I understand the importance of both scrupture and scholarship.
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wife beating in quran
- Thread starter GURSIKH
- Start date
Don't take it as an insult, your posts are very difficult to read due to the spelling, so a spell checker might be helpful.
Thats not true i'm afraid. It only happens to be the much more common interpretation, thats all. The authority of that does not in the least necessitate that this is actually what god supposedly ruled.
I disagree. Scholars obviously have better tools to handle interpreting the Quran, and thus they deserve the 'authority' so to speak regarding that, thats it. However Muslims not only can, but must in my view contemplate and try to understand the Quran on their own, while putting in mind all the relevant things to that process, including the conclusions of the various scholars regarding what is being thought about or considered.
No, 'they' don't do that, most of them do, not all.
I don't understand why people keep saying that whenever a disagreement occurs, its completely disrespectful to put it lightly, amongst other things.
If you can't see why, its because you're suggesting that those of a different view from that you're sharing actually know they are wrong, and think you're right, and think that this is the true teaching from god yet refuse it out of inconvenience.
Its not really about that, or at least not just about that, its about the fact that there are other possibilities as to what this verse might mean, regarding multiple parts in it.
looooooooooook all of you
we studie thise verse in school we studie islamique culture
as i already explain the importance of obeying the hasbent in islam the thise poste
i will tell you the interpretation of thise holy verse i remember the interpretation of it but not the place of the verse soo excuse me for that
1 the verse explain if the woman start to disobey the orders of her hasbent and the ruling of the hasbend must be followed it start with
1 guide her, tell them explain to her your view and that obying the hasbent is an order of god
2 leave them in bed for e few days dont ask them for sex with them and dont try to tuch them for e few days if that didnt work
3 beat them jentel beating ,,, not in the face and e beating that dont leave e mark and if that didnt work
4apoint e judje from the house of the man and the house of the woman to judje between them but if that didnt work
5 devorse her
i would recomend to all non muslims to read islamique culturale books and books of hitory of the profets instead of the holy quran thy are much easier in the language and you will not misinterpret it again
we studie thise verse in school we studie islamique culture
as i already explain the importance of obeying the hasbent in islam the thise poste
i will tell you the interpretation of thise holy verse i remember the interpretation of it but not the place of the verse soo excuse me for that
1 the verse explain if the woman start to disobey the orders of her hasbent and the ruling of the hasbend must be followed it start with
1 guide her, tell them explain to her your view and that obying the hasbent is an order of god
2 leave them in bed for e few days dont ask them for sex with them and dont try to tuch them for e few days if that didnt work
3 beat them jentel beating ,,, not in the face and e beating that dont leave e mark and if that didnt work
4apoint e judje from the house of the man and the house of the woman to judje between them but if that didnt work
5 devorse her
i would recomend to all non muslims to read islamique culturale books and books of hitory of the profets instead of the holy quran thy are much easier in the language and you will not misinterpret it again
By the way, for others reading, this is not accepted by all Muslims, this view of the supposed authority of men i mean.
Also as i recall what is being specifically said here is based on a Hadith, and Muslims don't all accept the same set of Hadiths, and they don't all accept Hadiths to begin with (though the majority do and accept a certain set).
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Yeah, i am!!!!!!!!
okk bardan you have steped into that unknown you have time ??????
