What is the trinity

[stanberger]

You answered most of your own questions in the beginning paragraph.
Jesus IS God.
He always existed.
Jesus is God's son, but also human because God caused a human woman to give birth to him.
Your last sentence doesn't really make sense to me... All three of them are God.

 

[stanberger]

bible disagrees. ' god is not a man ' this concept was roman paganism roman's had always worshipped their emperors as man/gods

 

[stanberger]

Trinity is what the Bible calls, the Godhead:
2capitalized
a: GOD sense 1
b: the nature of God especially as existing in three persons —used with the

Definition of GODHEAD

 

[stanberger]

trinity voted on at nicea 325ad by the same clergy who delight in chasing 11 yr old altar boys around the rectory. gals I left church for islam in 2002

 

[stanberger]

"The doctrine of the Trinity means that there is one God who eternally exists as three distinct Persons — the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Stated differently, God is one in essence and three in person. These definitions express three crucial truths: (1) The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are distinct Persons, (2) each Person is fully God, (3) there is only one God."

"One god, three persons."

What Is the Doctrine of the Trinity?

 

[stanberger]

clearly man made nonsense. foreign to Jesus ' greatest command is to worship OUR lord the one god only ' today only muslims obey Jesus greatest command

 

[stanberger]

Col 1:15-17
He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation; 16 because by means of him all other things were created in the heavens and on the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All other things have been created through him and for him. 17 Also, he is before all other things, and by means of him all other things were made to exist,

proverbs 8 :22,23 &30
22 Jehovah produced me as the beginning of his way,
The earliest of his achievements of long ago.
23 From ancient times I was installed,
From the start, from times earlier than the earth.



30 Then I was beside him as a master worker.
I was the one he was especially fond of day by day;
I rejoiced before him all the time;

 

[stanberger]

Jesus ate food. pooped in the woods. don't worship a man as god. god is not a man [bible]

 

[wellwisher]

I like the analogy of a person called Joe, who is a son to his parents, a husband to his wife and a father to his children. Joe is one person with three different hats, with each hat specialized to the unique needs of three generations.

Joe is respectful of his parent in ways that is different from his wife and children. He is intimate with his wife in ways that are unique to her. While he is firm but fair with his children, which is not how he treats his parents or wife. He will discuss things with them.

In computers, we can have a processor with many cores, with each core being designed to deal with specific tasks. The computer still has just one processor, even while multitasking.

The Trinity is connected to the three main hats used to worship God. In the Old Testament, God was the analogous parent of Joe; Father. In the New Testament, God is the analogous child of Joe; Son. The Holy Spirit is based on faith in the inner voice of truth. This is the most intimate personal connection to God; the analogous wife of Joe. These three roads can all lead to God.

The DNA based operating system of the human brain is grounded on the most basic of common human experience. These basic human observations, are engrained in the psyche over time The Trinity was modeled on the generational biological family of man, that is extrapolated into/from the Divine family of God.

An interesting application is during the holidays when all three generations get together and Joe has to deal with the three generations teaming up against him in fun. For example, Joe's parents and children team up, with Joe unable to discipline his parents, like children, for spoiling his children, who now will not listen since his parents are offering them cover. Or his mother like to push his bottoms, wants to know about his intimacy and asks his wife, with the kids listening; awkward.

Sometimes when the various cores of the trinity act in pairs, the individual and collective can be taken off balance. In the Old Testament there were prophets, but they were usually not taken seriously at the beginning, since they tried to make changes, that were not yet understood. Nobody wished to anger the Father, while not knowing this Holy Spirit also came from God.

Or the Christian; New Testament, who over uses the fire and brimstone of the Old Testament, along with the love of the son. This can create a paradox that is hard to explain to Atheists. Revelations is unique in that all three cores are active, with elements of Old and New Testament and inner spirit. In this case, Joe has had little extra to drink and lets his hair down. He becomes the funny friend to all.

