1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Featured The Lord's Day, is it really Sunday?

Discussion in 'Scriptural Debates' started by 3rdAngel, Nov 15, 2019.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Crosstian

    Crosstian Baring the Cross

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2019
    Messages:
    368
    Ratings:
    +94
    Religion:
    Seventh-day Adventist
    The Temple itself (aka, "house of the LORD") had 'daily' light, the 7 branch candlestick, that needed to be tended to every day, including Sabbath, and so also for the 'daily' incense, and so also for the 'daily' burnt offering.

    Exo_25:37 And thou shalt make the seven lamps thereof: and they shall light the lamps thereof, that they may give light over against it.

    Exodus 30:7 KJB - And Aaron shall burn thereon sweet incense every morning: when he dresseth the lamps, he shall burn incense upon it.

    Exodus 30:8 KJB - And when Aaron lighteth the lamps at even, he shall burn incense upon it, a perpetual incense before the LORD throughout your generations.

    Lev_24:2 Command the children of Israel, that they bring unto thee pure oil olive beaten for the light, to cause the lamps to burn continually.

    Lev_24:4 He shall order the lamps upon the pure candlestick before the LORD continually.
    [1] “The daily” of the courtyard:

    There was the “daily” service which took place in the Sanctuary courtyard, with all of the “burnt offerings” [sacrifices] which took place at various times according to the events, but in general there was a “burnt offering” and/or “lamb” and/or “meat offering” “day by day” [Exodus 29:38 KJB], “continual” [Numbers 28:3 KJB], “continually” [1 Chronicles 16:40 KJB], even “daily” [Ezra 3:4; Ezekiel 46:13 KJB] in both:

    [A.] the “evening” [Exodus 29:39,41; Numbers 28:4,8; 1 Chronicles 16:40; Ezra 3:3,4 KJB] times and,

    [B.] the “morning” [Exodus 29:38,39,41; Numbers 28:4,8; 1 Chronicles 16:40; Ezra 3:3,4; Ezekiel 46:13,14,15 KJB] times,

    [C.] besides all of the other times [Exodus 29:38-42; Leviticus 6:12,13,20; Numbers 4:16; 28:2-10,14-15, 23-24,31, 29:6,11,16,19,22,25,28,31,34,38; 1 Chronicles 16:40, 23:28-31; 2 Chronicles 24:14; Ezra 3:2-5; Nehemiah 10:33; Psalms 50:8; Ezekiel 46:14-16 KJB].​

    Was this Camp and Courtyard service the only “daily” service to do? No.​

    [2] “The daily” of the holy place:

    There was also the “daily” service which took place in the Holy Place of the Tabernacle/Sanctuary behind the first veil, wherein “...[was] the candlestick, and the table, and the shewbread ...” [Hebrews 9:2 KJB] and also having the “altar of incense” [Exodus 30:27 KJB].

    In Exodus 25:30 KJB, we see that “the table” [Exodus 35:13, 39:36 KJB], the “table of shewbread”, “shewbread table” [2 Chronicles 29:18 KJB], “the tables whereon the shewbread [was set]” [2 Chronicles 4:19 KJB], the “pure table” [2 Chronicles 13:11 KJB]; the “table of gold” [1 Kings 7:48 KJB] was to be “set upon” “alway” [“continually/perpetually/daily”] with the “continual shewbread” [Numbers 4:3,7; 2 Chronicles 2:4 KJB], set “alway” “before the LORD” [1 Samuel 21:6 KJB] which was replaced/refreshed every week's end on the 7th Day Sabbath of the Lord thy God [Leviticus 25:4-9; 1 Samuel 21:6; 1 Chronicles 9:32 KJB], even as Numbers 4:7 KJB and 1 Samuel 21:3-6 KJB [see also Matthew 12:3-4; Mark 2:25-26; Luke 6:3-4 KJB in conjunction] verifies.

    In the Sanctuary holy place, besides the shewbread being the “continual” bread of the presence, and its changing on the 7th day, every week “continually”, there was also to be the “daily” [day by day, perpetually, always, continually] service/upkeep of the “Oil”, “Lamp” and “Incense” [Exodus 27:20,21, 30:1-10; Leviticus 24:2-4 KJB] and these too were to happen from:

    [A.] “evening” [Exodus 27:21, 30:7 KJB] to,

    [B.] “morning” [Exodus 27:21, 30:8 KJB].​

    In fact, the High priest [Aaron] was, in type, to wear a mitre with a golden plackard, “continually”, and was to bear “the names of the Children of Israel” [Exodus 28:29 KJB] upon Himself when He “goeth in unto the Holy [place]” [Exodus 28:29 KJB], “before the LORD” [Exodus 28:30 KJB].

    What is more than this, is that in the wilderness wanderings, before entering into the Promised Land, the Son of God was “alway” [daily; Numbers 9:16 KJB] in the Pillar of Cloud/Fire [Numbers 9:15,16,21 KJB], in both:

    [A.] the “evening” [Numbers 9:15,16,21 KJB] and in,

    [B.] the “morning” [Numbers 9:15,16,21 KJB].​
     
  2. 3rdAngel

    3rdAngel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2019
    Messages:
    2,781
    Ratings:
    +178
    Religion:
    truth
    Arr but I have only told you the truth yet you do not believe God's Word shared with you neither can you show why you disagree with the scriptures that are shared with you. Does this not worry you brother that all you have are pretty pictures to try and hide you do not have scripture for your tradition and teaching that breaks the commandments of God? It should because by breaking any one of Gods' 10 commandments according to God's Word is sin *James 2:10-11. You say "twisting of scripture" yet these are only your words that are not God's Word because God's Word has shown you why you are in error but you deny it. So your argument is with God not me.

    Now are you interested in finding out about the "special annual sabbaths" of Leviticus 23 that are connected to feast days that can fall on any day of the week that are not God's 4th commandment?

    For example let's look at the Feast of trumpets which has one of the "special annual sabbath" which is not God's 4th commandment but a sabbath to the Feast day of trumpets in Leviticus 23:24

    Leviticus 23:24, Speak to the children of Israel, saying, In the seventh month, in the first day of the month, shall you have a sabbath [special שׁבּתון shabbâthôn H7677], a memorial of blowing of trumpets, an holy convocation.

    1. The ceremonial Sabbaths in ordinances of the law of Moses were special Sabbath and also uses a different Hebrew Word meaning to God's 4th commandment Sabbath of H7676. It uses the Hebrew word H7677 שׁבּתון shabbâthôn which comes from From H7676; a sabbatism or special holiday: - rest, sabbath. This sabbath can fall on any day of the seek and is only used in the annual Jewish festivals of Feasts of Trumpets (Lev 23:24) or Day of Atonement (Lev 23:32 or Feast of Booths (Lev 23:39). These feasts are NOT fulfilled and Shadows of things to come Col 2 v17 (e.g. 2nd coming, close of probation and judgement and God's people saved from their temporary dwelling on earth to the earth made new) NOTE: Col v17, Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ. It is NOT fulfilled and has NOT finished and IS to COME. These are temporary Shadow Sabbaths showing God's plan of salvation.

