The Rational Bible: Exodus

[The Anointed]

That;s pretty insulting. You aren't going to win any converts this way.

Who's chasing converts????? If the biblical truth offends someone, then they have no part in the truth.

Popes who claim to be God

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Who's chasing converts????? If the biblical truth offends someone, then they have no part in the truth.

Popes who claim to be God

Why are you talking to me about Popes?

 

[The Anointed]

Why are you talking to me about Popes?

Just to let you know, who it is who claims to be the worthless shepherd that the Lord raised up in the land, after the Lord, who put his words into the mouth of his chosen prophet Jesus the Jew, was paid the majestic wage of thirty pieces of silver.

It is not too difficult to find the one who claims to be the shepherd of God/s people today. The Lord fulfilled his promise through his prophet Zechariah, 11: 12-17, when the Roman church of Emperor Constantine was firmly established in the 4th century. Just look at all the Popes who claim to be Christ [The Good Shepherd] in the flesh.

 

[exchemist]

Just to let you know, who it is who claims to be the worthless shepherd that the Lord raised up in the land, after the Lord, who put his words into the mouth of his chosen prophet Jesus the Jew, was paid the majestic wage of thirty pieces of silver.

It is not too difficult to find the one who claims to be the shepherd of God/s people today. The Lord fulfilled his promise through his prophet Zechariah, 11: 12-17, when the Roman church of Emperor Constantine was firmly established in the 4th century. Just look at all the Popes who claim to be Christ [The Good Shepherd] in the flesh.

Are you from Northern Ireland? Or just channelling Ian Paisley?

Naiow Paouperaeigh!!!

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Just to let you know, who it is who claims to be the worthless shepherd that the Lord raised up in the land, after the Lord, who put his words into the mouth of his chosen prophet Jesus the Jew, was paid the majestic wage of thirty pieces of silver.

It is not too difficult to find the one who claims to be the shepherd of God/s people today. The Lord fulfilled his promise through his prophet Zechariah, 11: 12-17, when the Roman church of Emperor Constantine was firmly established in the 4th century. Just look at all the Popes who claim to be Christ [The Good Shepherd] in the flesh.

Anointed, first of all, I am not Catholic. The Catholic church has gone out of its way to correct its past sins against the Jews, for which I am very appreciative. As a church they have their victories and their problems. Not only am I not going to bash Catholics, but I'm not going to listen to you bash Catholics. You'll have to find somewhere else to set up your soap box.

For any Catholics listening:
I pray that God will be with you during your present crisis and that you will come out of this better than before. May our two faiths continue to work together to make our world a better place.

 

[exchemist]

Anointed, first of all, I am not Catholic. The Catholic church has gone out of its way to correct its past sins against the Jews, for which I am very appreciative. As a church they have their victories and their problems. Not only am I not going to bash Catholics, but I'm not going to listen to you bash Catholics. You'll have to find somewhere else to set up your soap box.

For any Catholics listening:
I pray that God will be with you during your present crisis and that you will come out of this better than before. May our two faiths continue to work together to make our world a better place.

Amen. And thank you very much for the understanding and good wishes.

The Catholic faith needs serious reform. My solution would be threefold. First a proper and rigorous implementation of what is known as "safeguarding", to ensure minors are not exposed to sexual predators in the church (already done in England and Wales, it seems). Second, allow priests to marry. This I feel sure would provide a natural outlet for sexual urges, and lessen the likelihood of it going rotten, not to mention the additional supervision of priests by their wives that would result. (One problem would be that the church could not support wives and children from the parish collection plate, but wives expect to work nowadays anyway). Third, I would like to see women priests. It is time to abandon the association of sex with sin, which St Paul and than Augustine of Hippo have saddled us with down the centuries. Christ had barely a word to say about this, after all. It is ridiculous how dominant a theme it has been allowed to become.

But I don't expect the 2nd and 3rd to take place in my lifetime.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Amen. And thank you very much for the understanding and good wishes.

The Catholic faith needs serious reform. My solution would be threefold. First a proper and rigorous implementation of what is known as "safeguarding", to ensure minors are not exposed to sexual predators in the church (already done in England and Wales, it seems). Second, allow priests to marry. This I feel sure would provide a natural outlet for sexual urges, and lessen the likelihood of it going rotten, not to mention the additional supervision of priests by their wives that would result. (One problem would be that the church could not support wives and children from the parish collection plate, but wives expect to work nowadays anyway). Third, I would like to see women priests. It is time to abandon the association of sex with sin, which St Paul and than Augustine of Hippo have saddled us with down the centuries. Christ had barely a word to say about this, after all. It is ridiculous how dominant a theme it has been allowed to become.

But I don't expect the 2nd and 3rd to take place in my lifetime.

