What is your position in the Political Spectrum?

[Rainbow Mage]

Capitalism should seem a great evil to any Christian I would think, given all that Jesus said about rich and poor. The gospels arguably support wealth distribution, while Acts definitely does. It portrays the early church as a communal system.

 

[Phil25]

I am using logic and rationality and that's why I'm advocating this society model. It is the capitalistic model that is outdated and irrational. Who said it was a utopia? There would still be problems but it would be great human achievement. Lots better than the inequality that goes on now.

Humans are affected by their environment. Because our society is scarcity driven, people want wealth as security and hoard because they are scared.

A non-consumerist lifestyle doesn't mean to live like 10,000 years ago. I'd argue life would be much better under the post-scarcity, scientifically advanced society that I'm proposing as an alternative. To live in harmony with nature isn't nearly as hard. We have a lot of free, clean, unlimited energy sources for example.

You just made up a bunch of strawmans and presumed things about human nature which are very much debated and regarded as outdated 50s mindset views.

Ok so you are Anti Capitalist, so I presume that you are communist/socialist.

 

[illykitty]

Ok so you are Anti Capitalist, so I presume that you are communist/socialist.

Yes I am anti-capitalist but I advocate a resource-based economy and afaik, neither communism nor socialism talk about it.

 

[Phil25]

Yes I am anti-capitalist but I advocate a resource-based economy and afaik, neither communism nor socialism talk about it.

What do you mean by resource based economy, like sustainable development, like everyone has equal amount of income, like a janitor and a engineer gets equal income

 

[illykitty]

What do you mean by resource based economy, like sustainable development, like everyone has equal amount of income, like a janitor and a engineer gets equal income

Well there would be no income, everyone would have food, housing, education, etc. and resource based economy means that you manage the resources of the Earth in an intelligent scientific manner so that you don't run out by overusing them. You also create an abundance of things we can control, like food.

Ideally though, you would replace all boring, dangerous and non fulfilling jobs with automation.

Btw, I'm not saying I'd want to implement this NOW, but transition towards it.

 

[Phil25]

Well there would be no income, everyone would have food, housing, education, etc. and resource based economy means that you manage the resources of the Earth in an intelligent scientific manner so that you don't run out by overusing them. You also create an abundance of things we can control, like food.

Ideally though, you would replace all boring, dangerous and non fulfilling jobs with automation.

Btw, I'm not saying I'd want to implement this NOW, but transition towards it.

OK let me ask you a question, why would I wanna become a surgeon, working hard all the way through med school, when I see the janitor, who flunked in school, getting the same facilities and comfort as me.
In short I am not getting the fruits of my hard work.

 

[MD]

OK let me ask you a question, why would I wanna become a surgeon, working hard all the way through med school, when I see the janitor, who flunked in school, getting the same facilities and comfort as me.
In short I am not getting the fruits of my hard work.

This^

 

[Tarheeler]

Ok so you are Anti Capitalist, so I presume that you are communist/socialist.

OK let me ask you a question, why would I wanna become a surgeon, working hard all the way through med school, when I see the janitor, who flunked in school, getting the same facilities and comfort as me.
In short I am not getting the fruits of my hard work.

Is that really what you think communism and socialism (which are two different and distinct ideologies) are?
If so, your teachers are doing you a great disservice.

 

[Phil25]

Is that really what you think communism and socialism (which are two different and distinct ideologies) are?
If so, your teachers are doing you a great disservice.

Communism and Socialism are closer to each other than they are to Capitalism.

 

[illykitty]

OK let me ask you a question, why would I wanna become a surgeon, working hard all the way through med school, when I see the janitor, who flunked in school, getting the same facilities and comfort as me.
In short I am not getting the fruits of my hard work.

Because in that type of society

1- if implemented down the road someday, I imagine janitors won't exist (automation + materials that are resistant to dirt + other tech)
2- under that type of society people would do things because they are passionate about it, to save lives, to contribute
3- we would all become lifelong learners, pursuing what we love

I recommend you watch this video about human motivation:

[youtube]u6XAPnuFjJc[/youtube]

It dispels a lot of old outdated ideas about humans.

 

[Tarheeler]

Communism and Socialism are closer to each other than they are to Capitalism.

Completely irrelevant and has nothing to do with your previous post.
Do you understand what those two ideologies entail?

 

[Phil25]

Completely irrelevant and has nothing to do with your previous post.
Do you understand what those two ideologies entail?