    2. God's 4th commandment Sabbath which is one of the 10 commandments (Exodus 20:8-11). The Hebrew word use here for Sabbath has a DIFFERENT Hebrew word used compared to the ceremonial Sabbath of H7677. The Hebrew Word used here is H7676 and means H7676 שַׁבָּת shabbath (shab-bawth') n-e.1. intermission, a period of temporary rest.2. (specifically) the Sabbath, the seventh day being the day of rest. [intensive from H7673] KJV: (+ every) sabbath. Root(s): H7673. The root word comes from H7673 which comes from the creation week of Genesis 2:1-3 and means shabath (shaw-ɓath') v.to repose, i.e. to cease from exertion.KJV: (cause to, let, make to) cease, celebrate, cause (make) to fail, keep (sabbath), suffer to be lacking, leave, put away (down), (make to) rest, rid, still, take away.

    This is God's Sabbath it is a memorial of creation and part of a FINISHED WORK BEFORE SIN entered the WORLD. If it is part of a FINISHED work BEFORE SIN then it cannot be a part of the plan of salvation because it was BEFORE the fall of mankind. Just like all the other 10 commandments God's Word says they are FOREVER and the very standard of SIN and RIGHTEOUSNESS and the JUDGEMENT to come.

    You mix up the shadow laws from the Mosaic book of the old covenant with God's eternal law in the new covenant.

    God's eternal law (10 commandments) which includes the 4th commandment is the work of God (Exodus 32:16) whatsoever God does is FOREVER nothing can be added to it or taken away (Ecclesiastes 3:14). God's Law is perfect converting the soul (Psalms 19:7).

    It is the very standard of the Old and New Covenants (Exodus 20:1:17, Hebrews 8:10-12). God's Law was spoken by God himself to His people (Exodus 20:1-22).

    Jesus says Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away (Matthew 25:35). Gods Law is still in force today (Psalms 111:7-8, Revelation 12:17, 14:12, 22:14, 1 John 3:5-8, 1 John 2:3-4 etc.).

    The Law of God reveals sin to us so we can see ourselves as we truly are sinners in need of a Saviour (Romans 3:20; 1 John 3:4). It is the great standard of the judgement (Ecclesiastes 12:13-14, James 2:10-12, 1 John 3:4, Acts 17:31).

    God's Law is our teacher revealing sin and the character of God and brings us to Christ at the foot of the cross that we might be saved by faith by Him who loves us and washed us in His own blood (Galatians 3:24; Revelation 1:5). God's people keep all the commandments of God including the Sabbath even in the NEW EARTH (Revelation 12:17; 14:12; 22:14; Isaiah 66:23)

    That is the difference between the ceremonial special Sabbaths that are shadows of things to come and God's 4th commandment which God's Word says is FOREVER.

    According to God's Word in the new covenant God's LAW (10 Commandments) gives us the knowledge of what sin is when broken *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4 and if we break anyone of them when we have been given a knowledge of the truth *Acts 17:30-31 we stand guilty before God of sin *James 2:10-11. If we continue to sin willfully after we have been given a knowledge of the truth there remains no more sacrifice for sin but a fearful looking forward to of the judgment to come *Hebrews 10:26-39.

    Does this not worry you brother? It should. Jesus says all those who knowingly follow man-made teachings and traditions of men that break the commandments of God when they have been given a knowledge of the truth are not following God *Matthew 15:3-9

    Something to pray about. Jesus called those doing these things Hypocrits *Matthew 15:7

    May you receive God's Word and be blessed. Ignoring it does not make it disappear.

    God's sheep hear his Voice (the Word) and follow him.
     
    #262 3rdAngel, Nov 22, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2019
  3. 3rdAngel

    3rdAngel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2019
    Messages:
    2,781
    Ratings:
    +178
    Religion:
    truth
    The picture of the walking dead is a good representation of your post brother :).

    Sadly our just repeating yourself again. Your claims here have already been address with the scriptures alone that show why you are in error. God's ISRAEL in the new covenant are all those who believe and follow God's Word. Gentiles are now grafted in *Romans 11:13-27. If you are not a part of God's ISRAEL you have no part in the new covenant *Hebrews 8:10-12. A very detailed look at the scriptures on who God's ISRAEL is in the new covenant is shown here...

    God's Israel in the new testament who is it *Romans 9:6-8 (linked)

    Your response is to simply to ignore God's Word showing why you are in error and to repeat yourself.
    You a funny one MJFlores, here you do again ignoring God's Word again. Your claims here also have been shown to be in error through the scriptures alone with a detailed scriptures response addressing Isaiah 1:13 and Hosea 2:11 in post # 257 linked showing your interpretation of them which you claim is in reference to God's 4th commandment being abolished 700 years before Christ is in error.

    This was shown directly through the scriptures alone as you were shown through God's Word (not mine) that;

    a. Every reference cited in both Hosea 2:11 and Isaiah 1:13 (and even Lamentations 2:6 for that matter :)) is a reference to the annual feast days and festivals in Leviticus 23 and not a direct reference to God's 4th commandment in Exodus 20:8-11. There are many special sabbath linked to the annual fest days of Leviticus 23. This being said both references are linked to the judgments of God for Isreals idolarty and Israels punisment and going into captivity to the Assyrians meaning that these days of holy convocation linked to Leviticus 23 would be coming to an end until Israel retuned to God.

    .............


    b. Both Isaiah and Hosea made these prophecies around a similar time period as a result of Israel going into idolatry and what God would do as a result of Israel departing from his Word *Hosea 2:11 I will stop all her celebrations... This is shown in 1 Chronicles 5:26 when the God of Israel stirred up the spirit of Pul king of Assyria, and the spirit of Tilgathpilneser king of Assyria, and he carried them away, even the Reubenites, and the Gadites, and the half tribe of Manasseh, and brought them unto Halah, and Habor, and Hara, and to the river Gozan, unto this day and latter in 2 Kings 15:29 In the days of Pekah king of Israel came Tiglathpileser king of Assyria, and he took Ijon, and Abelbethmaachah, and Janoah, and Kedesh, and Hazor, and Gilead, and Galilee, all the land of Naphtali, and carried them captive to Assyria.

    .............

    c. All of the above scripture references show why your interpretation of Hosea and Isaiah are in error. If according to you Gods' 4th commandment was abolished 700 years before the birth of Christ you think JESUS would have mentioned it in the new testament somewhere? He didn't he continued keeping it as did all the Apostles and disciples. Just this very fact alone shows you are in error.

