What church is the true church?

[Avoice]

The Jewish nation starts at the very moment when Abraham passes God's test. What was the test? FAITH. Or you and call it trust or fear.

The Jews in Egypt had no Mosaic law. But they were Jews just the same.
Read the book of Hebrews and (Genesis 22:5 and 22:8).

They were Israelites not Jews. The Israeli nation was not called Jewish until David's reign, if I remember right, because at that time the tribe of Judah took the reins of kingship in Israel.

Thank you I've read each about 20 maybe 30 times. What is your point?

 

[Avoice]

And when the Rich man asked him, he said "Follow the commandments".

Good point. How can one love another without obeying the commandments?

 

[McBell]

if it was purposed for a succession to take place, the scriptures would have stated so. Amos 3:7“The Sovereign Lord Jehovah will not do a thing unless he has revealed his confidential matter to his servants the prophets.”

nothing about succession has been disclosed in the scriptures so there is no foundation for it... it is nothing more then a man-made tradition...the sort of tradition Christ condemned the religious leaders in his day for creating.

So you don't have me on ignore after all...

Did you perhaps miss my question about the Book of Jasper?

 

[Xchristian]

The "True Church" is referring to Christians, not a literal church.

are you trying to tell me that jesus knew of all those churches?
or even that there's anything called 'christian'?

the name is very new mate, it was given as a derigatory term in Antioch.
jesus wasn't aware of any of that, that's all the making of people.

a man made religion, nothing to do with god (if there's one)

 

[Desert Snake]

are you trying to tell me that jesus knew of all those churches?
or even that there's anything called 'christian'?

the name is very new mate, it was given as a derigatory term in Antioch.
jesus wasn't aware of any of that, that's all the making of people.

a man made religion, nothing to do with god (if there's one)

Why don't you list some non-man made religions.

 

[Desert Snake]

They were Israelites not Jews. The Israeli nation was not called Jewish until David's reign, if I remember right, because at that time the tribe of Judah took the reins of kingship in Israel.

Thank you I've read each about 20 maybe 30 times. What is your point?

They weren't Israelites yet, they were Hebrews, commonly called "Jews", which incidentally is not related to the Mosaic laws.

 

[Xchristian]

Why don't you list some non-man made religions.

I appreciate your loss, however if you look at the title, you will notice that we are talking about the various churches, so I prefer to stick to topic.

thanks

xtianity is a man made religion.

jesus was never aware of those churches, he actully never knew he was god, a demi god, or even a messiah.

As much as he wished to be a messiah, sorry he wasn't.

 

[Desert Snake]

I prefer to stick to topic.

thanks

uh, no, it's because you can't answer the question , lol

xtianity is a man made religion.

so....

jesus was never aware of those churches, he actully never knew he was god, a demi god, or even a messiah.

relevance... if true?

As much as he wished to be a messiah, sorry he wasn't.

I never said He was. Can you figure out what you're saying as to the OP before trying to refute my comments?
lol

 

[Xchristian]

I won't 'lol', it's not the place for it.
On a more productive note, .. I pity all those who believe in the greek myth of christianity, please wake up.

 

[Desert Snake]

I won't 'lol', it's not the place for it.
On a more productive note, .. I pity all those who believe in the greek myth of christianity, please wake up.

Huh? nevermind, you lost the argument, realized that you haden't understood ehat "Christians" meant, you assumed it meant all the churches or something ??

Anyways nice way of back-peddling and .. furthermore, it has nothing to do with what I believe.

 

[Pegg]

So you don't have me on ignore after all...

Did you perhaps miss my question about the Book of Jasper?

no you are not on ignore, but a statement about something God said without a scripture reference doesn't make me inclined to go searching

give me a reference to where he said it and maybe I can address it

 

[Xchristian]

Huh? nevermind, you lost the argument, realized that you haden't understood ehat "Christians" meant, you assumed it meant all the churches or something ??

Anyways nice way of back-peddling and .. furthermore, it has nothing to do with what I believe.

