What Happens When You Die?

[godnotgod]

In a recent interview, famed medical doctor and spiritualist Deepak Chopra stated the following:

Q: What happens when you die, Deepak?

Chopra: What happens when you die, is you return to where you always are. If you realize right now that there's no such thing as a person, you'll be all set.

Q: What do you mean, I'll be all set?

Chopra: Then if you shift your identity to that consciousness that is differentiating as observer and observant, you'll know there's nothing to fear.

Q: You have no fear of death.

Chopra: No Sir! Why? Because I don't exist in the first place!

Q: Can you get reincarnated as a soul?

Chopra: [Sighs] Wisps of memory and threads of desire, which are specks of information, latch onto specks of consciousness and show up as recycled human beings. But in the bigger picture, the observer, the observed, the process of observation, is a single reality.

Q: So... Deepak Chopra, as I know him [questioner taps the sitting Chopra solidly on the knee for effect] my friend Chopra... doesn't exist?

Chopra: A transient behavior of... the total universe.

What do you think Chopra means when he says:

"What happens when you die, is you return to where you always are."

Here also is the video of the interview:

[youtube]erOD_2AxzI0[/youtube]
Deepak Chopra "Life After Death" Interview Hottype - YouTube

 

[strikeviperMKII]

We are dust, and unto dust we shall return is another way of putting it. He is speaking of both the infinity and the finality of life. The great paradox that in order to live, you must die, but in dying, you live far more than you ever do it life.

 

[godnotgod]

We are dust, and unto dust we shall return is another way of putting it. He is speaking of both the infinity and the finality of life. The great paradox that in order to live, you must die, but in dying, you live far more than you ever do it life.

While that may be true, the question has to do with the statement that, when we die, we return to where we ALWAYS are, the implication being that we are in a place we have never left; that the journey of life and death are temporary extensions of our true reality; and that there is a truer existence beyond both of them.

Notice that Chopra says that he is not afraid of death because he does not exist. Something that does not exist cannot die, so what, then, is there to fear? In other words, death (and life) are illusory.


'All of life is filled with coming and going*. Show me the path where there is no coming and there is no going'
Zen aphorism

*coming and going = 'birth and death'

 

[strikeviperMKII]

Now that I've actually watched the entire interview, I have to say I'm a little more wary of this guy's ideas. Seems to me that he's trying to make everything equal, and everything 'good', and not acknowledge the fact that some things in life are difficult and must be so. Perhaps that is because he has faced his fear of death and dealt with it, but that does not mean you can take that fear away.

I am also surprised that these ideas were said to be in conflict with judeo-christian beliefs, which they aren't. Christianity is built on the concept that death does not end life, it is merely a letting go.

As for the idea that we are returning to a place we had never left, I can agree with that. The goal of life is to see with the eyes you had before you were born, meaning that we started before birth, and we won't end after death.

An interesting paradox of life is that in order to live it, we must die, but in order to die we must first live. We live for the barest of moments before death strikes and pulls that life away. Only when we can accept both the having and the not having that life is truly lived.

 

[godnotgod]

Now that I've actually watched the entire interview, I have to say I'm a little more wary of this guy's ideas. Seems to me that he's trying to make everything equal, and everything 'good', and not acknowledge the fact that some things in life are difficult and must be so. Perhaps that is because he has faced his fear of death and dealt with it, but that does not mean you can take that fear away.

Actually, you can. It is just that it has become so much a hard-wired function of our awareness that we think it impossible to be rid of it. We inherit much of our fears from our animal ancestry, when survival meant fight or flight. The rest come about as a result of our ignorance. That is why we need to seek the enlightened mind; it alone can show us the true nature of all fear.

The difficult becomes even more difficult, if not impossible, where fear and paranoia rule the mind. When one knows the true nature of fear, it is a much easier task to deal with it.

 

[godnotgod]

I am also surprised that these ideas were said to be in conflict with judeo-christian beliefs, which they aren't. Christianity is built on the concept that death does not end life, it is merely a letting go.

I must disagree. The whole idea of the Resurrection is that death is conquered. This idea of conquering death comes as a result of ignorance as to the true nature of both life and death. When one understands that death cannot be conquered, that death is inextricably tied to llfe, one no longer fights death; one accepts it. However, upon acceptance, one realizes the illusory nature of both life and death. That is why I asked about the path that is neither coming nor going. Life and Death are relative, and therefore, temporal. What lies beyond them is the Infinite, the Absolute, and that is what Chopra is referring to when he says he only returns to where he has always been. The wave emerges from the sea and returns to it. In effect, nothing has happened.