    There is not one scripture in all of God's Word that says God's 4th commandment has now been abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day. The is a man made teaching and tradition of men that has led many to break God's 4th commandment. Just like any one of God's 10 commandments if we knowingly break any one of them we stand guilty before God of sin. If we sin willfully after we have received a knowledge of the truth there remains no more sacrifice for sin but a fearful looking forward to of the judgment to come *Hebrews 10:26-39.

    May you receive God's Word and be blessed. Ignoring God's Word does not make it disappear.

    Now brother these are God's Word not mine and they show why you are in error. What will you do? Close your eyes of thank God who helps us by his grace and Spirit?
     
  4. shmogie

    shmogie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2014
    Messages:
    9,033
    Ratings:
    +1,876
    Religion:
    Christian
    Friend,

    I appreciate your zeal, in many ways, you remind me of me before the true Gospel found me.

    Sadly, like I was when I was an Adventist, you are in error.

    Christians, according to Christ, and especially Paul, are to be guided by the indwelling Spirit in their behavior and worship. The Spirit operates within the framework of the law of Christ. The law of Christ is clearly laid out in the NT. The sabbath is never mentioned in the NT as something Christians must keep.

    This would be OK, for Paul tells us you can keep, or not keep any day you choose. However, when you slip into judging others in the Body of Christ by your erroneous theology, you have violated the law of Christ.

    So, what does Paul say about your insistence that Christians are under the law given to the Jews as part of the first Covenant ?

    "You observe days, and months, and seasons and years. I am afraid for you lest I have labored in vain." Gal.4: 10-11 NKJV.

    You will ASSUME he is speaking of days other than the sabbath, yet the sabbath is a day.

    Yet your assumption is wrong, as Paul explains; in a message for Adventists.

    " Tell me you who desire to be under the law, do you not hear the law ? For it is written that Abraham had two sons; the one by a bondswoman, the other by a free woman. But he who was of the bondswoman was born according to the flesh, but he of the free woman, of promise. Which things are symbolic. For they are the two covenants, the one from Mt Sinai, which gives birth to bondage, which is Hagar." Gal. 4: 21-24 NKJV.

    Continued
     
  5. shmogie

    shmogie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2014
    Messages:
    9,033
    Ratings:
    +1,876
    Religion:
    Christian
    Only the ten commandments were given on Mt. Sinai, those choosing to be under them are choosing slavery, as Hagar was.



    " Stand fast therefore in the liberty by which Christ has made us free, and do not be entangled again with a yoke bondage." Obviously, the yoke of bondage is the law.



    Interestingly, Christ spoke of a yoke. He said hat all those who come to Him will be given rest, and that His yoke is light. Hebrews makes it clear that under the new covenant, represented by Sarah's son, we are under the law of liberty and Christ is our rest, not the sabbath of the first covenant.



    For you brethren, have been called to liberty, only do not use liberty as an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another. For ALL the law is FULFILLED in one word, even in this, you shall love your neighbor as yourself." Gal.5 13-15 NKJV



    All of the law has been fulfilled. Completed. The standard met.



    So, if I love my neighbor as myself, I have kept the law.



    "Bear one another's burdens and so fulfill the law of Christ". Gal. 6:2



    What is this law of Christ ?



    You will try and convince me that it is the law given at Sinai. Yet Paul, in referring to that law, calls it "the law" over and over again. Why not here if it is the law of the first covenant ? Why the name change ?



    Because it is NOT the law of the Torah, it is the law for Christianity, the law of the new covenant.



    " I do not set aside the Grace of God, for if righteousness comes through the law, then Christ died in vain" Gal. 2:21 NKJV.



    He is speaking of the law of the Torah, including the ten commandments. Keeping this law was, and you say is, the standard of righteousness. At Sinai, those under the first covenant, the chosen of God, certified by the sign between they and God (the sabbath), proclaimed that they would keep all of the law.



    You will tell me that Christ justifies us by Grace, but then we must keep the law to be sanctified, ad we must always be judged by the law on the sanctification scale, because those under the law cannot judge, nor will God, judge their sanctification by anything else.



    To those who have placed themselves under the law, use Christ as an insurance policy, keep the law, but if you slip, use your get out of jail free card, Jesus Christ.



    However, EGW tells you that at the end, you must be perfectly sinless, YOU must be sinless, keeping the law perfectly, because Christ leaves the most holy place and can no longer intercede for you.



    Of course, as I learned after intense study, this is baloney.



    So, as Paul says if righteousness, (or unrighteousness) comes through the law, then Christ died in vain.



    Christ did not die in vain, and the law of the first covenant was fulfilled.



    I an under the law of the new covenant, the law of Christ, the law of Liberty.



    My behavior is guided by the indwelling Spirit, not by written statutes. I try and treat every person as Christ would have them treated, that is the law that superseded the law of the first covenant. My rest is in Christ, not a day of the week.
     
  6. 3rdAngel

    3rdAngel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2019
    Messages:
    2,781
    Ratings:
    +178
    Religion:
    truth
    Yet here you are only speaking your own words and denying God's.
    Once again these are your words and not God's Word. Than we have God's Word that denies your words which says that no one has God's Spirit if they do not believe and follow Gods' Word...

    ACTS 5:29-32 [29], Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men. [30], The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom you slew and hanged on a tree. [31], Him has God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Savior, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins. [32], And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God has given to them that obey him.

    What did Jesus and the Apostles teach about the Sabbath in the New Testament?

    1. It is lawful to do good on the Sabbath (Matthew 12:1-8; 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56)
    2. Jesus made the Sabbath for all mankind (Hebrews 1:2; John 1:1-3; 14; Ephesians 3:9; Colossians 1:16-17; Mark 2:27)
    3. Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath (Mark 2:28)
    4. If you do not believe and follow God you cannot enter His Sabbath rest (Hebrews 4)
    5. It is one of God’s 10 commandments we break it we are guilty or breaking all (James 2:8-12)
    6. Breaking it is sin (1 John 3:4)
    7. God’s true followers keep it Holy as God commanded (Revelation 14:12; Revelation 22:14; Ezekiel 20:20)
    8. Jesus is our example and he kept the Sabbath (Matthew 12:1-8; 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56; John 2:6; Matthew 16:24; 1 Cor 11:1; Ephesians 5:1-21; Peter 2:20-22)
    9. The Apostle kept the Sabbath (Acts 13:14; Acts 13:27; Acts 13:44; Acts 15:21; Acts 16:13; Acts 17:2; Acts 18:4; Revelation 1:10)

    Now wait for it.. Are you ready?

    HEBREWS 4:9 SO THEN IT REMAINS FOR THE PEOPLE OF GOD TO KEEP THE SABBATH.

    Yep certainly a lot of scripture here in regards to God's 4th commandment Sabbath in the new covenant you seem to be ignoring.

