Is Peace on Earth Really God's Goal????

[Hockeycowboy]

How do you know the book was not just some grand cosmic joke on humanity?

Because the wisdom of the counsel it gives for Christians, reveals it's origin to be from a Higher Source.

As Mahatma Gandhi said to the British Viceroy of India, Lord Irwin:
"When your country and mine shall get together on the teachings laid down by Christ in this Sermon on the Mount, we shall have solved the problems not only of our countries but those of the whole world."

No, it's not a joke!

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Yes! The probabilistic certainty of life on other planets is a given. The probabilistic certainty that no other intelligent life forms have ever visited this earth is also, a given. Ancient aliens is absurd, visiting aliens is absurd. That life exists on other planets in the universe is given.

We agree on ancient aliens, but what fun is that?

but the existence of undetected aliens is a 'given' ? that's a lot of certainty for something without any empirical evidence!

I don't think it's impossible, but the universe would probably have to be way bigger to make another Earth probable

 

[FunctionalAtheist]

We agree on ancient aliens, but what fun is that?

but the existence of undetected aliens is a 'given' ? that's a lot of certainty for something without any empirical evidence!

I don't think it's impossible, but the universe would probably have to be way bigger to make another Earth probable

That's why I said probabilistic. We know that life has originated at least once and we know there are literally trillions of other solar systems which could provide billions of opportunities for life to originate elsewhere. Given the expansive nature it's no surprise that with ears pointed everywhere we don't hear anything. Even traveling at the speed of light we'd never be able to reach most of the universe, much less the speed of sound.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

That's why I said probabilistic. We know that life has originated at least once and we know there are literally trillions of other solar systems which could provide billions of opportunities for life to originate elsewhere. Given the expansive nature it's no surprise that with ears pointed everywhere we don't hear anything. Even traveling at the speed of light we'd never be able to reach most of the universe, much less the speed of sound.

There are Billions of people on the planet, - so what's the probability someone is just like you?

All of us only need a short list of mundane idiosyncrasies to identify as utterly unique, because each improbability compounds the others into very large numbers very quickly

The list of idiosyncrasies that make complex life even possible, far less one sentient being like us (out of millions on this hospitable planet that are not), is neither short nor mundane.

i.e. the number of solar systems is only one side of the equation, the other side keeps getting bigger, the more we learn

 

[FunctionalAtheist]

There are Billions of people on the planet, - so what's the probability someone is just like you?

All of us only need a short list of mundane idiosyncrasies to identify as utterly unique, because each improbability compounds the others into very large numbers very quickly

The list of idiosyncrasies that make complex life even possible, far less one sentient being like us (out of millions on this hospitable planet that are not), is neither short nor mundane.

i.e. the number of solar systems is only one side of the equation, the other side keeps getting bigger, the more we learn

Em, we don't need an earth just like this one to have life. It could be unimaginably different.

 

[Guy Threepwood]

Em, we don't need an earth just like this one to have life. It could be unimaginably different.

"Life Jim, but not as we know it"... that's a great premise for a Sci Fi series,

but back in realty;

We have nearly 200 other 'worlds' in our solar system, representing a broad swath of every possible combination of habitat. In fact even many habitats on Earth surrounded by complex life, cannot even support adaptations of it, far less generate their own.

Remember that the universe all came from the same place, and hence is made of the same stuff. The great fusion reactors we know as stars, produce specific elements inherent to the universal constants and life,.

Of course we can't technically rule out anything else, but we cannot assume 'anything else' as default truth either can we?

 

[Milton Platt]

Because the wisdom of the counsel it gives for Christians, reveals it's origin to be from a Higher Source.

As Mahatma Gandhi said to the British Viceroy of India, Lord Irwin:
"When your country and mine shall get together on the teachings laid down by Christ in this Sermon on the Mount, we shall have solved the problems not only of our countries but those of the whole world."

No, it's not a joke!

I believe he is also credited with saying "I like your Christ, but your Christians, not so much".

But my point was that you have no way of knowing what the ultimate goal is.......that is the point. it does not matter what is in the book per se......You have to know WHY it is in the book. And you cannot point to anything in the book itself as a proof of what the ultimate plans of an omnipotent omniscient being are. In other words, you need some form of definite outside confirmation of the being's nature and a way to definitively know his ultimate intent. It is irrational to say that a being is omniscient and omnipotent and then day that it is not possible for that being to deceive you.

 

[Milton Platt]

"Life Jim, but not as we know it"... that's a great premise for a Sci Fi series,

but back in realty;

We have nearly 200 other 'worlds' in our solar system, representing a broad swath of every possible combination of habitat. In fact even many habitats on Earth surrounded by complex life, cannot even support adaptations of it, far less generate their own.