I've actually approached this with the knowledge that the problem is not unique to Catholicism. OMGosh, we Jews have had our own scandals. In the Orthodox community it is a big problem getting any help when molestation happens because if you say something it's considered "lashen hara" (evil tongue) a very great sin. Those who make waves get shunned by the whole community. We have some changing to do too.

The problem is yetzer hara, our evil inclination. Not which religion we are.

As to married priests, I thought that was already happening. Aren't they ordaining married men down in the Amazon?

I'm not going to tell you Catholics whether you should have women priests or not. I think there is more than one way to resolve the problem. But I can tell you that even the Orthodox are beginning to ordain women Rabbis. It's a different world. If you want women's support, you have to give us respect.

 

[The Anointed]

Anointed, first of all, I am not Catholic. The Catholic church has gone out of its way to correct its past sins against the Jews, for which I am very appreciative. As a church they have their victories and their problems. Not only am I not going to bash Catholics, but I'm not going to listen to you bash Catholics. You'll have to find somewhere else to set up your soap box.

For any Catholics listening:
I pray that God will be with you during your present crisis and that you will come out of this better than before. May our two faiths continue to work together to make our world a better place.

So you accept the words of the catholic popes who claim that they are Christ in the flesh, and reject the word of God that he would raise a worthless shepherd in the land. And pray tell, who is it, who today claims to be the shepherd of Gods people if not for the Pope?

All bodies must die once then go off into judgment, even the religious bodies that have burned the pagans at the stake, who have murdered, how many thousands of women, who were accused by their husbands as witches, knowing that the church who forbade them to divorce their wives would burn or drown them as witches instead. And how many atrocities were perpetrated during the inquisition? There is not enough room in this entire forum to record the sins of the church of Constantine which has fulfilled the purpose for which God allowed it to be established.

But now has come the time for her to be judged, and no matter how righteous we become in the twilight of our years, no matter how repentant we are for the sins of our past, and no matter how many tears we shed in the passion of our despair, we must all pay the blood price for the mistakes of our past, even those whose are judged while alive and the elements of their physical bodies become so excited they burn up, and disappear. But it is the hope of God, that his children will hear his call and come out of her, and that only the empty shell will be destroyed.

Revelation 18: 4 to 8.
Come out of her my people, do not share in her sin.
You must not share her punishment, her judgment day has come
Her sins are piled to heaven and God recalls her evil ways,
She says I am no widow and I’ll never see the grave
Because of that in just one day disease will strike her down
Plagues and famine she’ll receive until the day she’s burned
You must pay her back two fold for all that she has done
Fill her cup as she filled yours, but make it take as strong
For all the glory she has claimed and all her luxury
Must be repaid this very day with pain and misery.

 

[pearl]

He may have started with Exodus not Genesis, because the former contains the Ten Commandments.

I think he began with Exodus because it and not Gen is where the 'story', the history of the people Israel began.

 

[Nicholas]

I think he began with Exodus because it and not Gen is where the 'story', the history of the people Israel began.

Prager said on radio or tv that he started with Exodus because it contains the Ten Commandments.

 

[pearl]

Prager said on radio or tv that he started with Exodus because it contains the Ten Commandments.

You don't consider that the beginning?

 

[IndigoChild5559]

So you accept the words of the catholic popes who claim that they are Christ in the flesh, and reject the word of God that he would raise a worthless shepherd in the land. And pray tell, who is it, who today claims to be the shepherd of Gods people if not for the Pope?

All bodies must die once then go off into judgment, even the religious bodies that have burned the pagans at the stake, who have murdered, how many thousands of women, who were accused by their husbands as witches, knowing that the church who forbade them to divorce their wives would burn or drown them as witches instead. And how many atrocities were perpetrated during the inquisition? There is not enough room in this entire forum to record the sins of the church of Constantine which has fulfilled the purpose for which God allowed it to be established.

But now has come the time for her to be judged, and no matter how righteous we become in the twilight of our years, no matter how repentant we are for the sins of our past, and no matter how many tears we shed in the passion of our despair, we must all pay the blood price for the mistakes of our past, even those whose are judged while alive and the elements of their physical bodies become so excited they burn up, and disappear. But it is the hope of God, that his children will hear his call and come out of her, and that only the empty shell will be destroyed.

Revelation 18: 4 to 8.
Come out of her my people, do not share in her sin.
You must not share her punishment, her judgment day has come
Her sins are piled to heaven and God recalls her evil ways,
She says I am no widow and I’ll never see the grave
Because of that in just one day disease will strike her down
Plagues and famine she’ll receive until the day she’s burned
You must pay her back two fold for all that she has done
Fill her cup as she filled yours, but make it take as strong
For all the glory she has claimed and all her luxury
Must be repaid this very day with pain and misery.

This will be my last post to you, since you are clearly trolling, interested only in kicking
Catholics around.