    I do not judge you brother for I am only a sinner in need of my Saviour every moment of the day. My God grants me a new heart to love my brother and bids me go and share his Words of life and says judge not according to outward appearance but judge righteouss judgment *John 7:24. There is none righteouss but God *Romans 3:10; Psalms 116:5 and he has given me a duty of love to share his Words. It is the Word of God that is our judge brother and this is all that I have shared with you *John 12:47-48. If you feel convicted through God's Spirit, harden not your heart as in the provocation *Psalms 95:8 but hear his Voice (the Word) and receive God's blessing. Sin (breaking any one of God's 10 commandments) *James 2:10-11 will keep all those who practice it out of God's Kingdom.

    May you receive God's Word and be blessed. Ignoring it does not make it disappear.
     
    #266 3rdAngel, Nov 22, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2019
  7. 3rdAngel

    3rdAngel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2019
    Messages:
    2,781
    Ratings:
    +178
    Religion:
    truth
    Your post is not relavant to our discussion brother as I do not believe we are saved by the law. We are only saved by GRACE through faith and not of ourselves it is a gift of God *EPHESIANS 2:8. OBEDIENCE to God's LAW is not how we are saved it is the FRUIT of God's work in us as we BELIEVE and FOLLOW his WORD by faith that works by LOVE. Salvation is from sin (breaking any one of God’s 10 Commandments) not to continue in sin *ROMANS 6:1-23; JOHN 8:31-36. Those who continue in known unrepentant sin do not know God and need to be Born again into the NEW COVENANT promise to love *HEBREWS 8:10-12; ROMANS 13:8-10. This is God's work in us and a part of the NEW COVENANT promise *HEBREWS 8:10-12; PHILIPPIANS 2:13. If our faith has no fruit it is dead *JAMES 2:18-20; 26 and our tree will be cast down and thrown into the fire *MATTHEW 3:10; 7:19-20; 13:49-50.
    Paul is not talking about the Sabbath here. Happy to show why from the scriptures..

    GALATIONS 4:4-11[4], But when the fullness of the time came, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law, [5], To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption as sons. [6], And because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father. [7], Therefore you are no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ. [8], But then, when you knew not God, you did service unto them which by nature are no gods. [9], But now, after you have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn you again to the weak and beggarly elements, to which you desire again to be in bondage? [10], You observe days, and months, and times, and years. [11], I am afraid for you, lest I have bestowed upon you labor in vain.

    GALATIANS 4:8-11 [8] Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods.[9] But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage? [10] YE OBSERVE DAYS, AND MONTHS, AND TIMES, AND YEARS. [11] I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.

    Galatians 4 says nothing about sabbaths. Its speaking of those who observe times.

    DEUTERONOMY 18:9-11 [9] When thou art come into the land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not learn to do after the abominations of those nations.[10] There shall not be found among you any one that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, or that useth divination, OR AN OBSERVER OF TIMES, or an enchanter, or a witch,[11] Or a charmer, or a consulter with familiar spirits, or a wizard, or a necromancer.

    The same thing goes on to this very day. Its speaking of the occult. Those who observe certain days by use of horoscopes?

    2 CHRONICLES 33:3-6 [3] For he built again the high places which Hezekiah his father had broken down, and he reared up altars for Baalim, and made groves, and worshipped all the host of heaven, and served them.[4] Also he built altars in the house of the LORD, whereof the LORD had said, In Jerusalem shall my name be for ever.[5] And he built altars for all the host of heaven in the two courts of the house of the LORD.[6] And he caused his children to pass through the fire in the valley of the son of Hinnom: ALSO HE OBSERVED TIMES, and used enchantments, and used witchcraft, and dealt with a familiar spirit, and with wizards: he wrought much evil in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger

    Enchantments, witchcraft, familiar spirits, and wizards. Its speaking of the occult. Not following sabbath days.

    LEVITICUS 19:26-30 [26] Ye shall not eat any thing with the blood: neither shall ye use enchantment, NOR OBSERVE TIMES.[27] Ye shall not round the corners of your heads, neither shalt thou mar the corners of thy beard.[28] Ye shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor print any marks upon you: I am the LORD.[29] Do not prostitute thy daughter, to cause her to be a whore; lest the land fall to whoredom, and the land become full of wickedness.[30] YE SHALL KEEP MY SABBATHS, and reverence my sanctuary: I am the LORD.

    I guess this scripture says it all. You shall not observe times BUT you will keep my sabbaths.

    Sorry brother according to God's Word not mine. Your interpretation of the scriptures are in error.
    Sadly no brother. According to Gods Word (not mine), no one is "UNDER THE LAW" brother if they have by faith in Gods' Word repented and confessed their sins and by faith accepted and believe the promises of forgiveness in God's Word made possible by the blood of JESUS on the cross for our sins and received Gods Spirit to walk in newness of life *Poverbs 28:13; 1 John 1:9; Romans 8:1-4; 1 John 3:3-10; Galatians 5:16. According to God's Word we are only "UNDER THE LAW" when we stand before God of "KNOWINGLY" breaking God's LAW or anyone of God's 10 commandments *James 2:10-11. Also, according to God's Word (not mine) if we sin willfully after we have beenm given a "KNOWLEDGE" of the truth there remains no more sacrifice for sin but a fearful looking forward to of the judgment to come *Hebrews 10:26-27.

    May you receive God's Word and be blessed. Ignoring it does not make it disappear.
     
    #267 3rdAngel, Nov 22, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2019
  8. 3rdAngel

    3rdAngel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2019
    Messages:
    2,781
    Ratings:
    +178
    Religion:
    truth
    Not really. Before the written Word of God there was the spoken Word of God *Genesis 26:5. According to God's Word in the new covenant God's LAW (10 Commandments) has the same role it always has and that is to give us the knowledge of GOOD and EVIL; SIN AND RIGHTEOUSNESS *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; Psalms 119:172. Slavery is not to the law as all the law does is give us a knowledge of what sin is *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7. Slavery is to sin which is transgresstion of any one of God's 10 commandments *James 2:10-11; 1 John 3:4 and it is this slavery to sin that God's promise of salvation is referring to...

    Matthew 9:12-13 [12], But when Jesus heard that, he said to them, They that be whole need not a physician, but they that are sick. [13], But go you and learn what that means, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

    We are slaves to the sickness of sin and this is why we need a Saviour to save us from sins power which is what Romans 6, Romans 7 and Romans 8 is referring to. Jesus also says this simply in John 8.

    John 8:31-36
    [31], Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If you continue in my word, then are you my disciples indeed;
    [32], And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
    [33], They answered him, We be Abraham's seed, and were never in bondage to any man: how say you, You shall be made free?
    [34], Jesus answered them, Truly, truly, I say to you, Whoever commits sin is the servant of sin.
    [35], And the servant stays not in the house for ever: but the Son stays ever.
    [36], If the Son therefore shall make you free, you shall be free indeed.

