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why some of arabs hate USA?
- Thread starter moegypt
- Start date
Mr Spinkles
Mr
Look kai, no one here likes the Taliban. But most Afghans want some kind of peaceful settlement with the Afghan Taliban. Why? Because the Taliban are Afghans. Because in many cases the local population subscribe to the Taliban ideology, as well as ancient, conservative tribal customs. If a few Taliban were holding freedom-loving Afghans hostage in every case, then they could be liberated but you can't liberate people from something they support. But the fact is that in a lot of rural areas the central Afghan government does nothing, local leaders fill the vacuum and provide some counterbalance to lawlessness, and we call them 'Taliban'. In some cases I would think some rural Afghans would rather be ruled by the Taliban than have warlords and lawlessness. We should go after Al Qaeda and support equitable government in Afghanistan, but there is no reason we MUST have a violent conflict with rural tribes that have a very conservative religious culture. Saudi Arabia has an extremely fundamentalist Islamic culture and government, most Saudis either support it or at least aren't violently against it, yet Saudi Arabia is an ally and we try (or should try) to encourage democratic reform and human rights, and capture terrorists who attacked us through PEACEFUL agreements with the Saudis. Are peaceful agreements with ALL the Afghan Taliban not possible?
Am I off base?
Check out this short documentary on Afghanistan: http://www.youtube.com/user/journeymanpictures#p/c/2C32A4BDEAD6466A/0/u-yi_lBQNEs
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"Freedom" and "liberty", slogans coming from the West, but on the other hand Western governments and good section of their people support and justify occupation of other nations...
Why is that?
As an Arab Muslim, watching and hearing news on what went on in Palestine and Iraq had gotten to a nauseating point with me. There had been too much repetition, too much unintelligent jargon, and too much vulgarity for even devout Middle East addicts to take. My and many others’ intelligence gets insulted everyday with not much done about it. God forbid I should forget that those who insult are the “mighty” ones with the black suits and the fancy ties, the ones with their sophisticated toys, ready to knock the hell out of anyone who misbehaves.
It’s been a pattern, and an intentional one at that. They strike, kill, enrage, and walk out clean. Our faces turn red; we scream; they turn blue. We walk down the streets holding signs and throwing tomatoes. We let it all out. Our faces grow back their yellow, and they stay that way. Colorful, isn’t it?
Alarmingly, each crime committed against my people is beginning to act like a vaccine booster, as if we were slowly adapting to humiliation. Proud men getting their faces rubbed in sand is the order of the day. At some point it was a Palestinian child’s bloody face into the pavement under an Israeli boot, so rubbing an adult face in sand with an American boot is not that bad after all!
We’re looking at a policy that aims at producing non-reaction. Acquired helplessness. And they see it as the first step to a loving friendship. They’re torturing, raping and bombing their way to our hearts. And since we’re dogs, we’d continue to drool to them for attention, for love. This is their utopian vision of us. This is how they’ve chosen to run things with the people of a thousands-of-years-old civilization.
But as humiliated and helpless as many of us have come to feel, silent rage is spreading among us like a dangerous plague. No, they haven’t won any “dog’s” heart. They’ve only kept the hearts and minds of Arab rulers who gladly prostitute their countries for cash and prestige.
As this outrageous set of atrocities piles up with time, it awakens the proud human in any decent Muslim. They empower the will to act more assertively, to speak louder, and to make a change. And we’re more than a billion. We come from different parts of the world, and we live under differing conditions. Our education ranges from a PhD to nothing. But if a few of us get hurt, we all ache. And our reactions then vary, and range from speaking and writing to suicide bombing.
I believe this pile just got heaviest with me. When I saw pictures of my brothers in Iraq stripped naked I literally felt my blood boiling in a way it hasn’t for a very long time. I found myself writing for the first time in four years.
There isn’t much I can write that hasn’t already been written by many others or spoken by many more. But since there appears to be a massive state of ignorance on the policy making level, allow me to use some basic teaching techniques usually applied on Alzheimer patients: repetition.
Invade a country and treat its people like sheep and you’ll be loathed for generations. The Israelis still suffer from that mistake; the infamous “a land without people to people without land” dogma, which is translated in each Israeli policy, continues to cost many Israeli lives 56 years on. And they haven’t learned.