As I said, I am not Catholic -- I do not believe in what the Catholic church teaches, not their Christian scriptures, not their Catholic Traditions, etc. But just because I'm not Catholic doesn't mean I'm a rabid Catholic hater.

Please don't post me anymore. Thanks.

 

[The Anointed]

This post is not to IndigoChild5559, but to those who have read the vile accusations that person has made against me.

IndigoChild5559 wrote........ This will be my last post to you, since you are clearly trolling, interested only in kicking Catholics around.

The Anointed...….. Well I certainly hope that she is a truthful person, because I have better things to do with my time than to read her defense of an organization, that she believes is deceiving millions of people with teachings that she believes to be erroneous in the extreme

IndigoChild5559 wrote...…. As I said, I am not Catholic -- I do not believe in what the Catholic church teaches, not their Christian scriptures, not their Catholic Traditions, etc.

The Anointed...….. Like her, neither do I believe what the Roman church of Emperor Constantine teaches, especially those Popes who claim they are equal to God. See.... Popes who claim to be God

If I were not such a serious biblical student, I could almost believe that here we see the fulfilment of Paul's statement in 2 Thessalonians 2: 3; Concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him, we ask you, brothers and sisters, 2not to become easily unsettled or alarmed by the teaching allegedly from us—whether by a prophecy or by word of mouth or by letter—asserting that the day of the Lord has already come. 3Don’t let anyone deceive you in any way, for that day will not come until the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. 4He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God’s temple, proclaiming himself to be God.

Why is she so afraid of condemning the teachings which she believes are erroneous and are leading millions away from the truth as revealed in the scriptures. why does she sanction that which she believes is against the truth as revealed. That organization Knows and has admitted that Isaiah was never referring to a virgin being pregnant in Isaiah 7: 14; they also know that the Greek language, unlike the Hebrew, do not have a specific term for virgin and that The word 'Parthenos' carries the basic meaning of girl or youth and denotes virgin only by implication and that the authors of the Septuagint and Matthew, were correct in using the Greek 'Parthenos;' when translating Isaiah's words that an unmarried female would be pregnant etc.

As the greater majority of religious denominations who were born from the erroneous teachings of the Roman church all now accept that Isaiah was not referring to a virgin in that famous passage, they must now accept that the authors of the Septuagint and The Gospel of Matthew, who were forced to use the Greek term “Parthenos” in reference to Isaiah’s prophecy, were in no way implying that the pregnant Mary, was still a virgin.

Matthew 1: 22-23; should now read; ‘Now all this happened to make come true what the Lord had said through the prophet [Isaiah],’ “An unmarried woman/Almah who is pregnant will bear a son and he will be called Immanuel: (“which means God is with us.”)

The point of the prophecy is not in the fact that an unmarried woman would bear a son, but that a child conceived out of wedlock would be seen as the vessel in which the Lord would reveal himself to us, (“God is with us.”)

In 1st Chronicles 17: 13; Concerning Solomon, who was born of the adulterous union of David and Bathsbeba and the murder of her husband Uriah, God says of Solomon, “I shall be his Father and he shall be my Son” and God blesses him with the rulership of one of the most glorious periods in Jewish history.

IndigoChild5559 wrote...…. But just because I'm not Catholic doesn't mean I'm a rabid Catholic hater.

The anointed...…. I have eight sisters, and all are staunch Catholics and I love them all.

I agree with IndigoChild5559, that the Roman church has the right to teach that which is in opposition to the truth as revealed in scripture, but unlike her, I refuse to tolerate such erroneous teachings, and I feel that I am obligated to point out to all, where the Roman church has deceived her children.

IndigoChild5559 wrote...…. Please don't post me anymore. Thanks.

The Anointed........ Seeing as she has asked me so politely, I will not post her any more, but I will continue to point out, that which in my opinion, is contrary to the scriptures, no matter who puts those erroneous statements forward.

But Like indigoChild5559, I also find fault with the traditions of the Roman church, but unlike her, I am not afraid to speak out against those deceptive traditions, as I will do in my following post.

 

[The Anointed]

Constantine appointed his mother Helena as Augusta and gave her unlimited access to the imperial treasury in order to locate the relics of early Judeo-Christian times. And the church of the Nativity in Bethlehem of Judaea, was originally financed and built by Helena the mother of Emperor Constantine, who have both been deified as saints by the Universal church that was established in 325 AD.

According to the traditions of the Church of Constantine, Mary and her child [supposedly] rested in a cave, called the Milk Grotto (la Gruta de la Leche), near the place where today stands the Church of the Nativity (la Iglesia de la Natividad). There, (Or so it is said) their supposed Virgin Mary breastfed the child Jesus to keep it quiet, while the soldiers of Herod were slaughtering the innocent children in Bethlehem of Judaea. A drop of milk [supposedly] fell on a stone of the cave, and the stone was supposed to have magically turned white. During the early centuries, this white rock, diluted in water, took the appearance of milk and was used as a religious relic.

