How do I know that your God is The One, True God?

[crossfire]

Well, I'm still confused. Sorry.

Well, if you are looking for God, and you know that hatred does not overcome hatred, then looking for an absence of hatred would be a good place to start, no?
What overcomes greed, hatred, and delusion? That's a good place to start, imo.

 

[Quintessence]

I think the OP is trying to assume that theists believe that only their God is the one who exists and all others false. But, with the exception of a few religions, that isn't really the case. Mostly it is true of the Religions of Abraham- because it is an integral part of the faith for there to be only one God.

That's how it struck me too. An understandable mistake, given how loudmouthed the "One True God" minority sometimes is. There is a difference in knowing for oneself and knowing for some Ultimate Answer. For those who do not believe in some Ultimate Answer, there is only knowing for oneself, and there is no answering "how does someone else know that my gods are true" other than "you have to find out for yourself."

 

[Kir Komrik]

How do I know that you don't pay attention to who you reply to?

I'm seriously recommending you stop because you're basically trolling at this point and no one is biting. It would be awesome for you to hang out and debate here, but you've set up a strawman that no one is biting on.

What are you so angry about?

 

[Drolefille]

Well, I thought it would be self-evident in the question, but maybe not. That may be because storm doesn't trust my motives. But when asking this question it is being asked in the context of a lifelong atheist who is asking about religions and who or what god is. In particular, how do I know the real McCoy? So, it would be understood that the only degree of certainty I'm looking for is that confidence level sufficient to dedicate my life to the worship of that god. That is pretty high but hardly absolute.

The second question in this reply anyway, is what do you mean by "gotcha"? If someone ends up reaching a different conclusion but their motives are sincere, how can you fault that? Furthermore, can you really know my motives? I doubt it. Storm started in immediatley with sarcasm, so there is no way she could know if my overall motives were sincere. I would think that the motive is what should matter and one can only know that by how one carries themselves (is civil, for starters).

When one lists oneself as an evangelical atheist and sets up a nice strawman in their post, one's motives appear to be fairly transparent. Or you just have the worst luck in the world.

I can't know your motives, but I'm comfortable with my deduction.

 

[Kir Komrik]

I think the OP is trying to assume that theists believe that only their God is the one who exists and all others false. But, with the exception of a few religions, that isn't really the case. Mostly it is true of the Religions of Abraham- because it is an integral part of the faith for there to be only one God.

At the same time, even the religions of Abraham can stray from that. I am not saying I believe there to be more than one God- I am saying that the God of my religion/faith may very well be the same God as other faiths.

But, as I said in my other post, there is really no way of knowing.

I think the OP is trying to assume that theists believe that only their God is the one who exists and all others false

Not exactly. Its in the context. I'm asking this because I'm trying to find out in which god I am to invest. It's just that simple. If it isn't knowable I'd be quite reticent to commit my life to any god for fear that almost certainly, with all the choices available, it would be an imposter. So, in this context, I would think this is a perfectly reasonable question.

 

[Drolefille]

Not exactly. Its in the context. I'm asking this because I'm trying to find out in which god I am to invest. It's just that simple. If it isn't knowable I'd be quite reticent to commit my life to any god for fear that almost certainly, with all the choices available, it would be an imposter. So, in this context, I would think this is a perfectly reasonable question.

This forum has a wide variety of religious and a-religious people.

Again, you're coming off as disingenuous.

 

[sandandfoam]

Then what would that imply for a sincere, seeking atheist? How would they ever get an answer? The cart cannot come before the horse, can it? It's not a "gotcha", its just a question.

I was for many years a sincere atheist.
I remain skeptical of many things. I have been deeply influenced by postmodern thought and I don't believe in hard facts.
We can never really know anything - we do the best with what we have. I am not driven by a desire to convince anyone else of my views. My reality is my own and what I want to do is feel as if I am authentic to whatever it is that I am. My faith helps with this. That's just the way it is.

 

[Kir Komrik]

When one lists oneself as an evangelical atheist and sets up a nice strawman in their post, one's motives appear to be fairly transparent. Or you just have the worst luck in the world.

I can't know your motives, but I'm comfortable with my deduction.

So, you're angry that I'm an evangelical atheist? And how can a question be a "straw man" argument?

