What does it mean to be an Atheist ( not a mocking thread)

[oldbadger]

Errr, surprise, you're a theist.

If I'm a Theist then you're a 7th day Adventist.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Theism describes an involved God. Specifically.

The term applies to all gods, including yours.

 

[oldbadger]

The term applies to all gods, including yours.

No it doesn't.

 

[LuisDantas]

Sure, people can believe whatever they want.


Yes, they can name their deity anything they want, but they would be going against the conventional and mainstream use of the word atheism if they were to believe in a deity.
People would just talk passed each other in this case.

It seems to me that there is not much of a conventional meaning for such words. That is why we so often do in fact talk past each other.

 

[Subduction Zone]

No it doesn't.

Your personal definition does not, but you do make the error of conflating Classical Theism with all theism.

Theism - Wikipedia

"Theism is broadly defined as the belief in the existence of the Supreme Being or deities.[1][2] In common parlance, or when contrasted with deism, the term often describes the classical conception of God that is found in monotheism (also referred to as classical theism) – or gods found in polytheistic religions—a belief in God or in gods without the rejection of revelation as is characteristic of deism.[3][4]

Atheism is commonly understood as rejection of theism in the broadest sense of theism, i.e. the rejection of belief in God or gods.[5] The claim that the existence of any deity is unknown or unknowable is agnosticism."

When talking about atheism and theism the context implies that one is using the terms in the broadest sense. In which case deism would be in the theism category.

 

[charlie sc]

It seems to me that there is not much of a conventional meaning for such words. That is why we so often do in fact talk past each other.

Sure, but we should at least try describe the words we mean and try to talk more about concepts rather than definitions. If someone wants to say atheism includes a god that intelligently created the universe and did nothing afterwards, then that's not what I mean by atheism. So, when I use atheism I won't include this, but if he/she wants to, that's fine. Let's see who is most stubborn and wants to force a definition down the other person's neck

 

[oldbadger]

Your personal definition does not, but you do make the error of conflating Classical Theism with all theism.

Theism - Wikipedia

"Theism is broadly defined as the belief in the existence of the Supreme Being or deities.[1][2] In common parlance, or when contrasted with deism, the term often describes the classical conception of God that is found in monotheism (also referred to as classical theism) – or gods found in polytheistic religions—a belief in God or in gods without the rejection of revelation as is characteristic of deism.[3][4]

Atheism is commonly understood as rejection of theism in the broadest sense of theism, i.e. the rejection of belief in God or gods.[5] The claim that the existence of any deity is unknown or unknowable is agnosticism."

When talking about atheism and theism the context implies that one is using the terms in the broadest sense. In which case deism would be in the theism category.

This seems like a bunch of folks telling a Democrat that he is really a Republican.
......Or telling a Christian that he's really a Muslim

We are what we identify ourselves as, I think. It is impossible that I can be any kind of Theist.

 

[Subduction Zone]

This seems like a bunch of folks telling a Democrat that he is really a Republican.
......Or telling a Christian that he's really a Muslim

We are what we identify ourselves as, I think. It is impossible that I can be any kind of Theist.

Or it is more like a person that has made his own definition of a word being corrected on common usage. If one thinks that there is a deity then by definition one is a theist.

 

[oldbadger]

Or it is more like a person that has made his own definition of a word being corrected on common usage. If one thinks that there is a deity then by definition one is a theist.

By your definition.
This reminds me of Christian creeds that declare all other churches are not Christians!
You get more like a religion all the time.

 

[rrobs]

According to the American Atheists website they state this

Atheism is one thing: A lack of belief in gods.
Atheism is not an affirmative belief that there is no god nor does it answer any other question about what a person believes. It is simply a rejection of the assertion that there are gods. Atheism is too often defined incorrectly as a belief system. To be clear: Atheism is not a disbelief in gods or a denial of gods; it is a lack of belief in gods.
What is Atheism? | American Atheists

But in many discussions in this forum with many good Atheists i come across many ways to describe what atheism is.

Could i get some more info from Atheists in this forum? What is Atheism to you?

I understand that Atheism is not a belief system. I really didn't know that before reading your post, but it makes sense. Thanks for the info.