 

[The Sum of Awe]

I think he's just making things difficult...

 

[strikeviperMKII]

Actually, you can. It is just that it has become so much a hard-wired function of our awareness that we think it impossible to be rid of it. We inherit much of our fears from our animal ancestry, when survival meant fight or flight. The rest come about as a result of our ignorance. That is why we need to seek the enlightened mind; it alone can show us the true nature of all fear.

The difficult becomes even more difficult, if not impossible, where fear and paranoia rule the mind. When one knows the true nature of fear, it is a much easier task to deal with it.

You can overcome fear, but you cannot remove it. To live fearless is impossible, nor is it healthy. To pretend to be that way is even worse. Fear teaches us many important things, and to disregard that is to disregard yourself.

 

[strikeviperMKII]

Life and Death are relative, and therefore, temporal. What lies beyond them is the Infinite, the Absolute, and that is what Chopra is referring to when he says he only returns to where he has always been. The wave emerges from the sea and returns to it. In effect, nothing has happened.

In order to return, we must have been somewhere else in the first place. We come to this life, and we go to the next in the simplest terms. But life is full of many comings and goings, through which we learn. Life and death happen, which makes them absolute universal truths to me. I think he is merely saying that the going (the big death) is not an end, which many world religions would agree with.

 

[strikeviperMKII]

I think he's just making things difficult...

Explain please.

 

[godnotgod]

In order to return, we must have been somewhere else in the first place. We come to this life, and we go to the next in the simplest terms. But life is full of many comings and goings, through which we learn. Life and death happen, which makes them absolute universal truths to me. I think he is merely saying that the going (the big death) is not an end, which many world religions would agree with.

When you are in dream-sleep, you may visualize living another life in another time, or being somewhere completely different. However, you are always right here, right now. When you awaken, you realize your dream was not real. In the same manner, we are asleep, living in a dream-world, which only seems real. This includes life and death. When these dualities are transcended and we awaken, we understand them as illusory. Most people live in Waking Sleep, the Third Level of Consciousness, in which they firmly believe themselves to be awake and that the characters they are playing are real; that their lives are real; that their deaths are real. But who, exactly, is it that lives and dies? Did you notice what Chopra said? He said that when you realize that you are not a person, then you are all set. He is saying that the character we live is not real, though it seems real. Only when we awaken and enter the Fourth Level of Consciousness, that of Self-Transcendence, do we see the illusory nature of what we normally think of as 'reality'. It is this spiritual awakening process that allows us to see that we never actually left; we have been here all along, acting out our dramas as characters in a play whose script has been written by others. We have been asleep.

What do you mean "We come to this life, and we go to the next..."? Where is 'this life' and where is 'the next'? Are you saying there are two realms of existence?

You say that life and death are 'absolute universal truths'. However, these are temporal states of existence, so how can they be 'absolute'? Once again, I ask you: who is it that lives? Who is it that dies?

No, Chopra is not merely saying that death is a continuum. He is saying we arrive where we have always been, and that is Here, Now, this eternal Present Moment. Yeshua said it:

'Before Abraham was, I AM'

Abraham was a product of history, of time. Yeshua is a spiritually awakened Master who has transcended both time and death, and lives only in the Present, where there is no history; no memory.

You see. We have all been taught that the past creates the present, but that is not so; it is the present which creates the past. The ship creates the wake; the wake does not create the ship. All things emerge from this living Present Moment to create the past.

Chopra is not saying, as religions do, that there is another world into which we go after death; he is clearly saying we return to where we have always been, and that is Here, Now.

Everything is occurring here and now. Life and death occur simultaneously, here, now.

The Buddhists tell us that to conceptualize a belief in 'another realm' is a substantial, delusive idea.

'Thou hast nor youth nor age, but, as it were, an after-dinner sleep, dreaming on both'
TS Elliot

 

[godnotgod]

You can overcome fear, but you cannot remove it. To live fearless is impossible, nor is it healthy. To pretend to be that way is even worse. Fear teaches us many important things, and to disregard that is to disregard yourself.

Overcoming fear is not understanding what its nature is. You are still ignorant. You can only understand the true nature of fear when you are seeing correctly. And understanding the true nature of fear allows you to make rational decisions.

Do you think a martial artist has time for fear? He could be dead in an instant. He must rely on his intellect, unobstructed by fear.

You can be afraid of a rattler, but if you allow fear to rule you, the rattler may strike at you. If you rely on your intellect, you may understand that to be still is the best thing to do.