 

[cataway]

perhaps it's not realized that there can only be one true perfect God. the theory of a trinity, a three-way division where all three parts are also equal only exists in pagan religions. what so-called Christion's have done is to paganize something that started out one way and then adulterated it to what it is now.

 

[cataway]

If all you do is post other scriptures and insinuate they disagree with the scriptures I posted then you are creating a contradiction which does not exist in reality. But of course you are tearing the Bible down as God's true word to us and making it look as if it contradicts itself. Maybe you should first try to show that the verses I posted do not mean what I insinuate they do mean.



The Son is the image of His Father, they are exactly like each other. But being the image does not mean that the Son had a beginning because the Son has always been the image of His Father in the timelessness before creation. In timelessness nothing changes. In that timelessness, the Beginning, the Word was already there (John 1:1-2) and did not come into existence (John 1:3)
The Watch Tower lies to you about the meaning of "firstborn" and so you think all it can mean is "first one born",,,,,,,,,,,but Jesus who was not the first man born or created was appointed to be the firstborn, the highest of the kings of the earth.
Prov 89:26 He will call to Me, ‘You are my Father, my God, the Rock of my salvation.’ 27I will indeed appoint him as My firstborn, the highest of the kings of the earth. 28I will forever preserve My loving devotion for him, and My covenant with him will stand fast.…
Look at the verse you posted below and see the highlighted text. That is not in the Greek and is a false translation by your exalted leaders. Without those highlighted words the truth is more easily seen.
Col 1:15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation; 16 because by means of him all other things were created in the heavens and on the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All other things have been created through him and for him. 17 Also, he is before all other things, and by means of him all other things were made to exist,

The text says that Jesus is "of creation" in your version and the WT says that means that He was part of creation. This is a disputed text and with the true meaning of firstborn the text actually means that He was "firstborn over creation". This is the same as Rev 3:14 where it says.
Rev 3:14 “And to the angel of the church in Laodicea write: ‘The words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of God’s creation.
"Beginning" here does not mean "first in time" but means "first in priority" He is the ruler of God's creation. This is why many translations have that "he is the ruler of God's creation".
I'll be extra nasty (truthful) here and point out that the NWT says "beginning of the creation by God" to make it look as if God created Him first.
The word "by" is a word that does not appear in the Greek text so that is another false translation by your exalted leaders in the "best translation in the world".
Getting back to Col 1:15-17 even if the text said that Jesus is part of creation that would be true of the man Jesus but not because He was created,,,,,,,,,,, because He stepped into the creation. The uncreated pre human Jesus became a man.




You can believe that the female "wisdom" who lives with "prudence" is Jesus if you wish but you should realise also that the translation of those verses differ in the translations.
Jehovah did not produce wisdom, God's wisdom has always existed. God possessed wisdom. (Possessed is a better translation)
"Not from ancient times", from "eternity."
In the Hebrew the emphasis given by the repeat indicates eternity, not just a long time ago. It is the same with Micah 5:2
Micah 5:2But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, who are small among the clans of Judah, out of you will come forth for Me One to be ruler over Israel— One whose origins are of old, from the days of eternity.
Prov 8:23 From everlasting I was established, from the beginning, before the earth began.…



You want Jesus to have been an assistant to YHWH at creation and with Him being the first of the created things. But we already know He was not created (John 1:3) and we know that He is YHWH since YHWH spread out the heavens by Himself (Is 44:24) but Heb 1:10 tells us that the heavens were the work of Jesus hands.
Isa 44:24 Thus says the Lord, your Redeemer,
who formed you from the womb:
“I am the Lord, who made all things,
who alone stretched out the heavens,
who spread out the earth by myself,
Heb 1:10And: “In the beginning, O Lord, You laid the foundations of the earth, and the heavens are the work of Your hands. 11They will perish, but You remain; they will all wear out like a garment.…

you said ''The Son is the image of His Father, they are exactly like each other.'' no, for the father can exist without the son ,yet the son can not exist with out the father. you want to say he is the image of his father ,yes a image he is . but not the true thing . what of Gen.1:26 ?
''26 Then God said: “Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness'' are you ready to declare you are exactly like God or even Jesus ?

