Adam and Eve were created as young adults.
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Which "afterlife" stories makes the most sense?
- Thread starter Unveiled Artist
- Start date
Adam and Eve were created as young adults.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
As Baha’u’llah wrote, Jesus besought the one true God the honor of sacrificing himself as a ransom for the sins and iniquities of all the peoples of the earth. Notably, Jesus never said anything about an original sin committed by Adam and Eve as the reason for his sacrifice.
God can grant anyone the gift of everlasting life because He is rich in mercy, even people who did not repent and trust in Jesus who died on a cross.
Jesus set no requirement for anyone to believe that he rose on the third day. In order to gain eternal life, all Jesus said was that we have to believe in Him.
John 3:16: For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
John 3:36 He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.
1 John 5:13 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
The apostles did not write the gospel stories.
What did the early martyrs of the Baha'i Faith have to gain my making up stories?
“Consider these martyrs of unquestionable sincerity, to whose truthfulness testifieth the explicit text of the Book, and all of whom, as thou hast witnessed, have sacrificed their life, their substance, their wives, their children, their all, and ascended unto the loftiest chambers of Paradise. Is it fair to reject the testimony of these detached and exalted beings to the truth of this pre-eminent and Glorious Revelation, and to regard as acceptable the denunciations which have been uttered against this resplendent Light by this faithless people, who for gold have forsaken their faith, and who for the sake of leadership have repudiated Him Who is the First Leader of all mankind? This, although their character is now revealed unto all people who have recognized them as those who will in no wise relinquish one jot or one tittle of their temporal authority for the sake of God’s holy Faith, how much less their life, their substance, and the like.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 182-183
The Bible says there is something God cannot do. It is impossible for God to lie. And the Bible uses the word 'impossible' because lying and deceitfulness are repulsive, are so disgusting to God, He would never do it. That means you can trust His integrity; you can trust His promises. That means when God says it in the Bible, you can trust it.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Because I believe that the soul is responsible for consciousness. The soul works through the brain and mind when we are alive on a physical body but after our body and brain die and have ceased to function the soul continues to function because it was the soul that was responsible for consciousness in the first place.
You are free to question whatever you want. You will probably question until you die and find out for yourself.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
The problem with that is that God did not write the Bible. Men wrote it and men can lie or be mistaken.
There is evidence that the apostle John wrote the gospel of John. Why Everyone Should Believe The Apostle John Wrote The Last Gospel | Reasons for Jesus
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Only up until the point of physical death, because there is no outline of what happens after that.
I believe that death is not natural and it exists because of sin.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
I suppose that is possible, and given what John says about the Comforter and the Spirit of Truth it is even likely.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
I believe that death is natural and it exists because God created humans as mortal beings.
How, in your view, could it be possible for the consciousness of a live human to exist after death?
Would it help if I run through a few of the very very many problems with dualism?
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
Consciousness exists after death because the soul is responsible for consciousness and the soul is immortal.
Go ahead, at least then I would understand your position.
Adam and Eve were created to live forever in the Garden of Eden. Because they ate the forbidden fruit, they were banned from partaking of the tree of life.
Did you know that the Bible is full of scientific and medical facts, written thousands of years before man discovered them?
The only thing that we know of God is written in the bible. However, some claim that they can feel God's presence in their lives.
Still others claim that they have psychic visions.
Clearly the bible teaches that psychics are real. After all, the entire chapter of the bible, called Revelation is from psychic knowledge.
One can roll on the floor and speak in tongues like "kloijsflsjkdflk" and speak the language of God. That should prove that God exists. It is information obtained in exactly the same way that psychics get info from God. It is information obtained in exactly the same way that psychics got info to write Revelation in the bible.
Some question if their own psychic visions are correct, but they cannot wonder for long, because God wants them to know that their visions are true and correct, so he sends them visions of things that are about to happen in their own lives.
