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Where does the Quran say Muhammad is the last Messenger of God?

loverofhumanity

loverofhumanity

We are all the leaves of one tree
Premium Member
Link said:
Having no leader right now, means we would cut off from God with no connection. Bahaism couldn't continue Imammate, because Baha'allah offspring left his religion. It's your problem, not ours.

We still believe in Imam in present time like Quran says for every people there is a guide.
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Baha’u’llah in His Will appointed Abdul-Baha and He appointed in His Will Shoghi Effendi. Then according to the Most Holy Book, the Universal House of Justice came into existence endowed with infallibility by Baha’u’llah in His Kitab-i-Aqdas. So we have had infallible Divine Guidance for over 170 years.

Baha’u’llah abolished priesthood because of the suffering they have caused the Prophets of God, but the 12 Imams we believe were infallible.
 
Link

Link

Veteran Member
Premium Member
loverofhumanity said:
Baha’u’llah in His Will appointed Abdul-Baha and He appointed in His Will Shoghi Effendi. Then according to the Most Holy Book, the Universal House of Justice came into existence endowed with infallibility by Baha’u’llah in His Kitab-i-Aqdas. So we have had infallible Divine Guidance for over 170 years.

Baha’u’llah abolished priesthood because of the suffering they have caused the Prophets of God, but the 12 Imams we believe were infallible.
Click to expand...

So no Ahlulbayt, instead of house of fallible humans and calling them infallible guidance. Great.

Nothing to do with Quranic guidance and argument for the family of the reminder as the guidance.
 
loverofhumanity

loverofhumanity

We are all the leaves of one tree
Premium Member
Link said:
So no Ahlulbayt, instead of house of fallible humans and calling them infallible guidance. Great.

Nothing to do with Quranic guidance and argument for the family of the reminder as the guidance.
Click to expand...

It’s the same with Prophet Muhammad and the Christians. Why do not the Christians accept Muhammad? They use the same argument, that He is not mentioned in the Bible and so disbelieve. But you and I we know that is not true. But their leaders teach them Muhammad is a false Prophet. Are they right? Of course not but all Christians believe them. So they reject Prophet Muhammad.

This proves that people can make mistakes. So Christians have made a huge mistake in not accepting Muhammad but they don’t realise it. But you and I know that Muhammad is a Messenger of God.

So just saying Baha’u’llah is false is not necessarily true. We could be making the same mistake Christians have made about Muhammad. We need always to be humble before God because it is always pride which causes man to disbelieve.

Caiphas was the most knowledgeable in scripture yet He rejected the Spirit Jesus. The Popes have so much knowledge yet they rejected Muhammad. Now in this age we see once again, those who claim to have knowledge, reject the Bab and Baha’u’llah and put the Bab to death and exiled Baha’u’llah for 40 years.

36:30

30 Oh the misery of men! No apostle cometh unto them, but they laugh him to scorn.

40:5

Each nation hath plotted darkly against their Messenger to lay violent hold on Him, and disputed with vain words to invalidate the truth.”
 
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Audie

Audie

Veteran Member
loverofhumanity said:
It’s the same with Prophet Muhammad and the Christians. Why do not the Christians accept Muhammad? They use the same argument, that He is not mentioned in the Bible and so disbelieve. But you and I we know that is not true. But their leaders teach them Muhammad is a false Prophet. Are they right? Of course not but all Christians believe them. So they reject Prophet Muhammad.

This proves that people can make mistakes. So Christians have made a huge mistake in not accepting Muhammad but they don’t realise it. But you and I know that Muhammad is a Messenger of God.

So just saying Baha’u’llah is false is not necessarily true. We could be making the same mistake Christians have made about Muhammad. We need always to be humble before God because it is always pride which causes man to disbelieve.

Caiphas was the most knowledgeable in scripture yet He reject the Spirit Jesus. The Popes have so much knowledge yet they rejected Muhammad. Now in this age we see once again, those who claim to have knowledge, reject the Bab and Baha’u’llah and put the Bab to death and exiled Baha’u’llah for 40 years.

36:30

30 Oh the misery of men! No apostle cometh unto them, but they laugh him to scorn.

40:5

Each nation hath plotted darkly against their Messenger to lay violent hold on Him, and disputed with vain words to invalidate the truth.”
Click to expand...
No chance you are among the people who make mistakes huh?
 
InvestigateTruth

InvestigateTruth

Veteran Member
MyM said:
Because in Islam, ALAH TELLS THE TRUTH. He said it was the last, and it is. He said no more. He told us through Quran and Sunnah the very things to prepare for before our judgement. Men take their Creator for granted and it will be too late one day.
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It is a misunderstanding that because Allah completed our Religion, no more Prophet will come.

Allah had completed His favour on People of Joseph as well:

"So will thy Lord choose thee [Joseph], and teach thee the interpretation of tales, and perfect His blessing upon thee and upon the House of Jacob, as He perfected it formerly on thy fathers Abraham and Isaac." (12:6)

Then, the followers of Joseph also thought Allah will not send any more Messengers:

"Joseph already came to you earlier with clear proofs, yet you never ceased to doubt what he came to you with. When he died you said, ‘Allah will never send a messenger after him.’ This is how Allah leaves every transgressor and doubter to stray—" 40:34


So, your logic is same as them.


