. So they will keep child abusers in the congregation unless the abuser is confesses him or herself. "

What I meant was that child abusers would stay in the congregation because the elders would have no way of detecting whether someone is a child abuser unless that person confesses himself or herself. Not that they willfully keep child abusers in the congregation knowing that they are child abusers. Which is why I mentiomed the Two Witness rule.
 
Audie

Audie

Veteran Member
Israel Khan said:
Did I say they weren't?

Most Witnesses I know are honest. So i think the same would apply in Australia. Obviously there are bad eggs among them but I would say that JWs as a whole have to maintain honesty as best as they can to please Jehovah.

The policies of the organisation itself is what I have a problem with. Which is what I am pointing out.

As an organisation i would say that they ommit information but that is on a worldwide basis not an Australia JW only basis.
Click to expand...

Honest like dont steal, or honest about not lying?
Honest like intellectually honest?

Lying is a bit hard to define but- speaking facts
not in evidence, without knowledge of the matter,
based on preconceived ideas and subjected to
no diligence...

That will get you in a lot of trouble if you do
that in court. It is NOT HONEST.
 
Samael_Khan

Samael_Khan

Goosebender
Audie said:
Honest like dont steal, or honest about not lying?
Honest like intellectually honest?

Lying is a bit hard to define but- speaking facts
not in evidence, without knowledge of the matter,
based on preconceived ideas and subjected to
no diligence...

That will get you in a lot of trouble if you do
that in court. It is NOT HONEST.
Click to expand...

Agreed
 
Dan From Smithville

Dan From Smithville

What we've got here is failure to communicate.
Staff member
Premium Member
Hockeycowboy said:
A reasonable open-minded person, after doing further research, would recognize that there is way more than two stories which speak of a global flood.....over 260, sharing many of the details! And these stories are world-wide, some even coming from land-locked areas, where flooding is non-existent (so historical experience can't be assumed as an explanation.)

Have you ever considered the numerous "Day of the Dead" celebrations, from many different cultures worldwide, most of which are held in October /November, corresponding w/ the time of year the Flood occurred?
References will be forthcoming. Soon.

Goodnight.
Click to expand...
The stories that share detail are not found world wide. They are found in a region where expected, due to cultural exchange through trade.

Flood stories are common in cultures, because people often live near water, but not all cultures have the same flood story. Many are just about local floods. Some old cultures have no flood stories.

This is just your attempt to find any way, no matter how thin, to bring life to myth.

Have you considered the possibility that you are back filling data to fit a claim, because your church demands that the claim be seen as valid? That happens in human cultures around the world.I

Ambiguous, inconsistent evidence subject to a high degree of interpretation without the range of impact that is claimed is not evidence.
 
Last edited:
Audie

Audie

Veteran Member
sooda said:
Flash floods in Riyadh and Jeddah..That's why KSA has built over 300 dams to capture ground water.. Many are recharge dams.

None the less KSA was never flooded.. God knows the country has been crawling with geologists for 70 years. They would have found flood sediment if one existed.
Click to expand...

Only the fundy-gadundys would think it did.
 
sooda

sooda

Veteran Member
Audie said:
So?

There are whale bones in the egyptian desert and oyster
shells in Kansas.
Click to expand...

There was once a large inland sea in America.

  1. Western Interior Seaway - Wikipedia
    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Interior_Seaway
    The Western Interior Seaway (also called the Cretaceous Seaway, the Niobraran Sea, the North American Inland Sea, and the Western Interior Sea) was a large inland sea that existed during the mid- to late Cretaceous period as well as the very early Paleogene, splitting the continent of North America into two landmasses, Laramidia to the west and Appalachia to the east.

  2. Inland sea (geology) - Wikipedia
    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inland_sea_(geology)
    An inland sea (also known as an epeiric sea or an epicontinental sea) is a shallow sea that covers central areas of continents during periods of high sea level that result in marine transgressions. In modern times, continents stand high, eustatic sea levels are low, and there are few inland seas, the largest being Hudson Bay.
 
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