Why do some people suffer so much whereas other people hardly suffer at all?

[Trailblazer]

Then my hope was fulfilled

Good.

 

[1213]

Invariably, my suffering is caused by my cats getting sick or dying.
Nothing else in this material world matters much to me.

Ok, in that case I can’t do anything to help you. But, nice thing is that cats can have pups, so there could be new cats, all though I understand that it is not the same.

 

[1213]

Does that apply to the inmates of dachau?

I think so, but I understand it could be really difficult in that situation. And I hope you also understand that my intention is not to claim people should be happy in all situations. Or that if person is not happy, it is somehow bad thing. And certainly, this doesn’t mean that then all evil things are ok.

 

[Quintessence]

@Trailblazer - sorry to hear you've been having a rough time.

Sometimes I find it important to remember that even though it doesn't seem like people around me have their own hardships, they do. Maybe things are different where you live, but in my culture people behave as if everything is fine and normal when the reality is often very different. We put on a mask, batten down the hatches, and pretend we aren't emotional, feeling beings who have all sorts of problems going on in our lives. Worse, we do this so much that we often fail to ask for help or talk to people who can lend us a hand. We suffer together, in silence, not reaching out for hugs. That makes it really hard.

How do each of us shoulder the burdens of our hardships? It looks different for everyone, but for everyone, it is an ongoing process. It is a perpetual "problem" in need of "solving" if we want to look at it that way. I'm not sure I like framing it like that because it sounds pretty negative, so maybe think of our hardships as perpetual "challenges" to use to "grow" and "overcome." What I do is work on having a good toolbox to use on these challenges. Building up that toolbox takes time, and it definitely helps. Sometimes you don't have quite the right tool you were looking for, but with some creativity and perseverance, tools can adapt to new situations.

What tools do you use right now to help overcome the challenges life throws your way? Are they working well, or do they need some adjustment?

Just some things to think about.

 

[Trailblazer]

@Trailblazer - sorry to hear you've been having a rough time.

Sometimes I find it important to remember that even though it doesn't seem like people around me have their own hardships, they do. Maybe things are different where you live, but in my culture people behave as if everything is fine and normal when the reality is often very different. We put on a mask, batten down the hatches, and pretend we aren't emotional, feeling beings who have all sorts of problems going on in our lives. Worse, we do this so much that we often fail to ask for help or talk to people who can lend us a hand. We suffer together, in silence, not reaching out for hugs. That makes it really hard.

How do each of us shoulder the burdens of our hardships? It looks different for everyone, but for everyone, it is an ongoing process. It is a perpetual "problem" in need of "solving" if we want to look at it that way. I'm not sure I like framing it like that because it sounds pretty negative, so maybe think of our hardships as perpetual "challenges" to use to "grow" and "overcome." What I do is work on having a good toolbox to use on these challenges. Building up that toolbox takes time, and it definitely helps. Sometimes you don't have quite the right tool you were looking for, but with some creativity and perseverance, tools can adapt to new situations.

What tools do you use right now to help overcome the challenges life throws your way? Are they working well, or do they need some adjustment?

Just some things to think about.

Thanks for your kind words.

My tools had been working but owing to this recent crisis they do not seem to be working anymore, so I am trying to reevaluate my toolbox. Sadly and unfortunately, the only person I have in my 'real life' life right now is my husband and he is not amenable to changing his toolbox, so I am on my own or constantly fighting with him. It might be time to bring in a counselor before I get any more depressed but I am not going alone since I am not the only one with problems. He just covers them up better than I can. Moreover, the problems are related to our lifestyle, so they are mutual problems that affect us both.

 

[Quintessence]

Thanks for your kind words.

My tools had been working but owing to this recent crisis they do not seem to be working anymore, so I am trying to reevaluate my toolbox. Sadly and unfortunately, the only person I have in my 'real life' life right now is my husband and he is not amenable to changing his toolbox, so I am on my own or constantly fighting with him. It might be time to bring in a counselor before I get any more depressed but I am not going alone since I am not the only one with problems. He just covers them up better than I can. Moreover, the problems are related to our lifestyle, so they are mutual problems that affect us both.

Sounds complicated! Lifestyle changes can be particularly challenging, since you're often trying to muster enough inertia to overcome the habit of "doing things like they've always been done" so to speak. Sometimes it takes a big change that forces us to change habits that aren't so good for us. It's not fun when that happens.

Best of fortunes! That serenity prayer can be a good one to keep in mind - I have a bookmark of that on my fridge.