    Romans 6:6-16
    [6], Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that from now on we should not serve sin.
    [7], For he that is dead is freed from sin.
    [8], Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
    [9], Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dies no more; death has no more dominion over him.
    [10], For in that he died, he died to sin once: but in that he lives, he lives to God.
    [11], Likewise reckon you also yourselves to be dead indeed to sin, but alive to God through Jesus Christ our Lord.
    [12], Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that you should obey it in the lusts thereof.
    [13], Neither yield you your members as instruments of unrighteousness to sin: but yield yourselves to God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God.
    [14], For sin shall not have dominion over you: for you are not under the law, but under grace.
    [15], What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
    [16], Know you not, that to whom you yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants you are to whom you obey; whether of sin to death, or of obedience to righteousness?

    The new covenant promise is salvation from sin by the operation of God writing his law of love on the heart so that his LAW is fulfiulled in us who walk in His Spirit...

    Romans 8:1-4
    [1], There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
    [2], For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.
    [3], For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
    [4], That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

    This is the new covenant promise...

    Hebrews 8:10-12
    [10], For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, said the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:
    [11], And they shall not teach every man his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.
    [12], For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.
    As shown above the bondage is sin not God's LAW. All God's law does is give us a knowledge of what sin is *Romans 3:20.
    Rubbish the scriptures say no such thing. The law of liberty is love expressed through obedience to God's LAW and established in the heart of those who believe and follow God's Word *Romans 13:8-10; James 2:8-12 and is why JESUS says "ON THESE TWO COMMANDMENTS OF LOVE TO GOD AND MAN; HANG ALL THE LAW and the prophets *Matthew 22:36-40.

    You have lost your way brother. May you receive Gods' Word and be blessed.
     
    #268 3rdAngel, Nov 22, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2019
  9. shmogie

    shmogie Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2014
    Messages:
    9,033
    Ratings:
    +1,876
    Religion:
    Christian
    The old covenant was binding upon Christ as well as those who listened to Him, and thus the Torah.
    The law of Christ did not come into being till the new covenant began, when the old covenant and the Torah ceased to be binding upon mankind.
    I have asked you before to identify the translation you are using. It is standard practice when quoting scripture to do so. Once you do that, I will happily respond to your post.
     
  10. 3rdAngel

    3rdAngel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2019
    Messages:
    2,781
    Ratings:
    +178
    Religion:
    truth
    It sounds like you are mixed up in the shadow laws of the Mosaic book of the old covenant *Exodus 24:7 that pointed to JESUS and God's plan of salvation in the new covenant (e.g circumcision, sin offerings, burnt offerings, ceremonial laws in ordinances for remission of sin; the earthly sanctuary and the Levitical Priesthood) *Hebrews 7; Hebrews 8; Hebrews 9; Hebrews 10; Ephesians 2; Colossians 2, with God's eternal law in the new covenant that give us the knowledge of Good and Evil; Sin and righteousness *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4.
    I prayerfully use many translations asking God to be my guide and teacher *John 14:26; John 16:13, Hebrews 8:11 looking at both the Hebrew and Greek for accuracy to the closest original language meanings. What scripture are you referring to and I will let you know the translation and why I have chosen it over others?
     
    #270 3rdAngel, Nov 22, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2019
  11. MJFlores

    MJFlores Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2017
    Messages:
    2,656
    Ratings:
    +415
    Religion:
    Iglesia Ni Cristo (Church of Christ)

    So many words, endless loop of explanations which ends up with a ....


    [​IMG]

    Was it a Yes or a No?

    Is it OK to light a candle when the Electric Company has a power failure during Sabbath?


    [​IMG]

    YES or NO?
     
  12. 3rdAngel

    3rdAngel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2019
    Messages:
    2,781
    Ratings:
    +178
    Religion:
    truth
    Now brother I have consistantly answered everyone of your questions throughout this thread with God's Word alone even if your questions have been off topic (which most of them are), yet you ignore my posts and the scriptures provided only as a help to you and the questions that are only shared in love and as a help to you. Why do you expect me to answer a never ending pool of questions from you yet you answer none of mine and ignore the scriptures provided to you from God's Word? I am happy to continue answering your questions when you start answering mine.
     
    #272 3rdAngel, Nov 22, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2019
  13. MJFlores

    MJFlores Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2017
    Messages:
    2,656
    Ratings:
    +415
    Religion:
    Iglesia Ni Cristo (Church of Christ)
    I believe you are the topic starter and as such, we your audience are the questioners
    You have laid the assertion that the Lord's day is Sabbath day and not Sunday.
    Yay, Sabbath day! But the thing is can you substantiate or fall apart?

    I countered that the Lord's day is the end of the world or what the Bible calls the Day of the Lord
    Now you have your views, I got the Bible's views
    Everyday is the Lord's day and he owns it all - from Sunday to Saturday

    Now we are going to the nitty gritty of things
    I would like to know you Sabbath - your proud day that sets you apart
    What do you do?

    I asked for a schedule but you want nothing of it
    How can we appreciate what your Sabbath looked like if you can't clarify things?
    You would banner up - GO SABBATH GO! GO SABBATH GO!

    But the funny thing is you would show the verses
    Most of them are far out from the idea
    And fail to even answer the most simplest question
    Is it OK to turn on the lights during Sabbath?

    [​IMG]

    And I have the strong suspicion that you really don't know the answer.
    That is why you have a jungle of words and double talk to evade answering
    a Yes or a No on the question
    Is it OK to turn on the lights during Sabbath?
     
  14. MJFlores

    MJFlores Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2017
    Messages:
    2,656
    Ratings:
    +415
    Religion:
    Iglesia Ni Cristo (Church of Christ)
    [​IMG]

    And what was your question?
     
  15. 3rdAngel

    3rdAngel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2019
    Messages:
    2,781
    Ratings:
    +178
    Religion:
    truth
    I am the topic starter. This is a discussion board. I discussion goes two ways between people wanting to discuss the topic of the OP. This OP is asking for scripture that proves that SUNDAY is "THE LORDS DAY" that many take from Revelation 1:10and claim it is a reference to "Sunday worship". You have wanted to talk about everthing else except the OP and everything you have wanted to discuss has been kindly addressed with you through the scriptures. You on the other hand continue to ignore my posts and questions to you that show why you are in error and simply repeat yourself.

    WRONG! you have been asked the question where is the scripture that show "SUNDAY" is "THE LORDS DAY" You have not provided any. In response you were provided God's Word alone that says that JESUS is LORD of the SABBATH DAY *Matthew 12:8 showing that "THE LORDS DAY" according to God's Word is the "SABBATH DAY".

    Rubbish! According to God's Word (not mine), "THE DAY OF THE LORD" is in reference to the "SECOND COMING" * Joel 2:31; Joel 3:14; Amos 5:18; Amos 5:20; Obadiah 1:15; Zephaniah 1:7; Zephaniah 1:8; Zephaniah 1:14; Zephaniah 1:18; Zephaniah 2:2; Zephaniah 2:3; Zechariah 14:1; Malachi 4:5; Acts 2:20; 1 Colossians 5:5; 2Colossians 1:14; 1Thessalonians 5:2; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-4; Philippians 1:9-10; Philippians 2:16; 2 Peter 3:10.