i will explain to you
thisis e story from suna of mohamed thise story happend before thise holy verse came
it start with e e muslim from the the fist community of Mohamed in madina beat his wife
mohamed at that time didnt have thise holy verses to rule between ppl with
and thise woman came to complain to him here hasbent and Mohamed rule that she will return the same way the beating to him , thise is what mohamed rule
mohamed judje there fairly with the laws an eye for an eye ,,,,
anny way before she start returning the beating the angel gabirel came to mohamed with thise
,,,man are apraier than wemen............ i canot translate it from Arabic and he teach him that it is even it s bad but it s permitted
so mohamed tell the woman to stop and and reconcile with her hasbent and go home
than this holy verses came aboute beating
2 remember that the fatwa depend on the society and the time there are places that in unlawful to beat you wife like if you beat here on the head, you leave e mark or you beat here before you go thew those steps that i tape in the previouse post, and al mufti take every think in consideration as the personal condition of evry stats
next time dont say what you dont know and what you dont have knowledge about:no:
thise is e huge probleme every one is e mufti evry one know islam ,what is that? ,mohamed say to ask ppl of knowledge dont make up thinks that say it from god
to all non muslim ,you must understand that thise is e an opening the opening mean e permission is to do e bad think ,beating youre wife is bad think every muslim know that and mohamed didnt never do that and he have a lot s of wifes, but even ,it correct thinks some how even if a lot s of us dont understand
like the opening ,muslims know that transpassing on other countrys is bad and thy know that thy will have victimes throw the both sides but the goodness that generate like the unification of huge part of the world under worshiping one god and, showing the right path to other nations when every nation was isolated and thy brauth them the accces ion to islam
i will explain to you
thisis e story from suna of mohamed thise story happend before thise holy verse came
it start with e e muslim from the the fist community of Mohamed in madina beat his wife
mohamed at that time didnt have thise holy verses to rule between ppl with
and thise woman came to complain to him here hasbent and Mohamed rule that she will return the same way the beating to him , thise is what mohamed rule
mohamed judje there fairly with the laws an eye for an eye ,,,,
anny way before she start returning the beating the angel gabirel came to mohamed with thise
,,,man are apraier than wemen............ i canot translate it from Arabic and he teach him that it is even it s bad but it s permitted
so mohamed tell the woman to stop and and reconcile with her hasbent and go home
than this holy verses came aboute beating
2 remember that the fatwa depend on the society and the time there are places that in unlawful to beat you wife like if you beat here on the head, you leave e mark or you beat here before you go thew those steps that i tape in the previouse post, and al mufti take every think in consideration as the personal condition of evry stats
next time dont say what you dont know and what you dont have knowledge about:no:
thise is e huge probleme every one is e mufti evry one know islam ,what is that? ,mohamed say to ask ppl of knowledge dont make up thinks that say it from god
to all non muslim ,you must understand that thise is e an opening the opening mean e permission is to do e bad think ,beating youre wife is bad think every muslim know that and mohamed didnt never do that and he have a lot s of wifes, but even ,it correct thinks some how even if a lot s of us dont understand
like the opening ,muslims know that transpassing on other countrys is bad and thy know that thy will have victimes throw the both sides but the goodness that generate like the unification of huge part of the world under worshiping one god and, showing the right path to other nations when every nation was isolated and thy brauth them the accces ion to islam
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My advise to you: Make less assumptions, that way you can avoid both making false and unfair judgments, and avoid embarrassing yourself.
There is not one single piece of information you have shared in this thread that i didn't already know about.
Thanks for putting the effort to share this, but i'm already aware of this story, i read it while reading Ibn Kathir's interpretation. I fail to see what is it supposed to address however.
Garbage, no one's actually doing that.
Rakhel
Well-Known Member
Not everyone is as well versed in the English language as you.
reedin', ritin' an sum gud ole fashon rithmatic is how one learns.
perhaps you should take a course in phonics before you jump someone else's **** for how they spell.
Where the hell did that come from. Good grief!
Rakhel
Well-Known Member
I'm in growl mode for the next week.
Sorry. Anything I can do to help? How's about you let me get you and your husband a nice bottle of Kosher (and non-Mevushal) wine for sukkot?
Now, there's a statement loaded with irony.
Rakhel
Well-Known Member
Tempting...Oh so tempting.
asa120, it worries me that you won't even consider an alternate meaning of this verse; it's almost as if you'd prefer the word mean "beat" rather than "separate" as others have suggested. Majority opinion doesn't always mean it's the correct one.
I think before trying to understand and interpret that Ayah, which is indeed controversial, we must be honest with ourselves and others. Trying to "invent" a new meaning in the Arabic language and that suddenly we discovered in the 20ths century that to "yadreb (beat) someone" means "ignore him/her", is intellectual dishonesty. I would take my hat off to the makers of that claim if they said outright that they don't accept that Qur'anic verse.
Because I am an ignorant person, I am eager to be enlightened by those who claim that it means "ignore or separate between them", why not to bring a similar usage from the Holy Qur'an that would give that meaning and with the exact grammatical structure. "Them" that refers to women in the Ayah is the object and it was not preceded by a preposition. I need the same phrasal structure that would give the same meaning from the Qur'an or even from an Arabic lexicon and by then I would say amen to that claim.
And from what I have seen until now, my request wasn't granted...I saw how such claim is justified, and was disappointed by the grammatical and linguistic failure....it doesn't help to say that the verb "yadreb" was used in the Qur'an multiple times with different meanings....and surprisingly it gives different meanings because it's used in different linguistic structures.