As you seem to have a PhD in communism or socialism, I request you oh Guru to tell me the difference

 

[Phil25]

Because in that type of society

1- if implemented down the road someday, I imagine janitors won't exist (automation + materials that are resistant to dirt + other tech)
2- under that type of society people would do things because they are passionate about it, to save lives, to contribute
3- we would all become lifelong learners, pursuing what we love

I recommend you watch this video about human motivation:

[youtube]u6XAPnuFjJc[/youtube]

It dispels a lot of old outdated ideas about humans.

This is what is known as a utopian society, everyone, all 7 billion of us, works for common good.Impossibe but I recommend you to write a book about your views. It would be a bestseller(Maybe)

 

[sun rise]

This is what is known as a utopian society, everyone, all 7 billion of us, works for common good.Impossibe but I recommend you to write a book about your views. It would be a bestseller(Maybe)

The entire presentation was about what science is showing about human motivation. And it included that money was a motivator for routine unthinking jobs. Whether you can cause all jobs to be of the kind where purpose is motivating is utopian. But we're far from implementing the science.

 

[Phil25]

It appears you're dismissing science because you don't agree with the conclusion. Because the entire presentation was about what science is showing about human motivation.

I was talking about the three statements by the poster and not the video.

 

[Phil25]

http:// http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=B3u4EFTwprM&feature=kp
This is a good video about Capitalism, Socialism and Communism by CrashCourse World History. It sums most of my ideas in 14 minutes.

 

[MD]

The entire presentation was about what science is showing about human motivation. And it included that money was a motivator for routine unthinking jobs. Whether you can cause all jobs to be of the kind where purpose is motivating is utopian. But we're far from implementing the science.

I'm not going to watch the video because I don't want to waste 11 min of my life but to say that 'science' says something is laughable as an argument because noone has examined the studies and how they were conducted and applied in the video. There are factors which affect how a study is run, how the subjects are chosen, etc. There is very rarely if ever, no bias in studies.

Science says that the strong survive and the weak die. Science says that people are selfish and altruistic. Science says that being really religious is evolutionarily advantageous as is being critical. Science says that psychopathy and empathy both are advantageous. The point is science says a lot of things and you can't apply them generally to people.

But what I do know is that the world is unfair, and the strong survive and win. Suffering makes you strong and stress pushes you way more than 'the pursuit of knowledge' ever will.

 

[Phil25]

I'm not going to watch the video because I don't want to waste 11 min of my life but to say that 'science' says something is laughable as an argument because noone has examined the studies and how they were conducted and applied in the video. There are factors which affect how a study is run, how the subjects are chosen, etc. There is very rarely if ever, no bias in studies.

Science says that the strong survive and the weak die. Science says that people are selfish and altruistic. Science says that being really religious is evolutionarily advantageous as is being critical. Science says that psychopathy and empathy both are advantageous. The point is science says a lot of things and you can't apply them generally to people.

But what I do know is that the world is unfair, and the strong survive and win. Suffering makes you strong and stress pushes you way more than 'the pursuit of knowledge' ever will.

Correct, you stole my words.

 

[Sunstone]

OK let me ask you a question, why would I wanna become a surgeon, working hard all the way through med school, when I see the janitor, who flunked in school, getting the same facilities and comfort as me.
In short I am not getting the fruits of my hard work.

Let me see if I can figure out how the Janitor's success negatively impacts your own... Are you somehow reasoning that if a janitor gets paid a dollar, and you get paid a dollar, your dollar has less value because the janitor''s got a dollar? If so, that's one peculiar economic theory you've got going there.

 

[Phil25]

Let me see if I can figure out how the Janitor's success negatively impacts your own... Are you somehow reasoning that if a janitor gets paid a dollar, and you get paid a dollar, your dollar has less value because the janitor''s got a dollar? If so, that's one peculiar economic theory you've got going there.

Not everyone becomes doctor because they want to help. Many become doctor for the paycheck it offers and because they like Biology. And becoming a doctor is easiar said than being done. It.requires more than 10 years of hardwork and sleepless nights. And when I see that guy who always flunked becoming a janitor and I see he is having the benefits, facilities and comfort as me, I would think why, why I did all this.hard work and that guy practically did nothing and we have the same everything. Isnt that inequality? The hardworkers and lazy, the smart and not smart have the same everything. Whats the point of Hardwork? Humans at least most are selfish at least to some extent.