 

[Ayjaydee]

I think so, but I understand it could be really difficult in that situation. And I hope you also understand that my intention is not to claim people should be happy in all situations. Or that if person is not happy, it is somehow bad thing. And certainly, this doesn’t mean that then all evil things are ok.

Gassing and burning COULD be DIFFICULT? Hahahaha

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Last week I started this thread: Why would an All-Loving God create a world that has so much suffering in it?

I admit what precipitated my starting that thread was because I was suffering really badly at the time, but even when I am not suffering I still wonder why I have suffered so much, and why other people suffer much more than others, through no fault of their own. Some religious people, especially those of my religion, say that those who suffer should be grateful because suffering helps us grow stronger, but certain other people have pointed out that is certainly not always what happens because some people become bitter and angry at God or at other people or at life because of their suffering.

This has happened to me, I get angry at God and sometimes at people who are happy all the time, because I am suffering. I realize this is a character defect on my part and I feel really guilty because I know that those people are not to blame just because it was their fate to be happy. The buck stops with God because it is God who determines our fate. Sure, we can make free will choices within certain parameters but there are some things we cannot change, like the parents we had or our genetics, and sometimes our life circumstances cannot be changed.

Meanwhile, some people would not change anything even if they could because everything has gone their way. Do you know people like this? There is no way for me to relate to these people and they are painful to be around, especially when I am in extreme anguish.

So this week at work, a friend said “good morning” in the lunch room and I lost it and told him it was not “good.” Then he said it cannot be that bad if I am here (meaning at work). I then stomped off because I was so angry. How dense can anyone be? If I took every day off work just because I was suffering I would not have any sick leave left! But he does not get it because of his perfect life that is so different from my life. He is never depressed no matter what happens, he is always upbeat and cheerful. Anyhow, I made up with him Friday before we left work, because I cannot stand having bad feelings towards anyone, or having them think I have bad feelings, as I am very sensitive to offending anyone.

Now, back to God…. Because of certain recurring events in my life I get angry at God, but what happened a week ago was over the top and out the door. Who does God think I am anyway? How much more does God think I can endure and still continue living?

Fast forward a few days.... I am a very strong person so I did not miss a day of work this week, I just endured. I am not the kind of person who expects God to do anything; I always try to solve my own problems, so I have been working on that, although I admit I did try to bargain with God once. This is very rare for me. Then after that did not work, I let go and decided to just accept what the outcome would be, what I consider God’s will for me, and something miraculous happened. I know it was more than just me and what I did to try to solve my problem, because things like this just do not happen without divine assistance, and this is not the first time this kind of thing has happened. Was God just testing me to see how long I could endure patiently?

So now I am feeling guilty, like I do not even deserve divine assistance after the way I behaved towards God, not trusting God and getting so angry. But it is not as if I can hurt God by being angry, I only hurt myself, but because we have free will, God allows that. I am sure God knows I will get over it, as I always do, till next time the same thing happens. Eventually this will end though, when I die physically. Some people might say that I could end it now, by changing my life situation, but they do not really understand why I can’t.

Sorry for not being more specific, but I cannot get any more specific than this right now; it would be too painful to talk about it, and it might make other people sad. I cannot have that.

Why is suffering unevenly distributed? Why do sometimes the innocent suffer and sometimes the guilty go relatively pain free?

We don't know. We will never know. If there was ever a man that God would have told, it would have been Job, but even Job was not told why.

However, we know that God is a God of justice and love. Somehow, someway, this all balances out. Perhaps the reason we aren't told is that the reason is simply too hard for us to understand at our current stage of evolution. However, I think we can trust God to know what he is doing.

 

[Ayjaydee]

Why is suffering unevenly distributed? Why do sometimes the innocent suffer and sometimes the guilty go relatively pain free?

We don't know. We will never know. If there was ever a man that God would have told, it would have been Job, but even Job was not told why.

However, we know that God is a God of justice and love. Somehow, someway, this all balances out. Perhaps the reason we aren't told is that the reason is simply too hard for us to understand at our current stage of evolution. However, I think we can trust God to know what he is doing.

Perhaps he has no say in the matter

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Perhaps he has no say in the matter

That would mean there is a force or being greater than God that has ultimate control. Which would make that force or greater being God.

 

[Ayjaydee]

That would mean there is a force or being greater than God that has ultimate control. Which would make that force or greater being God.

not necessarily

 

[IndigoChild5559]

not necessarily

Give me an alternative explanation.

 

[Ayjaydee]

Give me an alternative explanation.

Explanation of what?

