What is nothing?

[Kilgore Trout]

So wouldn't nothing just be an extention of the concept of something then.

I'm not sure what you mean by "extension."

 

[freethinker44]

I'm not sure what you mean by "extension."

I mean, we normally would consider nothing and something as two different concepts, polar opposites of each other. If there is physically no object or energy occupying a region of space (I realize according to quantum physics space is a tangible thing, but for the purposes of the argument and ease of explanation let's assume space is a complete void of anything), we say there is nothing there, but there is never really an absence of anything, even a void with no definable characteristics is still something.

So the concepts of something and nothing aren't really separate at all, and nothing falls under the concept of something.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

I mean, we normally would consider nothing and something as two different concepts, polar opposites of each other. If there is physically no object or energy occupying a region of space (I realize according to quantum physics space is a tangible thing, but for the purposes of the argument and ease of explanation let's assume space is a complete void of anything), we say there is nothing there, but there is never really an absence of anything, even a void with no definable characteristics is still something.

So the concepts of something and nothing aren't really separate at all, and nothing falls under the concept of something.

It depends on how you are using the word nothing. If I say "there's nothing in my bank account," what something would that nothing be? If I say "nothing can accelerate to the speed of light," what something would that nothing be?

 

[freethinker44]

Nothing would be something

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Nothing would be something

Oh, that clears it all up.

 

[freethinker44]

Oh, that clears it all up.

I don't think there is a conclusive answer. Like I said in the first post, it is just a logic game. Like an exercise in thinking "outside the box".

 

[nameless]

nothingness is not just absence of something. True nothingness is the absence of both something and nothing, it is unthinkable nothingness.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

nothingness is not just absence of something, true nothingness is the absence of both something and nothing.

That's like saying true darkness is the absence of both light and dark.

 

[nameless]

That's like saying true darkness is the absence of both light and dark.

How about saying true light is the absence of both light and dark?

what i mean by true nothingness is unthinkable nothingness. But your darkness is same as true darkness.

that is the reason why Buddha remained silent, even the usage of nothingness, sometimes will be misinterpreted. The true nothingness which im talking about is the nothingness buddha told from his silence, the unknown nothingness.

 

[freethinker44]

Even true nothingness is still something

 

[Kilgore Trout]

How about saying true light is the absence of both light and dark?

Because that wouldn't make any sense either.

what i mean by true nothingness is unthinkable nothingness. But your darkness is same as true darkness.

that is the reason why Buddha remained silent, even the usage of nothingness, sometimes will be misinterpreted. The true nothingness which im talking about is the nothingness buddha told from his silence, the unknown nothingness.

Yeah, I think poetic language and koans are neat too.

 

[nameless]

Because that wouldn't make any sense either.

True nothingness is the absence of both something and nothing, it is unthinkable nothingness.

That's like saying true darkness is the absence of both light and dark.

yes i know, just meant your analogy was inappropriate.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

yes, just meant your analogy was inappropriate.

I'd be extremely interested in someone actually explaining why.

 

[Willamena]

Anything that can be posited is ultimately something, and nothing is no exception.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Anything that can be posited is ultimately something, and nothing is no exception.

"Nothing" is something - it is a word - it is also a concept - but those are separate from what the concept represents.

 

[nameless]

I'd be extremely interested in someone actually explaining why.

already explained in my previous post,

That's like saying true darkness is the absence of both light and dark.

here true darkness is just darkness.

True nothingness is the absence of both something and nothing.

By true nothingness i mean unthinkable nothingness.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

By true nothingness i mean unthinkable nothingness.

By true darkness, I mean unseeable darkness.

 

[Willamena]

"Nothing" is something - it is a word - it is also a concept - but those are separate from what the concept represents.

Right. What the concept represents is no exception from being positable.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Right. What the concept represents is no exception from being positable.

The concept is positable. The concept, and what it represents, are not the same thing.

 

[Willamena]

The concept is positable. The concept, and what it represents, are not the same thing.

When I posit that my feet hurt, I'm not talking about the concept. When I posit that nothing is real, I am similiarly not talking about the concept (though I am being deliberately and necessarily ambiguous).