Is it okay to kill this?

[Just_me_Mike]

OK Mestemia, I will try to answer your original question to me. Where is the line.

I think for me it is probably when growth begins. For example, the eggs by themselves, and the sperm by themselves are not a baby. However when two people decide to chance for the joining to take place and chance a growing baby, they have crossed the line as to what is a baby and what is not a baby. If growth begins it is too late.

Anyway, that is how I feel right now, however, I would never impose my beliefs on anyone, but you asked my personal opinion, so there it is.

 

[McBell]

I think for me it is probably when growth begins. For example, the eggs by themselves, and the sperm by themselves are not a baby. However when two people decide to chance for the joining to take place and chance a growing baby, they have crossed the line as to what is a baby and what is not a baby. If growth begins it is too late.

So at conception, right?

Anyway, that is how I feel right now, however, I would never impose my beliefs on anyone, but you asked my personal opinion, so there it is.

Thank you for answering.

 

[dust1n]

Is that what abortion is about, woman's civil liberties? Seriously, I just haven't given it much thought.

No, just civil liberties in general?

 

[Just_me_Mike]

So at conception, right?


Thank you for answering.

If by conception you mean, that the day when the sperm and egg "join" and become something new, then yes conception would be correct for me.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

No, just civil liberties in general?

Well, I am not sure it is civil to terminate a life that has no choice in the matter, even if the host thinks otherwise. I think that is where the debate would be for me. Like I said, I haven't given it a whole lot of unbiased thought.

 

[McBell]

If by conception you mean, that the day when the sperm and egg "join" and become something new, then yes conception would be correct for me.

Yes, conception is when a sperm and an egg join and become a zygote.

 

[dust1n]

Well, I am not sure it is civil to terminate a life that has no choice in the matter, even if the host thinks otherwise. I think that is where the debate would be for me. Like I said, I haven't given it a whole lot of unbiased thought.

It's not actually a civil issue, it's a personal one. It may be uncivil to terminate a life, but it is entirely uncivil to dictate what one does with their body.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

It's not actually a civil issue, it's a personal one. It may be uncivil to terminate a life, but it is entirely uncivil to dictate what one does with their body.

So, the day the baby comes out of the womb, then it is a civil matter? Doesn't sound to right to me.

 

[dust1n]

So, the day the baby comes out of the womb, then it is a civil matter? Doesn't sound to right to me.

Right... something about declaring a being as independent on the market that they become physically detached from their creator (the one who actually suffers from the baby being alive carries the burden) just doesn't seem right, does it?

Yes.. civility is creating suffering for a being who can actually feel suffering because the being who has never processed a single thought is the true victim during an abortion.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

Right... something about declaring a being as independent on the market that they become physically detached from their creator (the one who actually suffers from the baby being alive carries the burden) just doesn't seem right, does it?

Yes.. civility is creating suffering for a being who can actually feel suffering because the being who has never processed a single thought is the true victim during an abortion.

On that note, abortion sounds more like a crock to me. To say the child has no rights, I guess seems kind of silly to me. The child should have equal rights to the mother. I don't see how to think of it another way. Maybe you can help me...

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I believe life begins at conception, so abortion is indeed killing a human life. I also believe that if you go through with an action then you should deal with any and all potential consequences.
But on the other hand, with a massively over populated planet and the potential cures from stem cell research, and a strong believe in personal choice, I do not think abortion should be illegal.

 

[Just_me_Mike]

I believe life begins at conception, so abortion is indeed killing a human life. I also believe that if you go through with an action then you should deal with any and all potential consequences.
But on the other hand, with a massively over populated planet and the potential cures from stem cell research, and a strong believe in personal choice, I do not think abortion should be illegal.

So one day it might be admirable for a mother to donate her baby to science before it is born? I can see that day approaching. Really, I think we are closer to that than many realize.

 

[McBell]

I believe life begins at conception, so abortion is indeed killing a human life. I also believe that if you go through with an action then you should deal with any and all potential consequences.
But on the other hand, with a massively over populated planet and the potential cures from stem cell research, and a strong believe in personal choice, I do not think abortion should be illegal.

Life began a long long time ago and is a continuous ongoing process.
Further, Life does not "begin" at conception.
It can't.
For if either the sperm or the egg is dead, there is no conception.


I agree with the rest.

 

[Kathryn]

Well, not having sex greatly reduces your chance of pregnancy, but even complete abstinence is not 100%.

I'd say that if two people are in such close physical proximity that sperm and egg unite - it's a stretch to say they are being 100% abstinate!

Reminds me of the illustrious Bill Clinton protesting that he "did not have sex with that woman!"

 

[dust1n]

On that note, abortion sounds more like a crock to me. To say the child has no rights, I guess seems kind of silly to me. The child should have equal rights to the mother. I don't see how to think of it another way. Maybe you can help me...

Most likely not, the situation is very clear to me. A pre-born being does not have equal rights to an actual independent being. This is clearly obvious as one has to be 18 before they can even vote.

 

[Kathryn]

People are so concerned about the mother's body and her rights to it (which in my opinion, she limited when she took part in voluntary actions that include the possibility of pregnancy which would then involve the rights of another person).

Why aren't these same people as concerned about a baby's body that is scalded, ripped apart, or stabbed - with NO anesthesia?

MY GOSH - where's the compassion and common sense???

 

[McBell]

I'd say that if two people are in such close physical proximity that sperm and egg unite - it's a stretch to say they are being 100% abstinate!

Reminds me of the illustrious Bill Clinton protesting that he "did not have sex with that woman!"

I completely agree.

So I wonder who the "Virgin" Mary was in "such close physical proximity that sperm and egg unite" with...

 

[dust1n]

So one day it might be admirable for a mother to donate her baby to science before it is born? I can see that day approaching. Really, I think we are closer to that than many realize.

It is illegal for a company to own a being, so unless one of the scientists is willing to take responsibility of the being and the consequences of doing so, than the transaction is entirely illegal. It very implausible that what you speak of will happen anytime soon.

 

[Kathryn]

Most likely not, the situation is very clear to me. A pre-born being does not have equal rights to an actual independent being. This is clearly obvious as one has to be 18 before they can even vote.

You mean I could have legally killed my kids when they were teenagers? SHEEZE, WHY DIDN'T SOMEONE TELL ME?

I mean, if you're talking about humanity being determined by the rights that the law imparts - let's kill anyone who medically can't drive. I mean, their rights are limited, right?

Euthenasia, anyone?

 

[McBell]

Why aren't these same people as concerned about a baby's body that is scalded, ripped apart, or stabbed - with NO anesthesia?

I am going to guess it is for the exact same reason right to lifers are no where to be found after the child is born...

Pre-birth - WE'RE BEHIND YOU100%!!
Pre-school - **** YOU! YOU"RE ON YOUR OWN!

MY GOSH - where's the compassion and common sense???

Again, I am going to say in the same place.....