 

[Ancient Soul]

Last week I started this thread: Why would an All-Loving God create a world that has so much suffering in it?

I admit what precipitated my starting that thread was because I was suffering really badly at the time, but even when I am not suffering I still wonder why I have suffered so much, and why other people suffer much more than others, through no fault of their own. Some religious people, especially those of my religion, say that those who suffer should be grateful because suffering helps us grow stronger, but certain other people have pointed out that is certainly not always what happens because some people become bitter and angry at God or at other people or at life because of their suffering.

This has happened to me, I get angry at God and sometimes at people who are happy all the time, because I am suffering. I realize this is a character defect on my part and I feel really guilty because I know that those people are not to blame just because it was their fate to be happy. The buck stops with God because it is God who determines our fate. Sure, we can make free will choices within certain parameters but there are some things we cannot change, like the parents we had or our genetics, and sometimes our life circumstances cannot be changed.

Meanwhile, some people would not change anything even if they could because everything has gone their way. Do you know people like this? There is no way for me to relate to these people and they are painful to be around, especially when I am in extreme anguish.

So this week at work, a friend said “good morning” in the lunch room and I lost it and told him it was not “good.” Then he said it cannot be that bad if I am here (meaning at work). I then stomped off because I was so angry. How dense can anyone be? If I took every day off work just because I was suffering I would not have any sick leave left! But he does not get it because of his perfect life that is so different from my life. He is never depressed no matter what happens, he is always upbeat and cheerful. Anyhow, I made up with him Friday before we left work, because I cannot stand having bad feelings towards anyone, or having them think I have bad feelings, as I am very sensitive to offending anyone.

Now, back to God…. Because of certain recurring events in my life I get angry at God, but what happened a week ago was over the top and out the door. Who does God think I am anyway? How much more does God think I can endure and still continue living?

Fast forward a few days.... I am a very strong person so I did not miss a day of work this week, I just endured. I am not the kind of person who expects God to do anything; I always try to solve my own problems, so I have been working on that, although I admit I did try to bargain with God once. This is very rare for me. Then after that did not work, I let go and decided to just accept what the outcome would be, what I consider God’s will for me, and something miraculous happened. I know it was more than just me and what I did to try to solve my problem, because things like this just do not happen without divine assistance, and this is not the first time this kind of thing has happened. Was God just testing me to see how long I could endure patiently?

So now I am feeling guilty, like I do not even deserve divine assistance after the way I behaved towards God, not trusting God and getting so angry. But it is not as if I can hurt God by being angry, I only hurt myself, but because we have free will, God allows that. I am sure God knows I will get over it, as I always do, till next time the same thing happens. Eventually this will end though, when I die physically. Some people might say that I could end it now, by changing my life situation, but they do not really understand why I can’t.

Sorry for not being more specific, but I cannot get any more specific than this right now; it would be too painful to talk about it, and it might make other people sad. I cannot have that.

Odd that!

I have been mulling over the same question myself.

My entire life has been an almost never ending succession of hardships. Mostly due to the evilness of people. No matter how much I try to get along with everyone or just avoid them as much as possible, someone is almost always trying to cause trouble for me. Often people I've never even met before, so it's not like I could have done anything to them. I'm beginning to think more and more people look for ways to cause trouble for others, as a pastime. Also now that I'm getting older, I have developed some physical ailments that range from discomforting to painful depending upon how much they want to torment me. This makes it difficult to enjoy life a fair amount of the time.

But my perspective is that there is some spiritual lesson I'm suppose to learn from them, and/or this is being done to me to coax me to move on and make this my last lifetime on earth. To move on and exist as just my soul in the Spiritual Realm/Heaven. I'm leaning heavily towards this belief.

Although my perspective is way different than your's. For ever since my experience with "dying" (NDE/OBE) when just a child, God has ALWAYS been with me, helped me find a non combative way out of everything everyone has ever tried to do to me, protected me, answered ALL of my spiritual questions, etc,. A couple of times when there appeared no way out of a serious situation, I swear I was saved by what had to be a miracle. So could NEVER blame him or be angry at him. The world is as harsh as it is, I cannot blame god for that. With his help I have gained more inner strength than I ever could have imagined.

That, and no matter how bad things get, I just reflect on the fact that I'm still alive and try squeezing out as much enjoyment as I can out of every single day.

So I don't understand why you feel so differently about God. I'm sure he's there trying to help you, but you just don't know how to "listen".

No wait, I got it now. I forgot your beliefs made you believe that God cannot contact you and impart to you how to navigate your way thru all the obstacles in life, so you don't even try.

