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Did Jesus say he was God???

javajo

javajo

Well-Known Member
Shermana said:
Non trinitarian Translations of John 1:1

Yes, there is no indefinite article in Greek. But how we read it in English is different. Are you aware that there is a definite article almost every time before Theon or Theos in all other places? Do you know what Anarthrous means? There is a definite article however in 1:1b, and "Calwell's rule" is not really a rule but an opinion and one that has been quietly laid to rest by the recent Christian community once the scholars exposed all the times it doesn't apply. Basically Calwell's "rule" was aimed squarely at John 1:1c, and ended up failing on every occasion where it was used elsewhere, thus the "rule" does not apply.

You do not understand what Polytheism actually is. Who is the "god of this age" in 2 Corinthians 4:4? Polytheism is the placing of multiple gods as the ultimate god.

The word "god" is used for Angels. What does John 10:34-35 say? Are you disagreeing with Jesus when he says that the Israelites themselves are called "gods"? What then of the Angels who are called "Heavenly Beings" and "Sons of G-d"? The word "god" means Angels in Psalms 136:2 and Psalms 86:1. This does not mean they are HIGHER than G-d the "god of the gods".


There is no god higher than god, that is the concept. Serving any god other than the Most high god (as he is called the "Most high god" for a reason) lies in the sin. Not the acceptance of the existence of beings known as "Elohim".

Do you think the NLT's translation of 2 Cor 4:4 is incorrect?

The word "god" is the problem, and understanding its use as a nominative or possessive becomes tricky for those who don't understand what "Monotheism" actually means.

Judaism, as many schoalrs admit, is more HENOtheistic than Monotheistic. We accept the EXISTENCE of other beings called "gods", just as Paul says there are beings called "gods and lords", but they are not THE god and lord, which is what the Definite article is used for in most cases. (There are exceptions). This shows up in Hebrew at times with "Ha" such as "Elohei ha-elohim" where unlike the Greek, it is used to signify the actual plural (as opposed to the majestic plural singular use of Elohim).

And going by the Syriac Pe****ta, 1:1c uses "Eloah" which is the Singular, but "Elohim" in 1:1b.

Also, it helps to have a working understanding of Philo's "Logos Theology" which every Anatolian Jew back in the day was well familar with. "Firstborn among Creation".
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If you want to believe Jesus is 'a' god and not God Incarnate, knock yourself out. I will stick with him being my Lord and my God.
 
Muffled

Muffled

Jesus in me
sandy whitelinger said:
Has anyone read all 3,686 posts?
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I have endeavered to keep up with my post and respond but I do tend to avoid things that are off topic from the OP. I think it is too much to ask for someone to read them all if they are coming into the conversation late but I don't mind answering the same questions that I have answered before.
 
Muffled

Muffled

Jesus in me
Shermana said:
I call Shenanigans, you are blaspheming the Holy Spirit by using it as the base of your argument and lying about it. I know for a fact you did not get your interpretation from the Holy Spirit, and I risk blaspheming it by calling you out if such an accusation is wrong, which its not. One of us is blaspheming it. For the sake of your soul I highly recommend you repent of using the "Holy Spirit" defense as your justification instead of logically resolving the problems. I can promise as sure as G-d lives that G-d did not give you the interpretation you claim to have, and that he does not approve of you claiming your answer comes from the Spirit. It appears that you consider any differing interpretation from your own to be "Private" and thus yours isn't private because you think you have been Supernaturally blessed. I can tell you now, when Peter said "be ready to have an answer" he didn't mean "Tell them that the Spirit told you!"

I know for a fact you did not get your answer from G-d, and I will risk his wrath if I'm wrong, which I know I'm not.
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I'm not angry with you.

That was Jesus speaking directly to you instead of developing the ideas through my mind. You claim to know but you have no basis for your claim.
 
Muffled

Muffled

Jesus in me
arimoff said:
loooooool, firt of all, I don't think there is a direct prove of her being the direct seed of David. If G-D is the father but G-D is not of the seed of David, for those who don't know Jewish seed and tribe is passed trough the father, but being Jewish or not through the mother.

Now what do you mean to fulfill the prophecy? if G-D creates prophecy then what does it cost Him to create it saying you will have a savior my son? and there is no more need for Marry.

That prophecy is exactly made for people like you and Jesus, the self called saviors!!!
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What man doesn't know God does know.
Luke 18: 39 And they that went before rebuked him, that he should hold his peace: but he cried out the more a great deal, Thou son of David, have mercy on me.
40 And Jesus stood, and commanded him to be brought unto him: and when he was come near, he asked him,
41 What wilt thou that I should do unto thee? And he said, Lord, that I may receive my sight.
Jesus accepted the title "Son of David."

That matters not at all because Jesus is a descendant of David through Mary and that is what seed means.

I think what you are asking is why did God bother to do it this way instead of just appearing in adult form. My answer to that is there wouldn't be any sign accompanying an imediate appearance. With Mary the sign is that of a virgin bearing a son. Starngely enough people had trouble recognizing God in Jesus even with the signs (and still do), so it would be even more unlikely that people would recognize God without them. Abraham did but Abraham had a good ongoing relationship with God.