    Now the context to nearly everyone of these scriptures from the old and new testament is the Judgments of God and the second coming. Everyone of these scriptures use "THE DAY OF THE LORD" as a reference to the second coming and the judgments of God.

    The GREEK usage of "THE DAY OF THE LORD" is ἡμέρα - hēmera; κύριος - kurios meaning day controller or day master or the day of God. The context to every scripture application is the second coming and God's judgments.

    On the other hand ...

    The GREEK usage of "THE LORDS DAY" is only used once in the bible and is not in context to the second coming or to the judgments of God. It is found in Revelation 1:10 and is in context to JOHN being "in the Spirit on "THE LORDS DAY" with different Greek words applied to the scripture as κυριακός - kuriakos the meaning here being "the lords ownership of the day. The context is to JOHN being in the presence of the Heavenly Sanctuary talking to JESUS.

    So your claim that Revelation 1:10 is in application to "THE DAY OF THE LORD" is in error and says no such thing. There is no context to the second coming and the judgments of God, different order and Greek words are used and the context and application is to John being in the Spirit of God in the presence of JESUS on the LORD'S DAY in the Heavenly Sanctuary.

    This shows why you are in error.

    Nope as shown all through this thread by the Word of God alone, your views are not biblical and are in error.

    God does indeed own everyday. There is only one day that God has set apart from all the other days of the week that God rested on in creation however and blessed and set apart as a holy day of rest for all mankind that he calls HIS REST or HIS HOLY DAY...

    ISAIAH 58:13-14 [13], If you turn away your foot from the sabbath, from doing your pleasure on MY HOLY DAY; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the LORD, honorable; and shall honor him, not doing your own ways, nor finding your own pleasure, nor speaking your own words: [14], Then shall you delight yourself in the LORD; and I will cause you to ride on the high places of the earth, and feed you with the heritage of Jacob your father: for the mouth of the LORD has spoken it.

    EXODUS 31:13 Speak you also to the children of Israel, saying, TRULY MY SABBATHS you shall keep: for it is a sign between me and you throughout your generations; that you may know that I am the LORD that does sanctify you.

    LEVITICUS 19:3 You shall fear every man his mother, and his father, and KEEP MY SABBATHS: I am the LORD your God.

    LEVITICUS 19:30 You shall keep MY SABBATHS, and reverence my sanctuary: I am the LORD.

    LEVITICUS 26:2 You shall keep MY SABBATHS, and reverence my sanctuary: I am the LORD.

    ISAIAH 56:4 For thus said the LORD to the eunuchs that keep MY SABBATHS, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant;

    EZEKIEL 20:12 Moreover also I gave them MY SABBATHS, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I am the LORD that sanctify them.

    EZEKIEL 20:13 But the house of Israel rebelled against me in the wilderness: they walked not in my statutes, and they despised my judgments, which if a man do, he shall even live in them; and MY SABBATHS they greatly polluted: then I said, I would pour out my fury on them in the wilderness, to consume them.

    EZEKIEL 20:16 Because they despised my judgments, and walked not in my statutes, but polluted MY SABBATHS: for their heart went after their idols.

    EZEKIEL 20:20 And hallow MY SABBATHS; and they shall be a sign between me and you, that you may know that I am the LORD your God.

    EZEKIEL 20:21 Notwithstanding the children rebelled against me: they walked not in my statutes, neither kept my judgments to do them, which if a man do, he shall even live in them; they polluted MY SABBATHS: then I said, I would pour out my fury on them, to accomplish my anger against them in the wilderness.

    EZEKIEL 20:24 Because they had not executed my judgments, but had despised my statutes, and had polluted MY SABBATHS, and their eyes were after their fathers' idols.

    EZEKIEL 22:8 You have despised my holy things, and have profaned MY SABBATHS.

    EZEKIEL 22:26 Her priests have violated my law, and have profaned my holy things: they have put no difference between the holy and profane, neither have they showed difference between the unclean and the clean, and have hid their eyes from MY SABBATHS, and I am profaned among them.

    EZEKIEL 23:38 Moreover this they have done to me: they have defiled my sanctuary in the same day, and have profaned MY SABBATHS.

    EZEKIEL 44:24 And in controversy they shall stand in judgment; and they shall judge it according to my judgments: and they shall keep my laws and my statutes in all my assemblies; and they shall hallow MY SABBATHS.

    So coming back to the new testament...

    WHICH DAY IS THE LORD'S DAY?

    FOR THE SON OF MEN IS LORD EVEN OF THE SABBATH DAY *MATTHEW 12:8

    ...............

    Now do you even read my posts and the scriptures provided in them?

    I am happy to answer all your questions once you start answering mine.

    Ignoring God's Word does not make them disappear.

    God's sheep hear His Voice (the Word) and follow him. Those who do not hear do not follow
     
  16. 3rdAngel

    3rdAngel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2019
    Messages:
    2,781
    Ratings:
    +178
    Religion:
    truth
    I have asked you questions relevant to each topic of convesation all through this thread. You have ignored everyone of them. Here I will give you a list of questions perhaps you can start by answering anyone of them...

    Can anyone please show me where in the bible alone (SOLA SCRIPTURA; Scripture only please)...

    1. That God's 4th commandments 7th day Sabbath has been abolished and we are commanded to keep Sunday as a holy day?

    2. That Jesus is a Sabbath?

    3. The Sabbath (seventh day) was ever changed from the seventh to the first day of the week?

    4. Where we are told to keep the first day of the week holy?

    5. Where the first day of the week (Sunday) is ever called a holy day?

    6. That says that Jesus ever kept the first day (Sunday)?

    7. That tells us to keep the first day in honour of the resurrection of Christ?

    8. Where the first day is ever given any sacred name?

    9. That affirms that any of the apostles ever kept the first day as the Sabbath?

    10. From any apostolic writings that authorizes Sunday observance as the Sabbath of God?

    11. Where we are told not to work on the first day of the week?

    12. That says the seventh day is no longer God's Sabbath day?

    13. That says the seventh day Sabbath is ABOLISHED?

    14. Where the apostles ever taught any convert to keep the first day of the week as a Sabbath?

    15. Where the first day was ever appointed to be kept as the Lord's Day?

    16. Where the first day of the week is ever called the Lord's Day?

    17. That says that the first day of the week was ever sanctified and hallowed as a day of rest?

    18. That says that the Father or the Son (Jesus) rested on the first day of the week?

    19. That says that Jesus, Paul or any other of the apostles taught anyone to observe the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

    20. That calls the seventh day the “Jewish Sabbath” or one text that calls Sunday the “Christian Sabbath”?

    21. Telling man to keep the first day of the week holy or to worship or rest on the first day of the week?

    22. Authorizing anyone to set aside God's Sabbath and observe any other day?

    23. Showing any of the apostles keeping the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

    24. Authorizing someone to set aside the fourth Commandment and observe any other day of the week?

    25. Where any apostle taught us to keep the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

    26. Declaring that the seventh day is no longer the Eternal Sabbath day?

    27. Where Sunday is now appointed to be kept as the New Testament Sabbath or holy day?

    If you have no scripture for your teachind and tradition of men that breaks the commandmetns of God who are you following; God or man?

