As a Jew this is hard for me to explain

[IndigoChild5559]

How many Jews are there? Most of the population of Gaza were not born there.. They were forced out of the West Bank and the Negev.

Remember. The Palestinians have NO right of return. That's only for Jews.

Again, you are AVOIDING explaining the sudden explosion of Palestinian population to 4.8 million, because you can't do it without admitting massive immigration.

You see, it really doesn't matter what other facts you bring up, if you avoid the question.

 

[sooda]

Again, you are AVOIDING explaining the sudden explosion of Palestinian population to 4.8 million, because you can't do it without admitting massive immigration.

You see, it really doesn't matter what other facts you bring up, if you avoid the question.

They didn't migrate between 1917 and 1930.. so where did they come from? What the Jewish population of Palestine now?

British Restrictions on Jewish Immigration to Palestine
https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/british-restrictions-on-jewish-immigration-to...
Jewish vs. Arab Immigration. In 1915, approximately 83,000 Jews lived in Palestine among 590,000 Muslim and Christian Arabs.

According to the 1922 census, the Jewish population was 84,000, while the Arabs numbered 643,000. 4 Thus, the Arab population continued to grow exponentially even while that of the Jews stagnated.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

They didn't migrate between 1917 and 1930.. so where did they come from? What the Jewish population of Palestine now?

British Restrictions on Jewish Immigration to Palestine
https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/british-restrictions-on-jewish-immigration-to...
Jewish vs. Arab Immigration. In 1915, approximately 83,000 Jews lived in Palestine among 590,000 Muslim and Christian Arabs.

According to the 1922 census, the Jewish population was 84,000, while the Arabs numbered 643,000. 4 Thus, the Arab population continued to grow exponentially even while that of the Jews stagnated.

My question to you is not regarding the Jewish population. I already answered that.

My question to you is regarding the explosion of the Palestinian population to 4.8 million today -- the question you continue to deliberately avoid, because it means admitting immigration.

I have asked this question umpteen times and you have refused to answer. Refuse again, and I will consider that my point has been successfully made due to your utter inability to defend your point.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

They didn't migrate between 1917 and 1930

I never said they did. What I said was that the Palestinian population TODAY the children of immigrants, and the grandchildren of immigrants.

So... are you now ready to explain the 4.8 million who claim to be "Palestinians" but are actually immigrants or recent descendants of immigrants?

Again, this wave of immigration is a strategy to undermine the establishment of a Jewish state (which in their minds still does not exist).

 

[sooda]

https://wiki2.org/en/Demographic_history_of_Palestine_(region)

This lie should not persist. Look at the numbers.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

https://wiki2.org/en/Demographic_history_of_Palestine_(region)

This lie should not persist. Look at the numbers.

Your website only goes to 1947. AGAIN, I have stated that the population of Palestinians TODAY is 4.8 million, and you refuse to understand and you refuse to reply to it.

As I said I would do in my previous post, I consider your point lost, since you have been unable to provide a single piece of evidence giving any alternative explanation for today's explosion of population other than immigration. Our dialogue on this issue is closed.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

No offense, and I hope my frankness will not offend you. Your questions imply to me the problem of the identity with ancient world views like the Roman Church (RCC), Judaism or any other religion with an ancient tribal orientation. Being Jew by tradition would be the cultural identity with your ancestors, okay, but where do you go from there to address the universal which is the nature of humanity throughout thousands or more years.

What? Catholicism is not a tribal religion. There's nothing wrong with tribal religions. It's the universalist religions that have done most of the damage to humanity as they demand all must believe as they do and often force it on others. Tribal religions have no problem with diversity.

 

[shunyadragon]

What? Catholicism is not a tribal religion. There's nothing wrong with tribal religions.

It is a historical fact that tribal religions wage wars, ethnic cleansing, and persecution against those who believe differently up until the present.

Tribal religions have no problem with diversity.

Tribal religions like Judaism, Christianity and Islam do definitely reject diversity beyond their belief system throughout history. At best moderate movements in these religions are more tolerant of those who believe differently but that is as far as they go.

It's the universalist religions that have done most of the damage to humanity as they demand all must believe as they do and often force it on others.

Please expound further with specific examples.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

It is a historical fact that tribal religions wage wars, ethnic cleansing, and persecution against those who believe differently



Tribal religions like Judaism, Christianity and Islam do definitely reject diversity beyond their belief system throughout history. At best moderate movements in these religions are more tolerant of those who believe differently but that is as far as they go.



Please expound further with specific examples.

You're misusing the word "tribal". We're talking about two different things. Tribal religions are the religions of certainly tribes or ethnicities. Another term for them is ethnic religions. Judaism is an ethnic religion. Christianity, Islam, Buddhism, Baha'i, etc. are all universalist religions.