I apologise, I won't comment on your 'opinions'

anyone knows of a christian who is not following the greek myth?

 

[Pegg]

They weren't Israelites yet, they were Hebrews, commonly called "Jews", which incidentally is not related to the Mosaic laws.

thats right, they were'nt actually Isrealites until Jabob became known as 'Isreal'


its just a technicality though.

 

[Pegg]

I apologise, I won't comment on your 'opinions'

anyone knows of a christian who is not following the greek myth?

yeah, i know about 7 million of them who dont

 

[Pegg]

This is about the local church; no where else. Aquila and Priscilla were avid teachers of the word; mighty evangelists.

all 'christians' were to be teachers and public preachers and ministers. That includes both men and women.

In Pauls own letter he speaks of women ministers
Romans 16:1 I recommend to YOU Phoe′be our sister, who is a minister of the congregation that is in Cen′chre·ae, 2 that YOU may welcome her in [the] Lord in a way worthy of the holy ones, and that YOU may assist her in any matter where she may need YOU, for she herself also proved to be a defender of many, yes, of me myself.
So its quite clear that teaching/public preaching/ministering is not what Paul had in mind when he said that women were to keep quiet in the congregation...women were active ministers in the first century even working along with Paul. This is why he could not have meant that women had to sit back with no role to play in the congregation. They had a role....it just wasnt in the capacity of leading the congregation in worship.

 

[Shiranui117]

except for 1: infant baptism, 2: trinity, 3: hellfire, 4: mary's sainthood as the mother of God, 5: Jesus as God, 6: clergy/laity class, 7: use of idols, 8: adherence to apochryphal writings, 9: building up of wealth, 10: paying priestly wages... 11: running the church like a business etc etc etc

1: Given the fact that entire households were baptized, and given Jesus' invitation to let the little children come to Him... Is infant baptism really so far-fetched?

2: Sure, you can argue against the Trinity, and sure, you can brush aside every Trinitarian prooftext as merely circumstantial or vague. But trying to say that Jesus is the Archangel Michael is completely indefensible.

3: There is indeed Hellfire; Jesus references it quite often, and then there's Revelations and Corinthians. The only question is, who ends up there, and what exactly is the hellfire.

4: "Henceforth all nations shall call me blessed" "Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb!" <-- Either of those two Scripture verses sound familiar?

5: How do you argue against Jesus being the God-Man? I know the JW's do some fiddling around with the wording of numerous passages implying Jesus' divinity, but how do you explain passages like Colossians 2:9 "For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily" or verses like Titus 2:13 and 2 Peter 1:1 calling Jesus our "God and Savior"?

6: Perhaps you'd like to explain 1 and 2 Timothy, which discuss the qualifications of bishops and deacons, and the proper conduct for priests? And perhaps you'd like to discuss 1 Peter 5:2, Acts 20:28? Also, do you forget Acts 6:2, where seven are appointed to serve (i.e. be a &#948;&#953;&#945;&#954;&#959;&#957;&#8051;&#969;, AKA deacon) the flock?

7: No one uses idols. Where're you getting this from?

8: So, because we use the same exact Old Testament as Jesus and the Apostles, that makes us DIFFERENT from the early Church? The logic, it is not present.

9: This is something every Christian denomination needs to work on, no matter which one you belong to.

10: Well hey, priests gotta eat too, and you can't get food for free. Both of the priests I know have to get secular jobs to support themselves, because a priest's wages aren't very lavish.

11: Which denomination runs a church like a business? What's a church "in the business" for?

calling yourself 'orthodox' does not actually mean you ARE orthodox.

Agreed. Which is why I can comfortably reject the Catholics, because they aren't really Catholic.

Never do you read of Jesus or any NT writer quote from any of the apocryphal writings, but they do use plenty of quotes from the hebrew canonical writings.