Completion means in its own time. It is like if you write a Book today, it does not mean next year you won't write another Book.
Allah in Quran never said He will never reveal another Book after Quran.


Allah had already completed a Book through Moses for those who want to follow and do good:

"Then We gave Moses the Book, complete for him who does good". (6:155)

If Book of Moses is complete for those who want to do good, why Allah sent Injil, or Quran?

Muslim scholars made up this idea that our religion is the last one, then the Muslims were just following their scholars, same as People of the Book who took their scholars as God:

"They have taken their scholars and monks as lords besides Allah..." 9:31

It does not mean the people of Book actually believed their scholars are God, but they follow and believe them, as if they are God.

This is what Prophet Muhammad said:

Abu Sa'id al-Khudri reported Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) as saying:

"You would tread the same path as was trodden by those before you inch by inch and step by step so much so that if they had entered into the hole of the lizard, you would follow them in this also. We said: Allah's Messenger, do you mean Jews and Christians (by your words)" those before you"? He said: Who else (than those two religious groups)?"

Sahih Muslim 2669a - The Book of Knowledge - كتاب العلم - Sunnah.com - Sayings and Teachings of Prophet Muhammad (صلى الله عليه و سلم)
 
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InvestigateTruth

InvestigateTruth

Veteran Member
Link said:
So no Ahlulbayt, instead of house of fallible humans and calling them infallible guidance. Great.

Nothing to do with Quranic guidance and argument for the family of the reminder as the guidance.
Click to expand...
Whenever God wants He can send us a new Messenger or a new Lead. If He did not send anyone, it means His religion is currently complete and good enough.
Moreover, we can pray and receive guidance and confirmations.
I don't know where you get the idea that the Ahlulbayt is suppose to last forever.
In Islam, after 11th Imam, there was no Leader among people.
The belief that Mahdi was born and then went to occupation contradicts with Hadithes and Quran.
As I quoted, according to Hadithes, the Mahdi will disappear after His rise.
It seems that, the Shias do not read their own Hadithes.

The disappearance of Qaim is said by Imam Ali to be six Days, or Six Months or Six years:

Al-Asbagh ibn Nabata said:

"I went to the Commander of the Believers (as), I found him drawing lines on the ground, so I said to him: 'O Commander of the believers, why do I see you contemplating and drawing lines on the ground? Do you desire it? So he said: “By Allah, I have never desired it nor have i ever desired the world. Rather, I was thinking about a man who will be born from the eleventh from my sons, he is the Mahdi who will fill this world with justice and equity just as it was filled with oppression and injustice. There will be a confusion and an absence for him, people will go astray in it, and some others will be guided in it” So I said? How long will that confusion and absence be? So he (as) said: “Six days, or six months, or six years"



Non of these durations match with what Shias believe about disappearance of the Qaim:

The Minor Occultation (Arabic: ٱلْغَيْبَة ٱلصُّغْرَىٰ, al-Ghaybah aṣ-Ṣughrā) (874–941 CE), also known as the First Occultation .

Minor Occultation - Wikipedia

So, according to Shia belief Mahdi's minor Occultation lasted for 67 years (874-941 CE). It does not match with 6 days, 6 months or 6 years.
And As it is said in Hadithes, His disappearance is like Joseph imprisonment. Again, the Minor Occultation that Shia believes, has no similarity with Joseph and imprisonment.

I am not saying abandon your belief. It is upto you to keep it. But it just contradicts with Hadithes.
 
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Truthseeker

Truthseeker

Non-debating member when I can help myself
MyM said:
What I am saying, Allah will not add anything else to the religion HE SAID SO HIMSELF. HE PERFECTED IT--nothing will be added or deleted from it. If you say yes, then you will be calling Allah a liar. astaghfirallah
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I agree to disagree. You have your opinion, and I have mine.
 
MyM

MyM

Well-Known Member
2ndpillar said:
"Injeel", Yeshua, said false prophets are coming (Matthew 24:11, and will "mislead" the "many", and of course, there have been many false prophets who followed, including some supposed character cobbled into history, who was called Mohammad.
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Yes, he did say that false prophets will appear but THEY WON'T BE SENT BY ALLAH. There's a difference. Mohammad pbuh was and is considered one of the most influential people of all time...moreso than Jesus ever was.
Eesa on him peace, said many things in the Bible that Christians don't adhere to.

Muslims love Jesus on him peace and accept him as one of the mightiest messengers of God, but we don't take a man to be god or we don't say our "man-god" died. :)
 
MyM

MyM

Well-Known Member
Truthseeker said:
I agree to disagree. You have your opinion, and I have mine.
Click to expand...

You don't believe in the Quran?