Just curious; what do you think happens to people after they die? I'd be interested to hear an answer from someone like yourself who lacks a belief in god. Don't worry, I'm not going to proselytize you into believing in God or Jesus. I won't say a thing about that unless you ask. Like I said, I'm just curious

Take care...

 

[charlie sc]

By your definition.
This reminds me of Christian creeds that declare all other churches are not Christians!
You get more like a religion all the time.

We're just pointing out that your-stream definition of deism is not the mainstream. So you should keep that in mind. However, if you want to argue this point, please give a citation. Subduction Zone has already given a wiki link.

 

[icehorse]

In my experience most atheists are not "hard" atheists. A hard atheist is 100% sure there are no supernatural gods. Most atheists I know allow for the ever-so-slight chance that god(s) might exist, but it's really a tiny, tiny, tiny chance. Such "not-hard" atheists could have their minds changed if a god were to present predictable and repeatable evidence of his superpowers.

Then there are people like me who take it a step further. Not only am I an atheist, I also think that theism hurts society. So I'm an anti-theist (a term I learned from Christopher Hitchens).

 

[Polymath257]

I understand that Atheism is not a belief system. I really didn't know that before reading your post, but it makes sense. Thanks for the info.

Just curious; what do you think happens to people after they die? I'd be interested to hear an answer from someone like yourself who lacks a belief in god. Don't worry, I'm not going to proselytize you into believing in God or Jesus. I won't say a thing about that unless you ask. Like I said, I'm just curious

Take care...

I don't think the OP is an atheist, so I'll field this one.

What *I* believe? When we die, our bodies rot and our consciousness ceases to exist. We are like a candle flame that has been blown out.

I also think whatever meaning there is in life happens when we are alive: how we influence others, how we contribute, etc.

 

[oldbadger]

We're just pointing out that your-stream definition of deism is not the mainstream. So you should keep that in mind. However, if you want to argue this point, please give a citation. Subduction Zone has already given a wiki link.

So, let me get this clear. If I produce a clear statement (citation) that Deism is a form of atheism then you will concede and accept my position on this?

 

[charlie sc]

So, let me get this clear. If I produce a clear statement (citation) that Deism is a form of atheism then you will concede and accept my position on this?

I've already accepted this is how you use the word atheism/theism. However, I haven't accepted this is what is generally considered the most appropriate use of the word. So, if you give some blog where some nutter talks about bonkers stuff I won't accept it, but if you give a more reputable and objective citation, it'll certainly be considered

 

[Revoltingest]

In my experience most atheists are not "hard" atheists. A hard atheist is 100% sure there are no supernatural gods. Most atheists I know allow for the ever-so-slight chance that god(s) might exist, but it's really a tiny, tiny, tiny chance. Such "not-hard" atheists could have their minds changed if a god were to present predictable and repeatable evidence of his superpowers.

Then there are people like me who take it a step further. Not only am I an atheist, I also think that theism hurts society. So I'm an anti-theist (a term I learned from Christopher Hitchens).

Also many of us are hybrid weak-strong atheists.
1) We know that gods cannot be disproven, but since they aren't evidenced, we don't believe in them.
2) The idea of gods is so ridiculous, we just feel that they cannot exist.
It's a case of feeling one way, but logically knowing that they cannot be ruled out.

 

[LuisDantas]

Am I the only one here to have concluded that people are not necessarily constant on their stance towards theism and atheism?

There is really no good reason why they would have to be constant, either.

 

[Bob the Unbeliever]

That's wordy gobbledegook.

Theism describes an involved God. Specifically.

Nice attempt to re-define words in common usage. No wonder you have such great problems communicating with others...

 

[Revoltingest]

If I produce a clear statement (citation) that Deism is a form of atheism then you will concede and accept my position on this?

Deism is separate from atheism.
You don't get to learn our secret handshake.

 

[charlie sc]

Am I the only one here to have concluded that people are not necessarily constant on their stance towards theism and atheism?

There is really no good reason why they would have to be constant, either.

The only things atheists bicker about regarding their belief or non-belief are these stupid definitions. I'd much prefer seeing less aggressiveness/forcefulness of religious people towards outsiders. Then we wouldn't need the term atheism at all.