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Featured The curse of the forbidden fruit.

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Jonathan Bailey, Aug 21, 2019.

  1. Jonathan Bailey

    Jonathan Bailey Well-Known Member

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    Considering getting back into the fold: coming home to Jesus in an Affirmed Church this time. Somewhere between an agnostic and an atheist. Questioning my faith and religion.
    Genesis 2:17 King James Version (KJV)
    17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

    Are we living people going to die in the flesh someday because of the original sins of Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden? Is that forbidden fruit the death curse of us all?

    Note that bible says for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

    God supposedly guaranteed that mankind would die upon eating the forbidden fruit but does that infer that God guaranteed immortality to mankind for otherwise keeping that original commandment?

    God never said that we'd live forever for leaving the forbidden fruit alone.

    Mankind had a choice between possibly living forever and absolutely dying. They chose sure death to the joy of undertakers, funeral homes, coffin builders, tombstone makers, crematories and graveyard owners.

    It's like I won't get a one-million dollar reward for not stealing but I will get jailed and/or fined if I'm caught and convicted of it.


     
  2. InChrist

    InChrist Free4ever

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    Humans probably would have lived forever without suffering the damage of sin had we listened to God, but the wrong choice was made. Thankfully, death is the result or the awful consequences of sin would go on forever. Instead, God offers a way out and an eternity free from sin and heartache.
     
    #2 InChrist, Aug 21, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2019
  3. SomeRandom

    SomeRandom Still learning to be wise

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    I always felt like the whole thing was a trap.

    Sure, in the metaphorical sense, I understand the message/lesson/theme.

    But seriously. An all powerful being creates man (presumably knowing full well the flaws and strengths, since he literally created them) and places a fruit in front of man like a shiny object. And then knowing full well that humans respond badly to temptation, tells Adam not to eat it. I mean that’s trolling 101 right there. Place a bone in front of the dog and then whack them over the about for eating it.
    I mean at least have the decency to explain the consequences incurred for disobedience. Hell this is a technique we even use on small children. Because how would a newly made Adam even understand the consequences or even the implications? For all intents and purposes him and Eve are but babes.

    I call shenanigans!
     
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  4. susanblange

    susanblange Active Member

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    Immortality is a spiritual concept. The physical beings of every soul (body) that God created is mortal. Sooner or later all will die. The spirit is what lives on after death and if you enter Heaven, it will be forever. If you go to Hell, eventually your spirit will be extinguished and you will cease to exist. Your destiny will be decided on Judgment Day, which is the day you die.
     
  5. Stanyon

    Stanyon WWMRD?

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    What kind of a sadist would come up with that choice?
     
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  6. Milton Platt

    Milton Platt Well-Known Member

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    so, an all knowing god created a being he knew would fail, and set them up to fail by providing the means to so so.
     
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  7. Skwim

    Skwim Veteran Member

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    Well, the story does single out A&E, so I think it's quite a leap to lay the curse on anyone else.

    Where is this said? After all, only A&E ate the fruit.

    I don't see him issuing his commandment to anyone else, so I don't see an implication of any kind.

    I don't see that as well.

    Ah, where is this written?

    .
     
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  8. TagliatelliMonster

    TagliatelliMonster Well-Known Member

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    We die because of the natural cycle and processes of biology and things like entropy.
    Not because of make-belief bronze age stories.
     
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  9. 1213

    1213 Well-Known Member

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    God also did not say that people die anyway. Therefore, we could assume people would have lived eternally. Also, if not, there would not have been any reason to say the fruit leads to death.

    And actually, in more literal version it is said:

    and of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, thou dost not eat of it, for in the day of thine eating of it--dying thou dost die.'
    Gen. 2:17

    In other words, with death you shall die. This “life” is the first death.
     
  10. Twilight Hue

    Twilight Hue The gentle embrace of twilight has become my guide

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    How could Adam and Eve ever have known?

    They didn't know what good and evil was.
     
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  11. Jayhawker Soule

    Jayhawker Soule <yawn> ignore </yawn>
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    It's a remarkable, perhaps even elegant, piece of etiological lore grappling with the problem of discord.
     
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  12. JJ50

    JJ50 Well-Known Member

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    The creation story in the Bible is a fairy tale, imo.
     
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  13. Howard Is

    Howard Is Lucky Mud

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    It makes sense to me.

    Amanita muscaria mushrooms look like an apple as they first appear, before opening into a cap.

    The Essenes used amanita as a sacrament.

    It is the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil.

    Without the scrolls of the Essenes, the Roman psyops version is just bewildering nonsense.

    Without the experience to which the symbols refer, even the scrolls are useless.
     
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  14. Good-Ole-Rebel

    Good-Ole-Rebel Well-Known Member

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    That they didn't know good and evil was immaterial. They just needed to obey the command.

    Good-Ole-Rebel
     
  15. Good-Ole-Rebel

    Good-Ole-Rebel Well-Known Member

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    ...and provided for their redemption.

    Good-Ole-Rebel
     
  16. JJ50

    JJ50 Well-Known Member

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    No one should obey a crazy command like that
     
  17. Milton Platt

    Milton Platt Well-Known Member

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    It is immoral for a god to create a system that will condemn the vast majority of humanity to suffering and fill their world with sorrow just so it could provide redemption for a select few.
     
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  18. Good-Ole-Rebel

    Good-Ole-Rebel Well-Known Member

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    Morality and immorality are mans terms. God is righteous in all He does. As I have said before, if He saves 3,000, He is righteous in doing so. If He slays 3,000, He is righteous in doing so.

    Good-Ole-Rebel
     
  19. Good-Ole-Rebel

    Good-Ole-Rebel Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure why you call it crazy.

    It was important that there was no reason to obey the command other then simple obedience. They would not have understood death as it hasn't occurred yet. So they just needed to obey because God said so.

    Good-Ole-Rebel
     
  20. Twilight Hue

    Twilight Hue The gentle embrace of twilight has become my guide

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    I think it's a curse for people to take that literally.
     
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