 

[shunyadragon]

You're misusing the word "tribal". We're talking about two different things. Tribal religions are the religions of certainly tribes or ethnicities. Another term for them is ethnic religions. Judaism is an ethnic religion. Christianity, Islam,

Disagree, Judaism, Christianity are tribal religions. Your attempt at differentiation does not make sense. Historically, Biblically and on the basis of the Quran for Islam, Christianity and Islam are tribal, because of their claim and cultural orientation in history. Christianity claims to fulfill Judaism on the basis lineage of the prophets, and reject matter of factly rejects all other religions. Islam makes similar claims. Tribal religions are the ones that make sharp divisions between us and all others who do not believe as they do, and have defined tribal origins.

All religions essentially make a universalist claim.

Tribal wars are between all of the above.

Buddhism, Baha'i, etc. are all universalist religions.

Buddhism is a maybe, but it has a strong cultural orientation. No tribal wars from these religions. Unitarian Universalists would be an example of a universalist secular religions.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Disagree, Judaism, Christianity are tribal religions. Your attempt at differentiation does not make sense. Historically, Biblically and on the basis of the Quran for Islam, Christianity and Islam are tribal, because of their claim and cultural orientation in history. Christianity claims to fulfill Judaism on the basis lineage of the prophets, and reject matter of factly rejects all other religions. Islam makes similar claims. Tribal religions are the ones that make sharp divisions between us and all others who do not believe as they do, and have defined tribal origins.

All religions essentially make a universalist claim.

Tribal wars are between all of the above.



Buddhism is a maybe, but it has a strong cultural orientation. No tribal wars from these religions. Unitarian Universalists would be an example of a universalist secular religions.

Sorry, but you're just incorrect and misusing words. No academic uses the word tribal in such a way or would categorize Christianity and Islam as tribal (if they are, then so is your religion). Tribal religions are indigenous or ethnic religions, usually referring to "pre-literate" cultures. My religion of Germanic animism and polytheism is a tribal religion, for example.

Tribal Religion - Dictionary & Encyclopedia
Indigenous religion

 

[sooda]

Your website only goes to 1947. AGAIN, I have stated that the population of Palestinians TODAY is 4.8 million, and you refuse to understand and you refuse to reply to it.

As I said I would do in my previous post, I consider your point lost, since you have been unable to provide a single piece of evidence giving any alternative explanation for today's explosion of population other than immigration. Our dialogue on this issue is closed.

You think Palestinians were immigrating AFTER 1947? LOL

You have the proof of the census in 1900 and 1930.. There is NO excuse for the lie that the Palestinians arrived after the Balfour letter. You can't do the right thing based on lies.

 

[Muffled]

Yes, the Israelites were shepherds.. They were just like the Amorites, Amalekites.. They were nomadic Canaanites without affiliations which is why they needed to move into the Egyptian hill country of Canaan.

Bedouin are always affiliated with some town.. They take the townspeople's livestock away for grazing.. They provide the towns people with meat, leather hides, salt and bitumin. The townspeople provide them with grains, textiles, pots and pans.

When the sea people fought the Egyptians and settled on the coast the Canaanites migrated East and South East. They needed to settle and grow their own grains.

The Israelites were not Canaanites. They lived in Canaan after moving from Haran.

 

[Muffled]

You are misusing the word "speculations". That date is a conclusion based upon the Biblical claims that the Nativity took place in the time of Herod. When he ruled is known. But then Luke added a bogus census as an excuse to get Jesus to Bethlehem. The dates of various censuses are known too. They contradict.

I believe it is still speculation about the facts and why they don't mesh.

 

[Muffled]

The story is fiction. Moses was raised and educated in the Pharaoh's house yet he never knew the name of the Pharaoh.

I believe the null hypothesis does not work in this case. Even more so because you can't read the mind of Moses to know what he knows.

 

[sooda]

I believe the null hypothesis does not work in this case. Even more so because you can't read the mind of Moses to know what he knows.

For instance... Abraham had no camels.. The story (with camels) was written after the 5th century BC and the writers added camels. Moses, Abraham and the Exodus are all myths.

 

[sooda]

The Israelites were not Canaanites. They lived in Canaan after moving from Haran.

Before they moved to Haran they were Ammonites. They were Canaanites.

According to the study, the Canaanites were the common ancestor for several ancient peoples who inhabited the Levant during the Bronze Age, such as the Ammonites, Moabites, and Israelites. “Each achieved their own cultural identities but all shared a common genetic and ethnic root with Canaanites,” according to the authors of the new study.
The Canaanites weren't annihilated, they just 'moved' to ...
www.timesofisrael.com/the-canaanites-werent-annihilated-they-just-moved-to-lebanon/

 

[Subduction Zone]

I believe it is still speculation about the facts and why they don't mesh.

Then at best you are misusing the term "speculation".

 

[sooda]

Then at best you are misusing the term "speculation".

@Muffled

Lot fathered the Moabites and the Ammonites by his daughters (Gen. 19:37–38). .. so they were all related to Abraham.

The Canaanites lived in the Levant and all modern indigenous peoples of the Levant ORIGINATED FROM THE CANAANITES including Jews who also originated from the ancient Canaanites. Hebrew is an ancient Canaanite language in origin.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

You think Palestinians were immigrating AFTER 1947? LOL

Again, the discussion is closed. You lost. You were unable to support your point and answer the question.