 

[Kir Komrik]

That's how it struck me too. An understandable mistake, given how loudmouthed the "One True God" minority sometimes is. There is a difference in knowing for oneself and knowing for some Ultimate Answer. For those who do not believe in some Ultimate Answer, there is only knowing for oneself, and there is no answering "how does someone else know that my gods are true" other than "you have to find out for yourself."

But its wrong. I'm simply asking, how do I know that your god is The One, True God? If I don't ask it the same way I know I'll get just as many different answers, which doesn't help me at all.

 

[Drolefille]

What are you so angry about?

So you have decided I'm angry because I have made a serious suggestion to you?

Again, you add evidence that you don't expect a serious discussion as you have attacked two people by dismissing them as angry rather than responding to the content of the posts.

You're begging the question, btw.

 

[Quintessence]

Well, I thought it would be self-evident in the question, but maybe not. That may be because storm doesn't trust my motives. But when asking this question it is being asked in the context of a lifelong atheist who is asking about religions and who or what god is. In particular, how do I know the real McCoy? So, it would be understood that the only degree of certainty I'm looking for is that confidence level sufficient to dedicate my life to the worship of that god. That is pretty high but hardly absolute.

One need not dedicate one's life to honoring the gods. I'd hazard to say that few theists do that outside of, say, the cloisters, clergy, and academics. Everyday Joe Schmoe doesn't need a high certainty, as the time investment they put into honoring the gods is probably pretty minimal. Modern folks are far more concerned about paying the bills and feeding themselves or the kids. Just something to think about. Certainty may be less important than answering yes to the question "does this belief/way enrich my life in a positive fashion." Knowing something is "the real McCoy" can be unimportant. This is another reason your question is difficult for many theists.

The second question in this reply anyway, is what do you mean by "gotcha"?

Oh, we get newcomers here from time to time asking questions with flawed premises in a vain attempt to belittle theists. How you're responding is unfortunately similar enough to them that you're getting lumped in with the demographic. Me? I prefer to not assume someone's motives until they go out of their way to prove to me that they're a dick.

 

[Drolefille]

So, you're angry that I'm an evangelical atheist? And how can a question be a "straw man" argument?

I'm not angry at all. I think you're trolling. You seem to equate the two.

 

[Drolefille]

But its wrong. I'm simply asking, how do I know that your god is The One, True God? If I don't ask it the same way I know I'll get just as many different answers, which doesn't help me at all.

You assume monotheism.

This would be the strawman part.

 

[Quintessence]

You assume monotheism.

This would be the strawman part.

And exclusivism. Don't forget that part.

(typically part and parcel with classical monotheism, but not always)

 

[Drolefille]

And exclusivism. Don't forget that part.

(typically part and parcel with classical monotheism, but not always)

Right, yes I was thinking traditional monotheism and not henotheism (I think that's the right word.)

 

[Tarheeler]

And exclusivism. Don't forget that part.

(typically part and parcel with classical monotheism, but not always)

That's the part that irritates me the most.

 

[Kir Komrik]

So you have decided I'm angry because I have made a serious suggestion to you?

No, because your statement implies you should be hostile or unreceptive to someone just because they are an evangelical atheist and because they are "making straw man questions", whatever that means. Why?

Again, you add evidence that you don't expect a serious discussion as you have attacked two people by dismissing them as angry rather than responding to the content of the posts.

You're begging the question, btw.

But you are exhibiting anger. I'm not the one that's angry. You are. It's abundantly clear in your posts. How could anyone have missed that?

... add evidence ...

What evidence did I "add"? I asked one question. That's it.

 

[Quintessence]

That's the part that irritates me the most.

Ditto. Especially when well-done surveys by groups like PEW indicate that most monotheists (at least in America where the survey was conducted) are not actually exclusivists.

 

[Kir Komrik]

You assume monotheism.
This would be the strawman part.

Didn't we already have that discussion? What did I say about other gods? Groups of gods?

 

[Quintessence]

Didn't we already have that discussion? What did I say about other gods? Groups of gods?

You said some things that didn't really make much sense to a polytheist, because it still had an exclusivist tone to it. Exclusivism is pretty much absent in polytheism; speaking of "true" gods to us is kind of elicits a "huh, what?" reaction.