Perhaps it's time to rethink that and let him help you.

 

[Trailblazer]

My entire life has been an almost never ending succession of hardships. Mostly due to the evilness of people. No matter how much I try to get along with everyone or just avoid them as much as possible, someone is almost always trying to cause trouble for me. Often people I've never even met before, so it's not like I could have done anything to them. I'm beginning to think more and more people look for ways to cause trouble for others, as a pastime. Also now that I'm getting older, I have developed some physical ailments that range from discomforting to painful depending upon how much they want to torment me. This makes it difficult to enjoy life a fair amount of the time.

My life has mostly been suffering, but not because anyone caused my suffering, except my parents, who caused it indirectly, by raising me as they did.

But my perspective is that there is some spiritual lesson I'm suppose to learn from them, and/or this is being done to me to coax me to move on and make this my last lifetime on earth. To move on and exist as just my soul in the Spiritual Realm/Heaven. I'm leaning heavily towards this belief.

Maybe there is a lesson, but also suffering is just the nature of this material world. Some people seem to scrape by with little suffering and I think that is owing to genetics and how the were raised, as well as luck of the draw.

Although my perspective is way different than your's. For ever since my experience with "dying" (NDE/OBE) when just a child, God has ALWAYS been with me, helped me find a non combative way out of everything everyone has ever tried to do to me, protected me, answered ALL of my spiritual questions, etc,. A couple of times when there appeared no way out of a serious situation, I swear I was saved by what had to be a miracle. So could NEVER blame him or be angry at him. The world is as harsh as it is, I cannot blame god for that. With his help I have gained more inner strength than I ever could have imagined.

I do believe God does such things and I have experienced them. It is easier to see this when not depressed, I have been depressed lately.
“In this world we are influenced by two sentiments, Joy and Pain.
Joy gives us wings! In times of joy our strength is more vital, our intellect keener, and our understanding less clouded. We seem better able to cope with the world and to find our sphere of usefulness. But when sadness visits us we become weak, our strength leaves us, our comprehension is dim and our intelligence veiled. The actualities of life seem to elude our grasp, the eyes of our spirits fail to discover the sacred mysteries, and we become even as dead beings." Abdu'l-Baha, Paris Talks

So I don't understand why you feel so differently about God. I'm sure he's there trying to help you, but you just don't know how to "listen".

No wait, I got it now. I forgot your beliefs made you believe that God cannot contact you and impart to you how to navigate your way thru all the obstacles in life, so you don't even try.

Perhaps it's time to rethink that and let him help you.

No, it's not that, it is the depression. It finally caught up with me.
I can barely write, but I wanted to answer you.

 

[Ancient Soul]

My life has mostly been suffering, but not because anyone caused my suffering, except my parents, who caused it indirectly, by raising me as they did.

Maybe there is a lesson, but also suffering is just the nature of this material world. Some people seem to scrape by with little suffering and I think that is owing to genetics and how the were raised, as well as luck of the draw.

I do believe God does such things and I have experienced them. It is easier to see this when not depressed, I have been depressed lately.
“In this world we are influenced by two sentiments, Joy and Pain.
Joy gives us wings! In times of joy our strength is more vital, our intellect keener, and our understanding less clouded. We seem better able to cope with the world and to find our sphere of usefulness. But when sadness visits us we become weak, our strength leaves us, our comprehension is dim and our intelligence veiled. The actualities of life seem to elude our grasp, the eyes of our spirits fail to discover the sacred mysteries, and we become even as dead beings." Abdu'l-Baha, Paris Talks

No, it's not that, it is the depression. It finally caught up with me.
I can barely write, but I wanted to answer you.

You know I was just trying to help you out and spent quite some time composing my thoughts and writing it all down..So I find it insulting how you so glibly avoided directly addressing everything I stated. This tells me that you WANT to stay depressed by rejecting my, and everyone else's help/advise.

I'm sorry I even bothered.

 

[Trailblazer]

You know I was just trying to help you out and spent quite some time composing my thoughts and writing it all down..So I find it insulting how you so glibly avoided directly addressing everything I stated. This tells me that you WANT to stay depressed by rejecting my, and everyone else's help/advise.

I'm sorry I even bothered.

I consider what you said mean and selfish...
I heard everything you said but I can barely type and I told you that is why cannot respond except in brief.
This is not because of depression, it is a medical problem, but it is making me depressed.

I did not reject anyone else's advice. I have been listening to doctors and counselors all week, trying to figure out what caused this mental nosedive.