 

[PruePhillip]

"The doctrine of the Trinity means that there is one God who eternally exists as three distinct Persons — the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Stated differently, God is one in essence and three in person. These definitions express three crucial truths: (1) The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are distinct Persons, (2) each Person is fully God, (3) there is only one God."

Was jesus god?
Was god jesus?
Was Jesus the spirit which existed before he did or was he a new spirit?
Was god his own son?
Is the spirit god and jesus or are god and jesus the spirit?

The doctrine of the Trinity is this -

"We worship one God in Trinity, and Trinity in Unity; neither confounding the persons; nor dividing the substance. For there is one Person of the Father; another of the Son, and another of the Holy Ghost.

"But the Godhead of the Father, of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost, is all one: the Glory equal, the Majesty co-eternal. Such as the Father is, so is the Son, and such is the Holy Ghost.

"The Father uncreate, the Son uncreate, and the Holy Ghost uncreate. The Father incomprehensible, the Son incomprehensible, and the Holy Ghost incomprehensible. The Father eternal, the Son eternal, and the Holy Ghost eternal.

"And yet there are not three eternals, but one eternal. Also there are not three incomprehensibles, not three uncreated: but one uncreated, and one incomprehensible.

"So likewise the Father is Almighty, the Son Almighty and the Holy Ghost Almighty. And yet there are not three Almighties, but one Almighty.

"So the Father is God, the Son is God, and the Holy Ghost is God. And yet there are not three Gods: but one God.

"So likewise the Father is Lord, the Son Lord, and the Holy Ghost Lord. And yet not three Lords but one Lord.

"For like as we are compelled by the Christian verity to acknowledge every person by himself to be God and Lord; so we are forbidden by the Catholic religion to say, There be three Gods, or three Lords.

"The Father is made of none; neither created, nor begotten. The Son is of the Father alone: not made, nor created, but begotten. The Holy Ghost is of the Father and of the Son; neither made, nor created, nor begotten, but proceeding.

"So there is one Father, not three Fathers; one Son, not three Sons: one Holy Ghost, not three Holy Ghosts.

"And in this Trinity none is afore, or after other, none is greater or less than others; but the whole three persons are co- eternal together; and co-equal. So that in all things as is aforesaid: the Unity in Trinity, and the Trinity in Unity is to be worshipped.

"HE THEREFORE THAT WILL BE SAVED MUST THUS THINK OF THE TRINITY."

If there is anything to despise the simplicity of the Gospel, this is it.

 

[InChrist]

If God is a single being, he can’t be 3 separate persons; that is grammatically incorrect. Perhaps you can restate it in a way that makes sense.

Yet, we say there is one human race composed of many individual persons, all having human nature, traits and characteristics. The scriptures state there is ONE GOD composed of Three persons, each with God Nature, traits, and characteristics.

 

[Kenny]

Yes; still one person. The idea that a single person can be physical, spiritual and conscious does not make that person 3 separate distinct beings.

And yet we can separate the body and the spirit as, in essence, two beings distinct from each other... I tend not to think that God is in my box of what I believe is impossible.

 

[Kenny]

trinity voted on at nicea 325ad by the same clergy who delight in chasing 11 yr old altar boys around the rectory. gals I left church for islam in 2002

It wasn't up for vote... it was written. What man does after... is what man does Leaving church for another group that also runs after young children is simply going out of a pot and into the fire.

 

[InChrist]

Col 1:15-17
He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation; 16 because by means of him all other things were created in the heavens and on the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All other things have been created through him and for him. 17 Also, he is before all other things, and by means of him all other things were made to exist,

proverbs 8 :22,23 &30
22 Jehovah produced me as the beginning of his way,
The earliest of his achievements of long ago.
23 From ancient times I was installed,
From the start, from times earlier than the earth.