And Iraqis are not Red Indians. In the 21st century everyone can see what you think you’re doing in the dark. There are many around the world who feel the plight of the Iraqis as you rip at their culture, not hundreds of years later.
Finally, add more oppression to the oppressed, take away the little they have left and they will turn violent. This is a basic equation. Politics 101.
“Objectivity” tells me that those pictures I saw reflected the acts of a deranged few, and that those few will receive their well-deserved punishment at the hands of their commanders. But much to the displeasure of the American administration, I am a rational being, and I come from the Middle East. Some of the old commanders and politicians who took charge throughout the turbulent history of this part of the world had pasts not dissimilar to the present of the sick minds they recruit today. And that lady posing next to the prisoners is part of the package. We’ve seen this only too many times. Ask any Arab ex-prisoner who fought a war with Israel.
And now, with a smiling face, I’m expected to give reassuring answers to angry patriotic Americans echoing the blond heads that popped on television right after 9/11: “Why do they hate us?” A question the media has managed to scare every American with. And many have internalized and believed it.
One thing: Get your honorable liberators out of our land. As each day passes you convince more and more people to really hate you this time, and fight to the very last drop of their boiling blood.
It’s been a pattern, and an intentional one at that. They strike, kill, enrage, and walk out clean. Our faces turn red; we scream; they turn blue. We walk down the streets holding signs and throwing tomatoes. We let it all out. Our faces grow back their yellow, and they stay that way. Colorful, isn’t it?
Alarmingly, each crime committed against my people is beginning to act like a vaccine booster, as if we were slowly adapting to humiliation. Proud men getting their faces rubbed in sand is the order of the day. At some point it was a Palestinian child’s bloody face into the pavement under an Israeli boot, so rubbing an adult face in sand with an American boot is not that bad after all!
We’re looking at a policy that aims at producing non-reaction. Acquired helplessness. And they see it as the first step to a loving friendship. They’re torturing, raping and bombing their way to our hearts. And since we’re dogs, we’d continue to drool to them for attention, for love. This is their utopian vision of us. This is how they’ve chosen to run things with the people of a thousands-of-years-old civilization.
But as humiliated and helpless as many of us have come to feel, silent rage is spreading among us like a dangerous plague. No, they haven’t won any “dog’s” heart. They’ve only kept the hearts and minds of Arab rulers who gladly prostitute their countries for cash and prestige.
As this outrageous set of atrocities piles up with time, it awakens the proud human in any decent Muslim. They empower the will to act more assertively, to speak louder, and to make a change. And we’re more than a billion. We come from different parts of the world, and we live under differing conditions. Our education ranges from a PhD to nothing. But if a few of us get hurt, we all ache. And our reactions then vary, and range from speaking and writing to suicide bombing.
I believe this pile just got heaviest with me. When I saw pictures of my brothers in Iraq stripped naked I literally felt my blood boiling in a way it hasn’t for a very long time. I found myself writing for the first time in four years.
There isn’t much I can write that hasn’t already been written by many others or spoken by many more. But since there appears to be a massive state of ignorance on the policy making level, allow me to use some basic teaching techniques usually applied on Alzheimer patients: repetition.
Invade a country and treat its people like sheep and you’ll be loathed for generations. The Israelis still suffer from that mistake; the infamous “a land without people to people without land” dogma, which is translated in each Israeli policy, continues to cost many Israeli lives 56 years on. And they haven’t learned.
And Iraqis are not Red Indians. In the 21st century everyone can see what you think you’re doing in the dark. There are many around the world who feel the plight of the Iraqis as you rip at their culture, not hundreds of years later.
Finally, add more oppression to the oppressed, take away the little they have left and they will turn violent. This is a basic equation. Politics 101.
“Objectivity” tells me that those pictures I saw reflected the acts of a deranged few, and that those few will receive their well-deserved punishment at the hands of their commanders. But much to the displeasure of the American administration, I am a rational being, and I come from the Middle East. Some of the old commanders and politicians who took charge throughout the turbulent history of this part of the world had pasts not dissimilar to the present of the sick minds they recruit today. And that lady posing next to the prisoners is part of the package. We’ve seen this only too many times. Ask any Arab ex-prisoner who fought a war with Israel.