If we accepted the meaning "separate from them", what does it mean exactly?
Moreover, if we accepted that, why should women obey their husbands? Of course, in the "cool" and "progressive" (or let me say twisted) translations there is no mention of "obey"!! Anyway, we would find these kind of misguiding translations in the so called "Qur'an alone" people/"progressive Muslims" literature.
There must be honesty when dealing with the Qur'anic text, otherwise there is no point of discussing anything.
Because I am an ignorant person, I am eager to be enlightened by those who claim that it means "ignore or separate between them", why not to bring a similar usage from the Holy Qur'an that would give that meaning and with the exact grammatical structure. "Them" that refers to women in the Ayah is the object and it was not preceded by a preposition. I need the same phrasal structure that would give the same meaning from the Qur'an or even from an Arabic lexicon and by then I would say amen to that claim.
And from what I have seen until now, my request wasn't granted...I saw how such claim is justified, and was disappointed by the grammatical and linguistic failure....it doesn't help to say that the verb "yadreb" was used in the Qur'an multiple times with different meanings....and surprisingly it gives different meanings because it's used in different linguistic structures.
If we accepted the meaning "separate from them", what does it mean exactly?
Moreover, if we accepted that, why should women obey their husbands? Of course, in the "cool" and "progressive" (or let me say twisted) translations there is no mention of "obey"!! Anyway, we would find these kind of misguiding translations in the so called "Qur'an alone" people/"progressive Muslims" literature.
There must be honesty when dealing with the Qur'anic text, otherwise there is no point of discussing anything.
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I think before trying to understand and interpret that Ayah, which is indeed controversial, we must be honest with ourselves and others. Trying to "invent" a new meaning in the Arabic language and that suddenly we discovered in the 20ths century that to "yadreb (beat) someone" means "ignore him/her", is intellectual dishonesty. I would take my hat off to the makers of that claim if they said outright that they don't accept that Qur'anic verse.
Because I am an ignorant person, I am eager to be enlightened by those who claim that it means "ignore or separate between them", why not to bring a similar usage from the Holy Qur'an that would give that meaning and with the exact grammatical structure. "Them" that refers to women in the Ayah is the object and it was not preceded by a preposition. I need the same phrasal structure that would give the same meaning from the Qur'an or even from an Arabic lexicon and by then I would say amen to that claim.
And from what I have seen until now, my request wasn't granted...I saw how such claim is justified, and was disappointed by the grammatical and linguistic failure....it doesn't help to say that the verb "yadreb" was used in the Qur'an multiple times with different meanings....and surprisingly it gives different meanings because it's used in different linguistic structures.
If we accepted the meaning "separate from them", what does it mean exactly?
Moreover, if we accepted that, why should women obey their husbands? Of course, in the "cool" and "progressive" (or let me say twisted) translations there is no mention of "obey"!! Anyway, we would find these kind of misguiding translations in the so called "Qur'an alone" people/"progressive Muslims" literature.
There must be honesty when dealing with the Qur'anic text, otherwise there is no point of discussing anything.
Sahar, I understand what you are saying...as a Muslim woman, I just have a very difficult time understanding why an all-knowing God would ever allow a stronger person (a man) the liberty to physically beat a weaker person (the wife) for ANY reason, let alone to "obey"? Does He believe men will be able to show restraint with a "light" beating? Why would beating be necessary to get any adult to obey another? It's a very disturbing verse, and highly controversial indeed. I guess we try and make it as unpleasant as possible in our own minds so we can sleep at night.
Thats not what i'm doing, just to make that clear. I understand your position however.
Whenever my fellow Muslims who don't share my and others view regarding this topic are done with their unfortunate, but not surprising, off topic guess work regarding my honesty and knowledge, misrepresentation of my position, and taking jabs at certain Muslim groups, please let me know so that i might get back to this thread and share more on my position.
I know you're not, Badran.
I happen to agree with you that there are different definitions of this word, in addition to so many in Arabic.
I, for one, want to hear all about your position on this issue. Personally I think you have a wonderful perspective.
I should clarify what I meant. What I'm saying is, that there are many Muslims who will take the words of scholars at face value, and won't go the extra mile to research and see for themselves that there are other interpretations. It's "easier" to let others do the work, even if it means accepting something that clearly seems to contradict the spirit of the Qur'an.
Those who research these controversial issues, are, in essence, helping us realize that there ARE other views about this verse...and I'm truly thankful for that.
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