Both Christians and Muslims believe scrapings from the stones in the grotto boost the quantity of a mother’s milk and enhance fertility. Mothers usually mix it in their drinking water; would-be mothers place the MAGICAL rock under their mattress.

There is also an old tradition which originated from the universal church of Constantine that identifies this as the burial site of the young victims of Herod’s Slaughter of the Innocents. There is a chapel dedicated to them in the caves beneath the Church of St. Catherine. None of this can be historically or scriptually supported.

According to the traditions handed down by their saint Helena, it was in 6 BC, in the first few days after the birth of the child that the wise men paid homage to the baby Jesus in the manger in Bethlehem of Judaea, and immediately after the wise men were supposed to have left, Herod’s men began killing all the male children in that district who were two-years and below, while Mary supposedly hid in the milk Grotto, after which, Joseph and Mary with the baby Jesus, fled from Bethlehem of Judaea into the land of Egypt, where they must have remained for two years, until Herod died in 4 BC.

If any of that is true, then that would mean that Mary could not have presented Jesus in the Temple in Jerusalem and performed the ceremony of purification according to the time prescribed by the law of Moses, until Jesus was over two-years old and after the death of Herod the great in 4 B.C. when they returned from Egypt.

This is in total contradiction to the truth as revealed in God’s word. Matthew is not concerned as to where the holy family actually lived, only that the child was born in Bethlehem of Judaea, he then skips forward in time, to speak of the wise men, who are believed to have been Astronomer/Astrologers from Mesopotamia, [Where a sizable Jewish community still lived] who had seen the star in the east, that they believed was the prophesied heavenly sign that was to herald the birth of the promised Messianic King of Israel, and even if they had left their own country that very day, to travel to Jerusalem, we know from biblical records that it would have taken them some four months to reach there, and by then, the family, according to Luke, had returned to their home in Nazareth.

The most likely scenario is, that the wise men saw the triple conjunction of Jupiter “The king Star” with Mars “The God of War” and Saturn, “Which brings in the Golden Age of Peace on Earth,” this was in 6 BC, and would have been seen by them, as the sign that was to herald the birth of the promised King and successor to the throne of David the warrior king, who would subdue all nations and bring in a golden age of peace on the earth.

But as Herod died in 4 BC, shortly after the slaughter of the innocents, which was immediately after the wise men were warned of what was going to occur and told to return home by a different route than that by which they had travelled to Israel, It would appear that the comet of 5 BC, was the deciding factor to convince them that the promised King had been born in Israel.

Ezra 7: 8-9; “They left Babylonia on the first day of the first month, and with God’s help they arrived in Jerusalem on the first day of the fifth month.”

Luke is more concerned with the approximate 2 month period that the family was in Bethlehem of Judaea. He speaks of the birth of the child in the stable of an Inn, and the visit of the shepherds, who were out in the fields, where they would not have been in the middle of the winters of late December, where they saw the baby in the manger wrapped in swaddling cloth etc. There is no mention of any wise men there by Luke.

Luke 2: 21; A week after Jesus was born he was circumcised according to the law of Moses. “Then ‘CAME THE TIME’ according to the Law of Moses,” for Mary to perform the ceremony of purification as the law of Moses commanded.

(Leviticus 12: 3-4; “On the eighth day the male child shall be circumcised. Then it will be thirty three days more until she is ritually clean from her loss of blood and then can she enter the tent/temple and perform the ceremony of purification.)

Travelling from Bethlehem to the temple in Jerusalem, with a new born baby 41 Days after all the male children in Bethlehem who were two years and below had been slaughtered as Helena suggested, would not have been a wise move.

After she had performed everything “According to the law of Moses” some 33 days after the baby was circumcised, they returned to the home of Mary in Nazareth, to where the wise men would travel some months later, and shower the young child with gifts, which included Gold, which apparently the family did not have when Mary offered the two pigeons at the ceremony of purification. Leviticus 12: 8; poor families who cannot afford a lamb shall bring two doves or two pigeons one of which, would be used as the burnt offering etc.

As it has already been stated, even if the wise men had left their country of origin in the east, on the day that they had first sighted the heavenly phenomenon that had heralded the birth of Jesus, which is more that highly unlikely, they would not have reached Jerusalem until at least two month after Mary had returned to Nazareth.

Matthew 2: 16; When Herod realized that the visitors from the east had tricked him, he was furious. He gave orders to kill all the boys in Bethlehem and its neighbourhood who were two years old and younger — this was done in accordance with what he had learned from the visitors about the time when the star had appeared.

In those days, there was a town called Bethlehem in northern Galilee some 2 miles from Nazareth, that town today is called 'Beitlahm.'

Like IndigoChild5559, I don't believe in the traditions of the Roman church.