And? This isn't any reason to throw out the rest of the Septuagint. If they quote one chapter of an OT book but not another, can we throw out the chapter that didn't get quoted?

regardless of age, it is forbidden for a christian to charge a fee for the service of baptism...or any other form of service

“YOU received free, give free.” Matthew 10:8

“May your silver perish with you, because you thought through money to get possession of the free gift of God.” Acts 8:18-20

christianity was never for sale by the apostles

Then it's a good thing that no one charges a fee for baptism.

 

[roger1440]

They were Israelites not Jews. The Israeli nation was not called Jewish until David's reign, if I remember right, because at that time the tribe of Judah took the reins of kingship in Israel.

Thank you I've read each about 20 maybe 30 times. What is your point?

The corner stone of each church is Jesus. Understanding Jesus’s teaching on the Mosaic Law is essential to understanding who Jesus was or is. Therefore the true church or truer church would have a greater understanding of Jesus’s message. Jesus was not executed because of a violation of Roman law. He was executed because of a misunderstanding of the Mosaic Law.

Joh 18:31Then said Pilate unto them, Take ye him, and judge him according to your law. The Jews therefore said unto him, It is not lawful for us to put any man to death:

Joh 18:38Pilate saith unto him, What is truth? And when he had said this, he went out again unto the Jews, and saith unto them, I find in him no fault at all.

 

[gnostic]

the true church would be those who are members of the 144,000

I think it makes sense that the 144,000 are angels.

Revelation 14 tells us that these 144,000 are from mankind....

14:1&#8194;And I saw, and, look! the Lamb standing upon the Mount Zion, and with him a hundred and forty-four thousand having his name and the name of his Father written on their foreheads. ...4 These are the ones that keep following the Lamb no matter where he goes. These were bought from among mankind as firstfruits to God and to the Lamb

so they are not angels...they are christians who are anointed and chosen to rule with Christ in the heavenly kingdom as kings and priests.

I think it could be said that this means they were separated from being among mankind. That they were declared different.

the scripture says they were 'bought' from among mankind


it doesnt say they were different....just that God had chosen them from among mankind. It certainly doesnt say they were angels.

I don't see anything that indicates the 144,000 are all part of the same group or that it has anything to do with a "true church" the 144,000 need not even all have died in the same eras the way it is written.

Scripture interprets scripture and the scriptures clearly show who the 144.000 are and they are not the church, they are Jews, specifically 12.000 from each tribe listed.

JESUS!!! :foot:

Oops!

:sorry1: didn't mean to swear...

Of the all the Christians that replied in regarding to the Revelation's 144,000, only InChrist got the identity of 144,000 people right.

The 144,000 people to be saved, are Israelite, 12,000 from each tribe. It had nothing to do with angels, true church or true Christians.

Read Revelation 7:4-8. InChrist had already quoted the verses.

No-body was right in a way, that they (144,000) had nothing to do with Christians or "true church".

The only thing Pegg got right is they are not angels (so she was only partially right), but everything else are incorrect.

Here, have a cake, :cupcake: InChrist.

 

[Pegg]

JESUS!!! :foot:

Oops!

:sorry1: didn't mean to swear...

Of the all the Christians that replied in regarding to the Revelation's 144,000, only InChrist got the identity of 144,000 people right.

The 144,000 people to be saved, are Israelite, 12,000 from each tribe. It had nothing to do with angels, true church or true Christians.

Read Revelation 7:4-8. InChrist had already quoted the verses.

No-body was right in a way, that they (144,000) had nothing to do with Christians or "true church".

The only thing Pegg got right is they are not angels (so she was only partially right), but everything else are incorrect.

Here, have a cake, :cupcake: InChrist.

i didnt mention this point earlier, but the list of the 12 tribes found in Revelation is not the same 12 tribes of Isreal.

If you look closely, and compare the two lists, Isreals 12 tribes are different.

I'll give you some time and see if you can find the difference. And because its not a 'literal' list of the 12 tribes of isreal.... it shouldnt be taken literally.

 

[Straw Dog]

Can the "True church" be decided by scripture alone? Or by what method does one discern?