I think you are speaking of caution, not fear. I am not saying we should be foolish. That is what got us into an unnecessary war with Iraq.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

We are dust, and unto dust we shall return is another way of putting it. He is speaking of both the infinity and the finality of life. The great paradox that in order to live, you must die, but in dying, you live far more than you ever do it life.

'In order to live, you must die'.....Die in order to be resurrected.
Except for those of Matt [12v32], one's death frees or acquits from sin.
The price we pay for sin is: death. -Romans 6vs7,23
Jesus ransom makes possible the resurrection from death. -Matt 20v28

But, what about those that are still alive-and-living on earth at the time of separation of Matthew 25vs31,32 ?
They can gain everlasting life without ever having to die because they can remain alive-and-living on earth right into the start of Jesus messianic [1000-year] reign over earth.

 

[strikeviperMKII]

When you are in dream-sleep, you may visualize living another life in another time, or being somewhere completely different. However, you are always right here, right now. When you awaken, you realize your dream was not real. In the same manner, we are asleep, living in a dream-world, which only seems real. This includes life and death. When these dualities are transcended and we awaken, we understand them as illusory. Most people live in Waking Sleep, the Third Level of Consciousness, in which they firmly believe themselves to be awake and that the characters they are playing are real; that their lives are real; that their deaths are real. But who, exactly, is it that lives and dies? Did you notice what Chopra said? He said that when you realize that you are not a person, then you are all set. He is saying that the character we live is not real, though it seems real. Only when we awaken and enter the Fourth Level of Consciousness, that of Self-Transcendence, do we see the illusory nature of what we normally think of as 'reality'. It is this spiritual awakening process that allows us to see that we never actually left; we have been here all along, acting out our dramas as characters in a play whose script has been written by others. We have been asleep.

Agreed.

What do you mean "We come to this life, and we go to the next..."? Where is 'this life' and where is 'the next'? Are you saying there are two realms of existence?

No. I am merely referring to the process by which we have the spiritual awakening you are talking about. It feels very much like gaining an entirely new life, but it really is the one we've had all along.

You say that life and death are 'absolute universal truths'. However, these are temporal states of existence, so how can they be 'absolute'? Once again, I ask you: who is it that lives? Who is it that dies?

Absolute truths in that you must die in order to live. This spiritual awakening is not a thought experiment. We do not think our way into a new way of being. We actually have to be that way. This requires a death of our old ways, our old plans. This transition requires a passage through the present moment, to gain the understanding of what YAHWEH means when he says "I am who am" as you explained. Those who live are the ones who experience this death. Those who do not, do not live.

 

[strikeviperMKII]

'In order to live, you must die'.....Die in order to be resurrected.
Except for those of Matt [12v32], one's death frees or acquits from sin.
The price we pay for sin is: death. -Romans 6vs7,23
Jesus ransom makes possible the resurrection from death. -Matt 20v28

But, what about those that are still alive-and-living on earth at the time of separation of Matthew 25vs31,32 ?
They can gain everlasting life without ever having to die because they can remain alive-and-living on earth right into the start of Jesus messianic [1000-year] reign over earth.

You are thinking of death in only the physical. Death is not simply the end of the body. It doesn't have to be about that. And I guarantee you, you cannot gain what we call 'everlasting life' or as Chopra says is the 'continuum' without going through some sort of death. The self, the ego, our wants desires and plans must die before we realize this wonderful mystery.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

You are thinking of death in only the physical. Death is not simply the end of the body. It doesn't have to be about that. And I guarantee you, you cannot gain what we call 'everlasting life' or as Chopra says is the 'continuum' without going through some sort of death. The self, the ego, our wants desires and plans must die before we realize this wonderful mystery.

Can't disagree about gaining a 'spiritual life' in the sense of previously being 'spiritually dead'. But, that does not guarantee everlasting life as gaining 'everlasting spiritual' life, or 'everlasting physical' life, or 'spirit' life forever in the heavens.

Jesus talked of eternal or everlasting life about living forever in the heavens, or living forever on earth as was originally offered to Adam.
Without that 'life' there could be no continuation of a spiritual life anywhere in heaven or on earth.

The actual dead [dead mind, body and spirit] that are to be literally resurrected back to life, would be to either live life in heaven,
or live everlasting life on earth starting at the time of Jesus millennial reign over earth.

 

[strikeviperMKII]

Can't disagree about gaining a 'spiritual life' in the sense of previously being 'spiritually dead'. But, that does not guarantee everlasting life as gaining 'everlasting spiritual' life, or 'everlasting physical' life, or 'spirit' life forever in the heavens.