And now, with a smiling face, I’m expected to give reassuring answers to angry patriotic Americans echoing the blond heads that popped on television right after 9/11: “Why do they hate us?” A question the media has managed to scare every American with. And many have internalized and believed it.
One thing: Get your honorable liberators out of our land. As each day passes you convince more and more people to really hate you this time, and fight to the very last drop of their boiling blood.
Mr Spinkles
Mr
I don't understand.Oh, how noble!!Poor guy!!
I didn't say anything about anyone being noble, I said the coalition and Iraqi government are very different from the Shiite death squads and Al Qaeda. Al Qaeda took credit for blowing up the Shiite shrine to incite ethnic violence and blowing up people as they stand in line to vote on the constitution of the Islamic republic of Iraq. Tashan agreed with me so can you explain your point?
Mr Spinkles
Mr
This is a great article: Beware of Americans Bearing Gifts - IslamOnline.net - Politics in Depth
Vile Atheist
Loud and Obnoxious
I skimmed that article, as I don't have enough time to read it now, but I found quite a few good points (probably more hidden in there too, at a closer read).
I don't know as much about Iraq as I do Afghanistan because my country's troops aren't in Iraq, but in Afghanistan. (Though to be fair, when two Canadian hostages working for a humanitarian group were taken, Canada's elite JTF2 forces entered Iraq to rescue them).
I don't know as much about Iraq as I do Afghanistan because my country's troops aren't in Iraq, but in Afghanistan. (Though to be fair, when two Canadian hostages working for a humanitarian group were taken, Canada's elite JTF2 forces entered Iraq to rescue them).
darkendless
Guardian of Asgaard
If those nations would play nicely my soldiers wouldnt be getting shot at.
You call the west bad but what is your country doing to improve the quality of life in Afghanistan?
Gharib
I want Khilafah back
it's not killing innocent civilians i can tell you that.
Vile Atheist
Loud and Obnoxious
I hope you aren't suggesting that countries like darkendless' and my own (Australia and Canada, respectively) purposely target civilians? In fact, Australia and Canada haven't killed very many civilians.
kai
ragamuffin
Not sure are you saying? a return to pre 2001 Taliban rule is what the majority of Afghans want? if so I dissagree.
Should we open negotiations with the Taliban yes i think we should , I dont see why Taliban who disarm and join the politcal process shouldnt be welcomed with open arms.President Hamid Karzai has offered to meet personally with Taliban leader Mullah Omar for peace talks and give the militants a high position in a government ministry as a way to end the rising insurgency in Afghanistan since back in 2007.
and one thing that is mentioned often which really astounds me is the idea that you can go after Alqueda and somehow ignore Taliban,You cant go after Alqueda if they are in Taliban controlled areas without engaging Taliban.
and Saudi are moderates compared to Taliban.
kai
ragamuffin
I dont see Arab countries clamouring to provide security and aid to Iraq,Afghanistan or Palestinians,for that matter the U.S. is the largest contributor to aid to Palestinians not Arabs. The vast majority of their sisters and brothers who are being "oppressed" are being oppressed by other Muslims but thats kind of private and none of our business until of course something happens and we intervene, then Its all "them and Us " talk you hear. You get scarce condemnation of Muslim on Muslim violence because Muslims wont argue against each other in front of unbelievers
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Vile Atheist
Loud and Obnoxious
kai
ragamuffin
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Vile Atheist
Loud and Obnoxious
I'm giving examples.
kai
ragamuffin
of Muslim on Mulsim violence yes thats a good example, wheres the clamouring voices of dissent from their brothers and sisters oh of course the Hazara are Shia.
and according to Taliban they are not Muslim at all.Vile Atheist
Loud and Obnoxious
What's RAWA's position on the Hazara?
kai
ragamuffin
I have no idea ?they are fervently anti Taliban though.
Gharib
I want Khilafah back
ah, they haven't killed that very many civilians so that makes it alright.
don't know about your country but i do know about australia, a documentary was shown early this year and the australian troops masacred a whole town of people for nothing. i don't know what to feel for people that share your views. i'm lost for words to be honest.