Thelema: Mixing the Eastern and the Western

[1137]

Hi there,
I am, first off, wondering who here knows about the philosophy / religion of Thelema, developed mainly by Aleister Crowley in the 20th century. The reason I ask is the more I study it, the more I realize it is almost a perfect balance between Eastern and Western 'religious' philosophies. I am curious if anyone else has realized this, especially followers of Hinduism, Buddhism, and / or Taoism. I follow the philosophy, and at a younger age viewed it as a very western path. But as I've matured and learned, I have began to identify more with Taoism, Hinduism, and Buddhism than I do the Western "spiritual" paths that identify with Thelema. Just wondering who else has noticed this and could compare things from Thelema to Eastern Philosophy.

 

[dyanaprajna2011]

I haven't noticed that with Thelema. To me, Theosophy is more a balance of Eastern and Western philosophies. But, that's just my opinion. Some probably would disagree.

 

[1137]

I haven't noticed that with Thelema. To me, Theosophy is more a balance of Eastern and Western philosophies. But, that's just my opinion. Some probably would disagree.

Well a main thing I have noticed in Thelema as well as Eastern philosophies is the freedom to find your path in any way that works, with respect to being a good person and practicing certain things such as yoga and ritual. That, in my opinion, is really all a religion need teach.

 

[dyanaprajna2011]

I'll agree with that, but, if I'm not mistaken (and I might be, it's been awhile since I've studied the western esoteric traditions), most, if not all of the WETs pretty much teach that. I'm not aware of any off the top of my head that doesn't. But, this is an idea that they get from Eastern religions and philosophies, where personal experience and traveling one's own path are important.

 

[1137]

I'll agree with that, but, if I'm not mistaken (and I might be, it's been awhile since I've studied the western esoteric traditions), most, if not all of the WETs pretty much teach that. I'm not aware of any off the top of my head that doesn't. But, this is an idea that they get from Eastern religions and philosophies, where personal experience and traveling one's own path are important.

Ah, many of them do seem to take from the Eastern philosophies. I, personally, appreciate such a thing from Thelema. I feel there is much more to Eastern philosophy than Western, but being raised in such a Western society makes understanding such philosophies much more difficult.

 

[Octavia156]

it is a good balance between the two... i see it more as an active form of taoism

Whats important to note is Thelema rejects the Black Schools that teach existance is sorrow, and we recognise that existance is pure joy.

Crowley saw early on that both buddhism and christianity were of the black school... and claims the compassionate Siddhata and weeping Jesus simply didn't get the cosmic joke.

 

[Octavia156]

You are definifely right.

To understand how a balance between East and West is explicity intended you only need look at the history of OTO.

The name Ordo Templi Orientis literally means Order of the Eastern Templars

The early OTO founders (pre-Crowley) were scholars of the western esoteric and freemasonic/templar tradtions. in the late 1800s there was a great fascination with the East and the "Orient". the first OTO memebrs studied the eastern systems under Yogis and attempted to merge the two schools of thought - combining Eastern Tantra and Western Qabala into one complete freemasonic system.
When Crowley came along the OTO recognised his doctrine of Thelema as one that perfectly fit their new system of universal freemasonary. Thats why Liber AL was accepted at the VSL for the order.

 

[HerDotness]

I don't concern myself with what its components or influences upon Thelema are. It works. That's all that matters to me.

 

[1137]

Can a mod perhaps delete this thread please?
​

 

[Desert Snake]

Can a mod perhaps delete this thread please?
​

Why? It's interesting.

 

[1137]

Very well

 

[Vultar]

Liber Oz enumerates some of the rights of the individual implied by the one overarching right, "Do what thou wilt." For each person, these include the right to: live by one's own law; live in the way that one wills to do; work, play, and rest as one will; die when and how one will; eat and drink what one will; live where one will; move about the earth as one will; think, speak, write, draw, paint, carve, etch, mould, build, and dress as one will; love when, where and with whom one will; and kill those who would thwart these rights.

An interesting mix of east and west. I was moderately interested until the last line of the quote above. Then I was disappointed...

 

[Desert Snake]

Very well

No, I was joking.

 

[HerDotness]

"...and kill those who would thwart these rights."

Crowley was fond of throwing in outrageous and outlandish bits simply for the shock value at times. He was the sort of person who delighted in pushing the envelope to extremes.

Or this could be what's called a blind, something so offputting that anyone without the temperament for working within the context of Thelema would say, "This is preposterous! I wouldn't even think of doing any such thing." And then, will read no further.

That the phrase was intended as a "capstone" to the list to emphasize how crucial living in accord with one's Will is would also be likely, IMO.

 

[flame93]

I don't find Thelema as east-west mix... Maybe some techniques practiced by some thelemites are combinaton of east and west, like Hermetic Qabalah, Western Yoga, etc. But Thelema as found in The Book of the Law is core principle of individuality, as many sacred and philosophical texts in the world I can't classify it to the some part of the world or culture.

Expect him not from the East, nor from the West; for from no expected house cometh that child. (AL I/56)

 

[GabrielWithoutWings]

An interesting mix of east and west. I was moderately interested until the last line of the quote above. Then I was disappointed...

Why would this disappoint you, exactly?

 

[Vultar]

Why would this disappoint you, exactly?

It disappoints me as many of the ideas are actually correct, but then they toss in "killing" which is the most harmful thing a person can do to themselves.

I am currently in search of a faith which matches my own from my experiences so I can discover any missing pieces and also to compile questions on the off chance I temperarily die again... (I know that sounds strange)

 

[Octavia156]

Can a mod perhaps delete this thread please?
​

Whaaaat!?


This is one of your best threads!

Such an immense platform for discussion here.

I can't think of any other religion that encompasses both Eastern and Western philosophies so succinctly, can you?

To me Thelema's combining of Eastern and Western philosophies is the Synthesis that follows the joining the Thesis with its Anti-thesis.

West (Union through Connection) THESIS + East (Union through Negation) ANTI-THESIS = SYNTHESIS (Union through Thelema)

What do you think?

 

[1137]

My thoughts are indifferent. Thelema is just another religion and philosophy in a sea of mixed concepts. Like all religions it simply boils down to mysticism, which Taoism explains most realistically, and science helps us understand. I find the whole system with the abyss, Babalon, etc to be comically useless. If one must follow someone elses system I don't think they are ready for any sort of enlightenment.