“This day I have perfected for you your religion and completed My favor upon you and have approved for you Islam as religion” [al-Maa’idah 5:3]

“And the word of your Lord has been fulfilled in truth and in justice” [al-An‘aam 6:115]
 
MyM

MyM

Well-Known Member
2ndpillar said:
There were no Hadiths until the 9th century, yet supposedly there was a thriving Islamic religion beforehand. Not that the Islamic religion existed before the late 7th century, but it had no written background history until the 9th century, and little evidence of a Koran in surviving written form prior to the 8th century apart from incomplete fragments. What you have is a political narrative meant to compete with the history of the people of the book, the Jews, with parts taken from Jewish, Christian, and Persian text, incorporated with historical events from other places.
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You ARE MISINFORMED. Actually, that is an insult. Because the books from before Islam, have been (tarnished by the hands of men and Allah says so as well in the Quran) they have so many discrepancies that it is an insult to say they are from our Creator. But Allah doesn't say that about the Quran. He challenges mankind and he says you will fail. We are very fortunate to have a book like the Quran as a guide from our Creator.

So you are in denial. As a Muslim, I urge you to think with an open mind. Look into the Quran with sincerity and ask Allah to guide you to truth. :) Stop the hate, it isn't becoming :)
 
MyM

MyM

Well-Known Member
InvestigateTruth said:
It is a misunderstanding that because Allah completed our Religion, no more Prophet will come.

Allah had completed His favour on People of Joseph as well:

"So will thy Lord choose thee [Joseph], and teach thee the interpretation of tales, and perfect His blessing upon thee and upon the House of Jacob, as He perfected it formerly on thy fathers Abraham and Isaac." (12:6)

Then, the followers of Joseph also thought Allah will not send any more Messengers:

"Joseph already came to you earlier with clear proofs, yet you never ceased to doubt what he came to you with. When he died you said, ‘Allah will never send a messenger after him.’ This is how Allah leaves every transgressor and doubter to stray—" 40:34


So, your logic is same as them.


Completion means in its own time. It is like if you write a Book today, it does not mean next year you won't write another Book.
Allah in Quran never said He will never reveal another Book after Quran.


Allah had already completed a Book through Moses for those who want to follow and do good:

"Then We gave Moses the Book, complete for him who does good". (6:155)

If Book of Moses is complete for those who want to do good, why Allah sent Injil, or Quran?

Muslim scholars made up this idea that our religion is the last one, then the Muslims were just following their scholars, same as People of the Book who took their scholars as God:

"They have taken their scholars and monks as lords besides Allah..." 9:31

It does not mean the people of Book actually believed their scholars are God, but they follow and believe them, as if they are God.

This is what Prophet Muhammad said:

Abu Sa'id al-Khudri reported Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) as saying:

"You would tread the same path as was trodden by those before you inch by inch and step by step so much so that if they had entered into the hole of the lizard, you would follow them in this also. We said: Allah's Messenger, do you mean Jews and Christians (by your words)" those before you"? He said: Who else (than those two religious groups)?"

Sahih Muslim 2669a - The Book of Knowledge - كتاب العلم - Sunnah.com - Sayings and Teachings of Prophet Muhammad (صلى الله عليه و سلم)
Click to expand...

40_34.png


If you notice, Allah didn't say there wasn't going to be any messengers after him. you completely misinterpret. Allah said, "YOU SAID"---THE PEOPLE WHO DISBELIEVED IN YUSUF said that :)

And indeed Yûsuf (Joseph) already came to you earlier with the supreme evidence (s), yet in no way did you cease being in doubt concerning what he came to you with, until, when he perished, you said, Allah will never send forth (any) Messenger even after him." Thus Allah leads into error him who is extravagant and (always) suspicious."

During the time of Adam(alyahi salam) people went astray, same with Noah-Allah punished them, same thing with Abraham and Lot(remember Allah destroyed the entire city for their sins), so many prophets, and messengers...Moses, Sulaymon, David, Jesus, but they all knew of the mission that Allah wanted for them and they all knew of Mohammad pbuh to come. Allah says so in the Quran. Now that the last message was sent for the people of "understanding", in Islam, it is upon every soul on this earth to adhere to it. If they don't, in Islam, Allah says that they will regret it. For the last message is a warning as well not just a book of stories. It warns heavily for the misguided and guided alike. So, if you really think your way of misinterpreting the aya of Allah is beneficial for all, I say, be careful.

It isn't just the scholars that say this. ALLAH SAYS IT IN THE QURAN. If Allah says it in the Quran, we as Muslims KNOW IT TO BE TRUE.

Altabarani in the book "Al Mu'ajam Alkabeer (3026) and Al Awsat (5582), Imam Ahmad in the book "Al Musnad", Altahhawi in the book "Mushkil Al Aathar (4/104)

SAHEEH

Ali narrated through authentic narrations that the companion Hudaifa (on him peace) said: Prophet Mohammad pbuh said, "In my ummah(meaning all mankind after him muslims) liars and fakers, 27 in which 4 amongst them are women, and I am the final prophet and there are none after me. (meaning they will claim prophecy)
 
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