PS The post that I am rsponding to here is from page 187.


 
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M

Mark2020

Well-Known Member
Have you noticed this too:

Revelation 7:17
For the Lamb at the center of the throne will be their shepherd; he will lead them to springs of living water. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes."

Who is the Lamb?
 
waitasec

waitasec

Veteran Member
Shermana said:
I call Shenanigans, you are blaspheming the Holy Spirit by using it as the base of your argument and lying about it. I know for a fact you did not get your interpretation from the Holy Spirit, and I risk blaspheming it by calling you out if such an accusation is wrong, which its not. One of us is blaspheming it. For the sake of your soul I highly recommend you repent of using the "Holy Spirit" defense as your justification instead of logically resolving the problems. I can promise as sure as G-d lives that G-d did not give you the interpretation you claim to have, and that he does not approve of you claiming your answer comes from the Spirit. It appears that you consider any differing interpretation from your own to be "Private" and thus yours isn't private because you think you have been Supernaturally blessed. I can tell you now, when Peter said "be ready to have an answer" he didn't mean "Tell them that the Spirit told you!"

I know for a fact you did not get your answer from G-d, and I will risk his wrath if I'm wrong, which I know I'm not.
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Muffled said:
I'm not angry with you.

That was Jesus speaking directly to you instead of developing the ideas through my mind. You claim to know but you have no basis for your claim.
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and this is how religion unties people...
:sarcastic
 
Shermana

Shermana

Heretic
Muffled said:
I'm not angry with you.

That was Jesus speaking directly to you instead of developing the ideas through my mind. You claim to know but you have no basis for your claim.
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Hold on here, the guy telling me that the Spirit gives him his answers in lieu of evidence and argument is telling me I have no basis for my claim?

The basis for my claim is the evidence and scholarly argument. Your basis is.....nothing.
 
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InChrist

InChrist

Free4ever
[FONT=&quot]The verses below also show that Jesus Christ, the Lamb, is God.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]But I saw no temple in it, for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple. The city had no need of the sun or of the moon to shine in it for the glory of God illuminated it. The Lamb is its light. Rev.21:22-23[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]There shall be no night there: They need no lamp nor light of the sun, for the Lord God gives them light…Rev.22:5[/FONT]
 
idav

idav

Being
Premium Member
InChrist said:
[FONT=&quot]The verses below also show that Jesus Christ, the Lamb, is God.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]But I saw no temple in it, for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple. The city had no need of the sun or of the moon to shine in it for the glory of God illuminated it. The Lamb is its light. Rev.21:22-23[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]There shall be no night there: They need no lamp nor light of the sun, for the Lord God gives them light…Rev.22:5[/FONT]
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At that point God the father is still the light and the lamb is merely the representation of the source. The lamb is not the source.
 
M

Mark2020

Well-Known Member
InChrist said:
[FONT=&quot]The verses below also show that Jesus Christ, the Lamb, is God.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]But I saw no temple in it, for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple. The city had no need of the sun or of the moon to shine in it for the glory of God illuminated it. The Lamb is its light. Rev.21:22-23[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]There shall be no night there: They need no lamp nor light of the sun, for the Lord God gives them light…Rev.22:5[/FONT]
Click to expand...

More accurately from the NIV:
23 The city does not need the sun or the moon to shine on it, for the glory of God gives it light, and the Lamb is its lamp.

The Lamb is Jesus Christ, who is at the center of the throne.

Revelation 7:17
For the Lamb at the center of the throne will be their shepherd; he will lead them to springs of living water. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes."
 
P

Protester

Active Member
Muffled said:
I, Jesus am the ultimate authority in all things.
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2 Timothy 3
16 All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;
17 that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work.
4:1 I solemnly charge you in the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead, and by His appearing and His kingdom:
2 preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort, with great patience and instruction.
3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but wanting to have their ears tickled, they will accumulate for themselves teachers in accordance to their own desires;
4 and will turn away their ears from the truth, and will turn aside to myths.---Scripture Quotations Taken from the NASB

What is sola scriptura?


Unless therefore I am convinced by the testimony of Scripture, or by the clearest reasoning, unless I am persuaded by means of the passages I have quoted, and unless they thus render my conscience bound by the Word of God, I cannot and will not retract, for it is unsafe for a Christian to speak against his conscience. Here I stand, I can do no other; may God help me! Amen! ---Martin Luther
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U

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
Mark2020 said:
More accurately from the NIV:
23 The city does not need the sun or the moon to shine on it, for the glory of God gives it light, and the Lamb is its lamp.
The Lamb is Jesus Christ, who is at the center of the throne.
Revelation 7:17
For the Lamb at the center of the throne will be their shepherd; he will lead them to springs of living water. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes."
Click to expand...

How many thrones are mentioned at: Revelation 3v21?______
Who are the thrones for?
 
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