    Thankyou.
     
  17. MJFlores

    MJFlores Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2017
    Messages:
    2,656
    Ratings:
    +415
    Religion:
    Iglesia Ni Cristo (Church of Christ)
    That is why it is
    upload_2019-11-23_12-1-22.jpeg

    Not a single drop of blood in me is from an Israelite.
    And I do not intend to become one
     
  18. MJFlores

    MJFlores Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2017
    Messages:
    2,656
    Ratings:
    +415
    Religion:
    Iglesia Ni Cristo (Church of Christ)
    1. That God's 4th commandments 7th day Sabbath has been abolished and we are commanded to keep Sunday as a holy day?

    Everyday is holy including Sunday.
    No days are unholy.
    Sabbath days was abolished a long time ago

    2. That Jesus is a Sabbath?

    Jesus is the Lord of the Sabbath
    Sabbath is rest, the kingdom of God is truly the rest

    3. The Sabbath (seventh day) was ever changed from the seventh to the first day of the week?

    Only people changed it.

    4. Where we are told to keep the first day of the week holy?

    Including Monday which is the second day to Saturday which is the seventh day.

    Even the first church have church activities on the first day of the week as we can read from the Bible
    1 Corinthians 16:2
    On the first day of every week, each one of you should set aside a sum of money in keeping with your income, saving it up, so that when I come no collections will have to be made.

    5. Where the first day of the week (Sunday) is ever called a holy day?

    Is Sunday an unholy day? What I know God made the first day.

    Genesis 1:4-5 New International Version (NIV)
    God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. God called the light “day,” and the darkness he called “night.” And there was evening, and there was morning—the first day.

    6. That says that Jesus ever kept the first day (Sunday)?

    I'm sure he spent a couple of Sundays in the wilderness to complete his forty days and forty nights.

    Matthew 4:1-2 New International Version (NIV)
    Then Jesus was led by the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted by the devil. After fasting forty days and forty nights, he was hungry.

    7. That tells us to keep the first day in honour of the resurrection of Christ?

    Jesus Christ died on the cross Friday afternoon [3:00 pm]
    He spent 3 days buried
    Monday, he rose from the dead

    8. Where the first day is ever given any sacred name?

    Sunday when God created the sun and saw the light was good.

    9. That affirms that any of the apostles ever kept the first day as the Sabbath?

    [​IMG]

    10. From any apostolic writings that authorizes Sunday observance as the Sabbath of God?

    Sabbath was abolished repealed 500 years before Christ was born
    So there are no apostolic writings pertaining to that.


    11. Where we are told not to work on the first day of the week?

    You can work overtime.
    No problemo!

    12. That says the seventh day is no longer God's Sabbath day?

    Sabbath was abolished repealed 500 years before Christ was born
    No problemo!

    13. That says the seventh day Sabbath is ABOLISHED?

    [​IMG]

    14. Where the apostles ever taught any convert to keep the first day of the week as a Sabbath?

    They told to ignore them.

    Colossians 2:16
    [ Freedom From Human Rules ] Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day.

    15. Where the first day was ever appointed to be kept as the Lord's Day?

    1 Corinthians 16:2 Living Bible (TLB)
    On every Lord’s Day each of you should put aside something from what you have earned during the week, and use it for this offering. The amount depends on how much the Lord has helped you earn. Don’t wait until I get there and then try to collect it all at once.

    The Living Bible is a personal paraphrase, not a translation, of the Bible in English by Kenneth N. Taylor and first published in 1971. Taylor used the American Standard Version of 1901 as his base text. Wikipedia
    Originally published: 1971
    Copyright: Copyright 1971 Tyndale House Publishers
    Editor: Kenneth N. Taylor
    Abbreviation: TLB
    Complete Bible published: 1971
    Genres: Religious text, Reference work

    16. Where the first day of the week is ever called the Lord's Day?

    1 Corinthians 16:2 Expanded Bible (EXB)
    On the first day of every week [C Sunday], each one of you should put aside money ·as you have been blessed [or what you can afford; L whatever one prospers]. Save it up so you will not have to collect money after I come.

    upload_2019-11-23_12-34-52.jpeg


    17. That says that the first day of the week was ever sanctified and hallowed as a day of rest?
    18. That says that the Father or the Son (Jesus) rested on the first day of the week?
    19. That says that Jesus, Paul or any other of the apostles taught anyone to observe the first day of the week as the Sabbath?
    20. That calls the seventh day the “Jewish Sabbath” or one text that calls Sunday the “Christian Sabbath”?

    [​IMG]

    21. Telling man to keep the first day of the week holy or to worship or rest on the first day of the week?

    The Israelites were told not man
    Not even Adam, Noah and the patriarchs observe the Sabbath
    Need the rest - forced rest
    On their march in the wilderness
    The Israelites are the exclusive people ordered by God to observe the Sabbath
    until it was ABOLISHED

    22. Authorizing anyone to set aside God's Sabbath and observe any other day?

    23. Showing any of the apostles keeping the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

    24. Authorizing someone to set aside the fourth Commandment and observe any other day of the week?

    25. Where any apostle taught us to keep the first day of the week as the Sabbath?

    26. Declaring that the seventh day is no longer the Eternal Sabbath day?

    27. Where Sunday is now appointed to be kept as the New Testament Sabbath or holy day?

    [​IMG]
     
  19. 3rdAngel

    3rdAngel Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2019
    Messages:
    2,781
    Ratings:
    +178
    Religion:
    truth
    Rubbish! These are your words that are not God's Word and your only repeating yourself again. According to God's Word (not mine),

    GOD'S ISRAEL IN THE NEW COVEANNT ARE ALL THOSE WHO BELIEVE AND FOLLOW GOD'S WORD (The Church)

    There is no such thing as Jew or Greek anymore. All who believe and follow God's Word are one in Christ. Israel in the OLD COVENANT were those from the seed of Abraham. In the NEW COVENANT, if you are in Christ then you are Abrahams seed and heirs according to the promise...

    EPHESIANS 2:11-13 [11], Why remember, that you being in TIME PAST Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;[12], That AT THAT TIME [in the Past] YOU WERE WITHOUT CHRIST, BEING ALIENS FROM THE COMMONWEALTH OF ISRAEL, STRANGERS FROM THE COVENANT OF PROMISE, HAVING NO HOPE, AND WITHOUT GOD IN THE WORLD: [13], BUT NOW IN CHRIST JESUS, YOU WHO WERE FAR OFF ARE MADE NEAR BY THE BLOOD OF CHRIST.