30 Then I was beside him as a master worker.
I was the one he was especially fond of day by day;
I rejoiced before him all the time;

“Firstborn” in the Greek means preeminent over creation. It is not indicative that Jesus was created, rather His preeminence over all creation as the Creator.


Proverbs 8 in context, is plainly speaking about God’s wisdom. The section opens by telling us exactly what its purpose is: “for attaining wisdom”. Wisdom which has been with God from the beginning. It’s obvious from the context that the passage is not a reference to the Son because wisdom in this passage was poetically personified with the feminine pronoun. Even JW’s insist it’s a reference to the Son, the fact remains that wisdom has always been an attribute of God and has always been with God. It was not produced at some later point.


Does not wisdom cry out,
And understanding lift up her voice?
2 She takes her stand on the top of the high hill,
Beside the way, where the paths meet.
3 She cries out by the gates, at the entry of the city,
At the entrance of the doors:
4 “To you, O men, I call,
And my voice is to the sons of men.

Proverbs 8:1-4

 

[cataway]

“Firstborn” in the Greek means preeminent over creation. It is not indicative that Jesus was created, rather His preeminence over all creation as the Creator.


Proverbs 8 in context, is plainly speaking about God’s wisdom. The section opens by telling us exactly what its purpose is: “for attaining wisdom”. Wisdom which has been with God from the beginning. It’s obvious from the context that the passage is not a reference to the Son because wisdom in this passage was poetically personified with the feminine pronoun. Even JW’s insist it’s a reference to the Son, the fact remains that wisdom has always been an attribute of God and has always been with God. It was not produced at some later point.


Does not wisdom cry out,
And understanding lift up her voice?
2 She takes her stand on the top of the high hill,
Beside the way, where the paths meet.
3 She cries out by the gates, at the entry of the city,
At the entrance of the doors:
4 “To you, O men, I call,
And my voice is to the sons of men.

Proverbs 8:1-4

sure you can use the word preeminence
you could also use these words and they would all fit .greatest · leading · foremost · best · finest · chief · outstanding · excellent · distinguished · prominent · eminent · important · major · star · top ·
· topmost · famous · renowned · celebrated · illustrious · towering · supreme · superior · exceptional · unrivaled · unsurpassed · unequaled · inimitable · incomparable · matchless · peerless · unmatched · arch- · transcendent · marquee · supereminent

oh how great Jehovah's wisdom for bring his first of creatin into existence
proverbs 8 :22,23 &30
22 Jehovah produced me as the beginning of his way,
The earliest of his achievements of long ago.
23 From ancient times I was installed,
From the start, from times earlier than the earth.
30 Then I was beside him as a master worker.
I was the one he was especially fond of day by day;
I rejoiced before him all the time;

 

[Wildswanderer]

So its was god who was persicuted, not jesus?

How is that even a question? I just told you Jesus is God.

 

[Wildswanderer]

If I said I were one man, but 3 distinct persons, you would (rightfully) say I am not making sense; because a man IS a person. If God is a person, he can't be a single God yet 3 separate persons; that makes no sense.

Well nothing is impossible for God.

 

[1213]

....
Was jesus god?

Bible tells:

How can you believe, who receive glory from one another, and you don't seek the glory that comes from the only God?
John 5:44

This is eternal life, that they should know you, the only true God, and him whom you sent, Jesus Christ.
John 17:3

...the Father is greater than I.
John 14:28

For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,
1 Timothy 2:5

I think that means Jesus is not the one and only true God. By what the Bible tells, Jesus is the image of God and the temple of God.

in whom we have our redemption, the forgiveness of our sins; who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation.
Colossians 1:14

Don't you believe that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? The words that I tell you, I speak not from myself; but the Father who lives in me does his works.
John 14:10