Revelation is in the bible, and it was written by a psychic, presumably, Saint John the Divine, and it is about two demons (the dragon, and his son, the beast). Both demons, according to the bible, are from the bottomless pit of hell, and the bible goes into the smoke emanating from that pit. The bible says that the demons would inhabit human beings (father and son), and rise to the level of president (Revelation 17:18 says that the woman that you saw was the most powerful and richest nation of the world). That woman is called the Whore of Babylon, and it is the United States. The United States, at the time, was the richest and most powerful nation in the world, and it did go to war with Iraq twice, just as Revelation said, and it did occupy Babylon, Iraq, just as Revelation said, and it did corrupt Babylon (altering its elections to make sure that they voted for pro-American leaders). The US doesn't dare back out of Iraq now because they would topple the puppet regime installed by the US if the US backed out now.
Recently, God felt that it was necessary to warn people (again) that they should not attack Iraq or God will end all life on earth, and torture them severely in the mean time (for example, Revelation 15 is about seven plagues, of which, COVID is undoubtedly one).
These are the psychics of God (those who God ordered to tell the world not to attack Iraq).
Of course the psychics of God are real. They say exactly what was already said in Revelation (don't attack Iraq or face God's wrath).
Yet, in talking to the psychics of God, I realized that some began to wonder about their own sanity. After all, it isn't every day that you get to talk to God or get orders from God to save the world.
But the psychics of God were also given insight about world events that affected their own lives, so that they would come to know that the predictions they were given from God were real, and they absolutely could not disbelieve no matter what. For example, one psychic of God was given the information that actor Steve Reeves (who played Superman) would have a severe neck injury that would paralyze him (and that came to pass). Another psychic of God was given information that a heat tile would fall off of the space shuttle and that it would break up and crash over Texas rather than landing safely in Florida (and that came to pass, as well).
Many of the psychics of God were atheists, or scientists who didn't believe in ESP. But, the psychics of God had no choice but to believe that their psychic visions were coming true. I had the special privilege of chatting with several of them.
When the psychics of God read the mind of President George W. Bush, they were scared to death. Suddenly, they were confronted with a demonic spirit that was incredibly powerful and evil....powerful enough to be here after escaping the bottomless pit of hell. The spirit was dark and supremely evil. No wonder there were wars, torture camps, and destruction of God's environment. No wonder the homeless were ignored and the economy was destroyed.
George W. Bush continued the supposedly closed Project MKULTRA, in which psychics were forced into painful rituals to work for the government and spy on people. They spied on the psychics of God.
They tried to push away these government psychics, but one can't push away psychic power. One can only divert its direction and send false data back (which they did). They also made the government psychics nauseated by spinning them around, and this caused President W. Bush to cancel project MKULTRA permanently.
The psychics of God (ones that God, himself, chose) were already among the most powerful psychics on earth. Many had worked for the US government (Central Intelligence Agency), and some were working (free of charge) for the Association of Research and Enlightenment, in Virginia.
These psychics of God, whom we all know were real, confirmed that there was a God.
There is no other proof that God exists. After all, if the bible was written hundreds of years after Jesus and the disciples were dead, the only way the info could be true is if it was written psychically from God, himself. We think of the bible as being true, but the info came from the same source, and in the same way that the psychics of God got their information in modern times.
Since the message of the psychics of God is no different than info in the bible (it was just a reminder of what we already knew), we must trust that it is correct. So, there is an afterlife.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
That is a Christian doctrine that some Christians believe but it is not supported by what the Bible actually says.
Even if you believe that there was a forbidden fruit and that A & E were punished for eating it, the punishment was not physical death. Physical death would have occurred regardless of whether A & E ate the fruit because the human body is mortal.
Read these verses. It was only AFTER God delineated all the punishments for eating the fruit from the tree that God said that Adam would return to dust!
12 And the man said, The woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat.
13 And the Lord God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat.
14 And the Lord God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life:
15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.
16 Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.
17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;
18 Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;
19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.
The very last verse in the series is this one:
19 In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.
How could anyone with any logical abilities believe that returning to dust was part of the punishment?!
All God was saying is that AFTER Adam and Eve endure all the punishments delineated in the preceding verses they will return to dust (die) Of course Adam and Eve will die at the end of their life.
Trailblazer
Veteran Member
No, I did not know that.
... but you don't have objective evidence to support this belief. We've gone around in a circle.
It seems... unlikely that I'll be finding anything out after I'm dead.
Are you saying that the new heaven and new earth was God's original intent?