Remember that the universe all came from the same place, and hence is made of the same stuff. The great fusion reactors we know as stars, produce specific elements inherent to the universal constants and life,.

Of course we can't technically rule out anything else, but we cannot assume 'anything else' as default truth either can we?

How do you know the solar system represents every possible combination of habitat? How do you know life can only exist in the forms and manner you are aware of?

 

[Guy Threepwood]

How do you know the solar system represents every possible combination of habitat? How do you know life can only exist in the forms and manner you are aware of?

I don't know. Do you know that there are other totally different habitats that support complex sentient life?

But we do have most possible habitats them right here in our solar system- most are too hot or cold or unstable, no atmosphere, no rotating core, magnetic shielding, no stabilizing satellite, not enough water, stable crust, just to scratch the surface, science continually learns how amazingly special and specifically designed for life Earth is.

Aliens seems intuitive I know, in days of old we traveled to exotic locations and found exotic people, and in those days of Verne and Poe, we debated what sort of folks inhabited the moon... because we found people everywhere else

But our knowledge has come a long way since then, there are very good reasons other planets are devoid of even the simplest life, it's extremely fickle relative to the excruciatingly narrow set of required parameters

 

[Milton Platt]

How do you know the solar system represents every possible combination of habitat? How do you know life can only exist in the forms and manner you are aware of?

Didn't say I did. But you seemed to imply that you did.

 

[Bird123]

I must point out that the supernatural cannot be detected or measured. However, if the supernatural interacts with the natural, then we can at least scientifically measure the effects. so far, the results have shown no measurable presence of supernatural intervention. Therefore, the logical thing to do is assume that there is no such interaction until proven otherwise under properly controlled testing. Without such interaction, the supernatural can be treated the same as if it does not exist, even if it does because it has virtually no impact on reality. A god that does not measurably interact with our reality is the same as a non-existent god.

You say that gods actions can be seen. How do you scientifically confirm an action was caused by a deity? I see no way of doing so. Just seeing something and attributing it to a deity's actions won't do. That's merely an opinion and has no legs.

Do you search to know or do you search for an excuse not to know? Perhaps, if one assumes that God could exist then starts putting some of the pieces of the puzzle together one might actually bump into God thereby Discovering the proof one is supposedly after. If one is going to learn how to swim, one must stick their toe in the water.

As I see it, to Discover the Real Truth, one must be open to all possibilities, even those one might not agree with. Real Truth is never always agreeable. Understanding is.

 

[Bird123]

To me the 'good news' of Matthew 24:14 is for everyone. Not bad news.
When we pick up the morning paper we read about the 'bad news' of men's kingdoms or governments.
When we pick up the teachings of Christ we read about the 'good news' of God's kingdom government.
Christians do Not impute bad or wrong motives to others, but proclaim the good news to everyone that God's kingdom is in the hands of Christ Jesus, with Jesus as King of God's Kingdom government, who will usher in global Peace on Earth among persons of goodwill. What is hate filled about that there will be healing for earth's nations according to Revelation 22:2.

Intelligence wins in the end, not Might. I have seen many people hurt by Christianity. I bet you know a few too. As I see it, A Higher Level is needed.

 

[Bird123]

You're Not alone in seeing religion as obsolete. I find religious ' waters ' (people) are already drying up spiritually.
Besides secular knowledge growing in leaps and bounds, so is Bible knowledge in that people can quickly travel to-and-fro through the pages of Scripture as never before in history. Although the Bible is Not written ABC as a dictionary is, a comprehensive concordance opens the way to serve as a quick reference locator in finding verses on the same topic or subject thus making it possible to start to discover what the Bible really teaches, and Discover God and a Higher Level.

No need to see that 'in the distant future' man will find religion as obsolete because soon ' they ' (powers that be) will be saying, " Peace and Security " as a precursor to the time when the United Nations surprisingly turns on religion.
The U.N. already sees a hauntingly dangerous religious climate brewing in today's world, and with backing the U.N. can be strengthened to turn on trouble-causing religions. Even a bad economy can make the wealth the religions have amassed look easy for the taking. Since compromising Christendom falsely claims to follow the God of the Bible then ' house ' cleaning will start with the 'powers that be' turning first on troublesome Christendom.

As I see it, religion will not become obsolete through the UN. This will come from the people themselves.

 

[Bird123]

In my mind what Jesus' taught was his beliefs. So, by discovering what Jesus' believed is discovering the facts about the Bible.
Jesus used logical reasoning on the old Hebrew Scriptures as the basis for his beliefs, his teachings.
That means to me, that Jesus did Not believe in credulity ( blind belief or blind faith ) but on written biblical truths.
To me, that is why Jesus' taught that Scripture is religious truth (fact) at John 17:17.
So, perhaps instead of saying ' Not the Beliefs ' in connection to advancement reward something else comes to mind.