This spiritual life is everlasting life. It is life in the moment. The naked now before God, with God, in God. Heaven on Earth, as some call it. Physical life is meaningless in the present moment.

Jesus talked of eternal or everlasting life about living forever in the heavens, or living forever on earth as was originally offered to Adam.

Where?

 

[cablescavenger]

In a recent interview, famed medical doctor and spiritualist Deepak Chopra stated the following:

Q: What happens when you die, Deepak?

Chopra: What happens when you die, is you return to where you always are. If you realize right now that there's no such thing as a person, you'll be all set.

Q: What do you mean, I'll be all set?

Chopra: Then if you shift your identity to that consciousness that is differentiating as observer and observant, you'll know there's nothing to fear.

Q: You have no fear of death.

Chopra: No Sir! Why? Because I don't exist in the first place!

Q: Can you get reincarnated as a soul?

Chopra: [Sighs] Wisps of memory and threads of desire, which are specks of information, latch onto specks of consciousness and show up as recycled human beings. But in the bigger picture, the observer, the observed, the process of observation, is a single reality.

Q: So... Deepak Chopra, as I know him [questioner taps the sitting Chopra solidly on the knee for effect] my friend Chopra... doesn't exist?

Chopra: A transient behavior of... the total universe.

What do you think Chopra means when he says:

"What happens when you die, is you return to where you always are."

Here also is the video of the interview:

[youtube]erOD_2AxzI0[/youtube]
Deepak Chopra "Life After Death" Interview Hottype - YouTube

He comes under criticism for talking up the spirit and talking down the medicine.

Here is a better video:

[youtube]Z-FaXD_igv4[/youtube]
Deepak Chopra Interview with Richard Dawkins - YouTube

 

[strikeviperMKII]

I think you are speaking of caution, not fear. I am not saying we should be foolish. That is what got us into an unnecessary war with Iraq.

No, I don't think you are saying we should be foolish, but caution is born of fear, one of the positive aspects of it. Being controlled by fear is the negative (being too cautious). There is always a balance, and understanding fear will give you that balance to 'beat' its hold over you. That is what I am saying when I say 'overcoming' fear. You no longer allow it to control your life or actions.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

This spiritual life is everlasting life. It is life in the moment. The naked now before God, with God, in God. Heaven on Earth, as some call it. Physical life is meaningless in the present moment.
Where?

How can spiritual life alone be everlasting life?
Even people with deep spiritual lives die.
Thoughts die at death.
Psalms 146v4; 115v17; 13v3; 6v5; Ecc. 9v5; Daniel 12vs2,13

The living humble sheep-like people of Matthew [25vs31,32,46] are living people that are alive on earth at the time when Jesus. as Shepherd, will separate living people as a shepherd separates sheep from goats.
The favored 'sheep' do not die but go off into everlasting life at that time.

They are the living ones that come out of the great tribulation of Rev. 7v14.
[Matthew 24v21; Isaiah 26v20]

In Matthew, Jesus refers to Psalm [37v11] that the meek will inherit the earth. Meaning the earthly realm of God's kingdom.
Which would include the humble or meek sheep-like ones of Matthew 25.
-[Daniel 7vs13,14; 2v44]

Jesus is the only one that can fulfill God's promise to Abraham that all the families of the earth will be blessed, and that all the nations of the earth will be blessed. Blessed with healing or curing of the nations.
- [Rev 22v2; Genesis 22 vs17,18; 12v3]
And as Isaiah wrote [33v24] the time will come when: No one will say, "I am sick."

Micah [4v3,4] mentions how each person will have their own vine and fig tree [food] and [security] because No one will make them afraid or tremble.

Jesus, as Prince of Peace, [Isaiah 9vs6,7] will usher in global Peace on Earth toward men of goodwill. Jesus, as king of God's kingdom, will have earthly subjects from sea to sea according to Psalm 72v8. Even animal kind will be at peace with human kind.- Isaiah [11vs3-9] Desserts will blossom.-Isaiah chapter 35.

Through Jesus then God will make all wars stop. -Psalm 46v9; Isaiah 2v4

Revelation [21vs4,5] mentions the time will come when there will be 'No more death'. Our last enemy 'death' will be brought to nothing.- [1st Cor. 15v26] Without enemy death there will only be life. Life without end or endless life.
Heavenly life for those of Revelation [5vs9,10; 14v4; 20v6],
and endless earthly life for the majority of mankind.