    GALATIANS 3:28-29 [28], THERE IS NEITHER JEW NOR GREEK, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: FOR YOU ALL ONE IN CHRIST JESUS AND IF YOU BE CHRISTS, THEN YOU ARE ABRAHAM'S SEED FOR YOU ARE ALL ONE IN CHRIST JESUS [29], and IF YOU BE CHRISTS, THEN ARE YOU ABRAHAM'S SEED, AND HEIRS ACCORDING TO THE PROMISE.

    God's true ISRAEL in the NEW COVENANT are not by name only but all those in Christ. Those of the FLESH (sinful human nature) are not Abrahams seed but those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God in Christ are God's ISRAEL...

    ROMANS 9:6-8 [6], FOR THEY ARE NOT ALL ISRAEL WHICH ARE OF ISRAEL,: [7], NEITHER, BECAUSE THEY ARE THE SEED OF ABRAHAM, ARE THEY ALL CHILDREN: but in Isaac shall thy seed be called <Christ> [8], That is, THEY WHICH ARE THE CHILDREN OF THE FLESH, THESE ARE NOT THE CHILDREN OF GOD: BUT THE CHILDREN OF THE PROMISE <those who believe> ARE COUNTED FOR THE SEED.

    God's ISRAEL are all those in CHRIST that have been given a NEW HEART according to the NEW COVENANT promise...

    ROMANS 2:28-29 [28], FOR HE IS NOT A JEW WHICH IS ONE OUTWARDLY; NEITHER IS THAT CIRCUMCISION, WHICH IS OUTWARDS IN THE FLESH: [29], BUT HE IS A JEW WHICH IS ONE INWARDLY; and CIRCUMCISION IS OF THE HEART, IN THE SPIRIT, AND NOT IN THE LETTER; whose praise is not of men, but of God.

    In the NEW COVENANT all those in Christ are are God's ISRAEL...

    COLOSSIANS 3:11 [11], WHERE THERE IS NEITHER JEW NOR GREEK circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: BUT CHRIST IS ALL IN ALL.

    ROMANS 10:11-13 [11], For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed. [12], FOR THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN JEW OR GREEK: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. [13], FOR WHOSOEVER SHALL CALL UPON THE NAME OF THE LORD SHALL BE SAVED.

    The New Covenant is for God's Israel...

    EZEKIEL 36:26-27 [26], A NEW HEART WILL I GIVE YOU, AND A NEW SPIRIT WILL I PUT WITHIN YOU; AND I WILL TAKE AWAY THE STONY HEART OUT OF YOUR FLESH, AND GIVE YOU A HEART OF FLESH. [27], AND I WILL PUT MY SPIRIT WITHIN YOU, AND CAUSE YOU TO WALK IN MY STATUTES AND YOU SHALL KEEP MY JUDGEMENTS AND DO THEM.

    and again...

    JEREMIAH 31:33-34 [33], BUT THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL; After those days, says the LORD, I WILL PUT MY LAW IN THEIR INWARD PARTS,AND WRITE IT IN THEIR HEARTS; and will be their God, and they shall be my people. [34], And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, says the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

    Paul proclaims it here...

    HEBREWS 8:10-12 [10], BUT THIS IS THE COVENANT THAT I WILL MAKE WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL; After those days, says the LORD, I WILL PUT MY LAW IN THEIR INWARD PARTS, AND WRITE IT IN THEIR HEARTS; and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: [11], And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest. [12], For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

    The NEW COVENANT is for GOD'S ISRAEL which represent those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God’s WORD.

    If you are not part of GOD'S ISRAEL then you are not a part of the NEW COVENANT (Hebrews 8:10-12).

    ............

    God's ISRAEL is the name given by God to all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW his WORD. GENTILES are now grafted in. If you are not a part of the God's ISRAEL then you have no part in the NEW COVENANT.

    Now let's look at the meaning of the name that God gave to his people. The name "ISRAEL" ישׂראל; yiśrâ'êl means; "HE WILL RULE WITH GOD" God gave this name to his people and it means that they shall rule with God. Take a look at the following scriptures from REVELATION speaking of God's people.

    REVELATION 1:5-6 [5], And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. To him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood, [6], And HAS MADE US KINGS AND PRIESTS TO GOD AND HIS FATHER; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

    and again...

    REVELATION 5:10 And HAVE MADE US TO OUR GOD KINGS AND PRIESTS; AND WE SHALL REIGN ON THE EARTH.

    Peter speaking of God's people says it this way...

    1 PETER 2:9-10 [9], But you [God's people] are a chosen generation, A ROYAL PRIESTHOOD [KINGS AND PRIESTS], an holy nation, a peculiar people; that you should show forth the praises of him who has called you out of darkness into his marvelous light; [10], Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy.

    Sound familar? "ISRAEL" ישׂראל; yiśrâ'êl means; "HE WILL RULE WITH GOD" WHY?

    JESUS is our great HIGH PRIEST ministering on our behalf in the HEVENLY SANCTUARY *HEBREWS 4:14. JESUS is the KING of KINGS *REVELATIONS 17:14; 19:16

    HE WILL RULE WITH GOD WHICH IS THE MEANING OF "ISRAEL" is the name given to all those who BELIEVE and FOLLOW God's WORD because JESUS will make them to rule with him as PRIESTS and KINGS.

    Notice also in REVELATION 7:3-8 just before the judgements of God are poured out on the world God's people are sealed with God's Spirit and 144,000 come out of the 12 tribes of ISRAEL

    REVELATION 7:3-8 [3], Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God on their foreheads. [4], And I heard the number of them who were sealed: and there were sealed a hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of ISRAEL. [5], Of the tribe of JUDAH were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of REUBEN were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of GAD were sealed twelve thousand. [6], Of the tribe of ASHER were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Naphtali were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of MANESSAH were sealed twelve thousand. [7], Of the tribe of SIMEONwere sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of LEVI were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Issachar were sealed twelve thousand. [8], Of the tribe of ZEBULON were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of JOSEPH were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of BENJAMIN were sealed twelve thousand.

    Now you were saying? :)
     
  20. MJFlores

    MJFlores Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2017
    Messages:
    2,656
    Ratings:
    +415
    Religion:
    Iglesia Ni Cristo (Church of Christ)
    [​IMG]

    There are no more Jews [not to mention no more Israelites] and no more Greeks [Gentiles]
    I am Filipino and your nationality, I do not know.


    The new covenant is for the true Church - that I agree.
    If you are following the old covenant, what makes you? An obsolete religion?

    Romans 9:27 New International Version (NIV)
    Isaiah cries out concerning Israel:

    “Though the number of the Israelites be like the sand by the sea,
    only the remnant will be saved.


    only the remnant will be saved like 144,000

    Do you belong to the tribe of Judah?
    Reuben? Gad? Asher? Napthali? Manessah? Levi?

    [​IMG]
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
Loading...