I stick to my original statement. You can't assume truth simply because it comes from your holy book. The advancement reward is also not a Belief.

 

[Murad]

It seems most people I know pray for World Peace. They tell me that is what God wants. I don't see it.



As I see it, life is the education of God's children. So often that takes adversity, challenges, and interaction to advance the lessons. The resolution of conflict always brings education of some sort.



Having peace and having it made seems to be a default desire of most people. On the other hand, as I see it, God's goal is the education of God's children. Peace will only arrive after all the lessons are learned.

What do you think??

I think, it's better to think that , the life is just a test for doing the righteous, and for that we got ability to take decisions and choices. and we are who choose how the life will be

 

[Milton Platt]

Do you search to know or do you search for an excuse not to know? Perhaps, if one assumes that God could exist then starts putting some of the pieces of the puzzle together one might actually bump into God thereby Discovering the proof one is supposedly after. If one is going to learn how to swim, one must stick their toe in the water.

As I see it, to Discover the Real Truth, one must be open to all possibilities, even those one might not agree with. Real Truth is never always agreeable. Understanding is.

I search for that which can be demonstrated to be true.
I am open to the possibility of a god, but the probability seems almost nil. There is nothing so far that we have come to understand that has turned out to have a supernatural origin. Of course if we could measure something that was supposedly supernatural, it would then no longer be supernatural, but a part of the natural. If however the supernatural does interact with the natural, then we should be able to measure and quantify the results of that interaction. So far as I know there have been no studies which have detected that such an interaction takes place. If there is no interaction between the supposed supernatural and natural, then if the supernatural exists, it is irrelevant. I remain open and curious, but withhold belief in the absence of evidence,

 

[Milton Platt]

I think, it's better to think that , the life is just a test for doing the righteous, and for that we got ability to take decisions and choices. and we are who choose how the life will be

That seems a simplistic view of life. How one's life turns out is as much an accident of birth as it is due to any subsequent decisions one may make. Also, the decisions of other people, most of whom we may never even meet, can influence our lives.

 

[FunctionalAtheist]

"Life Jim, but not as we know it"... that's a great premise for a Sci Fi series,

but back in realty;

We have nearly 200 other 'worlds' in our solar system, representing a broad swath of every possible combination of habitat. In fact even many habitats on Earth surrounded by complex life, cannot even support adaptations of it, far less generate their own.

Remember that the universe all came from the same place, and hence is made of the same stuff. The great fusion reactors we know as stars, produce specific elements inherent to the universal constants and life,.

So you're arguing that everywhere in the universe is made of the same stuff, and this would somehow be an argument....AGAINST...life elsewhere????

Of course we can't technically rule out anything else, but we cannot assume 'anything else' as default truth either can we?

Sure, our whole philosophy of science and experiential knowledge is based on the assumption that reality is basically as it appears to be, operates in a consistently describable manner, and is knowable through inferences based on our sensory experiences.

Of course, we can't rule out that we live in a matrix, unless we make these assumptions.

 

[Bird123]

I think, it's better to think that , the life is just a test for doing the righteous, and for that we got ability to take decisions and choices. and we are who choose how the life will be

Yes, with that in mind, sometimes one can be their own worse enemy. Many don't even realize that. Still, it all works out in the end when those choices return to teach.

 

[Bird123]

I search for that which can be demonstrated to be true.
I am open to the possibility of a god, but the probability seems almost nil. There is nothing so far that we have come to understand that has turned out to have a supernatural origin. Of course if we could measure something that was supposedly supernatural, it would then no longer be supernatural, but a part of the natural. If however the supernatural does interact with the natural, then we should be able to measure and quantify the results of that interaction. So far as I know there have been no studies which have detected that such an interaction takes place. If there is no interaction between the supposed supernatural and natural, then if the supernatural exists, it is irrelevant. I remain open and curious, but withhold belief in the absence of evidence,

How about this? Forget everything you know about religion and God. Look at the universe around you. Figure out why the way it's being done is the Best way. The human factor will have many more variables. Put the pieces together with an open mind and see what you Discover. Is there Method to the madness???

Hanging onto terms like supernatural draw your view from what actually is. If I were to fly an airplane 2000 years ago, I would be supernatural to many.

My Best advice is to Be Who you Must. As I see it. It is a part of the Plan.

I find very few who really want to Discover God. It really doesn't matter. I think it is only important to make our own choices. As I see it. Life's lessons are best learned that way.